Cabot disputing Statute Barred status - what next?

[harrystottle]

Hi All

 

Could do with some advice as to what to do next…

 

I recently sent a Statute Barred Letter to Cabot who had written to me out of the blue claiming that I owed nearly 6 grand on an old M&S personal Loan.

 

They replied promptly enough, but they have disputed my assertion that the debt was statute barred, claiming that M&S issued a default notice on the account in July 2003 and therefore the limitation period runs from that date.

 

The odd thing is, I checked my Credit File and as far as I can see the account was never defaulted, just marked closed/settled. The last appearance it made on my Credit File was back in January 2002 so to my mind the debt should be barred.

 

Could Cabot be trying to bullsh*t me (surely they wouldn't stoop so low!?) or do they know something I don't?

 

Any advice as to where to go from here would be much appreciated

 

 

Thanks in advance

 

H

[reallymadwoman]

So far as I am aware, the 6 years runs from when you last made any payment or acknowledged the debt in writing. Hopefully someone with a definite answer will post soon.

[ScabHunter]

So far as I am aware, the 6 years runs from when you last made any payment or acknowledged the debt in writing. Hopefully someone with a definite answer will post soon.

 

Exactly right.

 

They replied promptly enough, but they have disputed my assertion that the debt was statute barred, claiming that M&S issued a default notice on the account in July 2003 and therefore the limitation period runs from that date.

 

Even if they had, it wouldn't. The payment or acknowledgment has to come from you.

 

They replied promptly enough, but they have disputed my assertion that

The odd thing is, I checked my Credit File and as far as I can see the account was never defaulted, just marked closed/settled. The last appearance it made on my Credit File was back in January 2002 so to my mind the debt should be barred.

 

Exactly.

 

Could Cabot be trying to bullsh*t me

 

That would appear to be a fairly accurate summary of the situation, yes.

 

Crapbot are totally insane. They will never give up no matter how hopeless the situation. There is one case on this forum where they have invented an imaginary payment, which they are totally unable to prove, and which as in your case does not show up on any credit file, but they are still going to court with it.

 

Be prepared for a very long war of attrition with these lunatics. They simply never accept when they are wrong.

 

SH

[pt2537]

Utter rubbish

 

The cause of action IS NOT when a default notice is issued, rather at the point where a lender would have the right to sue

 

to suggest as Cabsnot are that a default notice MUST be issued first before the limitation clock starts would mean that no lender would EVER ISSUE a default notice again thus ensuring the Limitation clock would never start ticking

 

I did have a couple of case on limitation, i will have a dig around

[harrystottle]

I've just had a recollection...I may have gone to a debt counsellor around that time and they may have contacted them on my behalf offering token payments (which to my shame I never made) but as Crap Pot haven't mentioned this neither shall I (hope they don't read this tho!)

 

Even so, would it be worth floating off a CCA request, or asking for proof of the default notice?

[pt2537]

NO

 

If they assert that the debt is not statute barred, ask for proof of last payment under the account

 

they should be able to prove this easily

[harrystottle]

ok will do thanks for the advice :o)

[harrystottle]

Does anyone know if there are templates for letters to use in these circumstances, or perhaps one that could be adapted to suit?

 

Cheers

 

H

[pt2537]

a rather helpful case here is Swansea City Council v Glass. - [1992] 2 All ER 680

 

it established that the cause of action accrues when the person can sue, that is the point when he can commence a claim for failing to meet a contractual obligation, not when the person serves a notice demanding payment

 

in this case, it would be when you missed your second payment most likely that the cause of action arose, if it was the case that the cause arises at the point when a default is served then the limitation period would never start cos no lender would ever issue a default notice

[harrystottle]

Hi All

 

Just wanted to get some feedback on the letter I'm about to send them which I've adapted from the Statute Barred template (almost identical to the SB letter I sent them in the first place - some people won't be told!!!

 

Here goes:

 

Dear Crap Pot (okay I changed that!)

 

Account Number xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

 

You have contacted me regarding the above account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by me.

 

As I stated in my last letter to your colleague, Mr Duncan, it is my contention that this debt is now statute barred under the Limitation Act 1980 Section 5

 

I would point out that the above legislation states that “an action founded on simple contract shall not be brought after the expiration of six years from the date on which the cause of action accrued.”

 

The cause of the action, in this instance, was not the issuing of a default notice as you have stated, but rather would have been from the date of the last payment.

 

The last payment of this alleged debt was made over six years ago and no further acknowledgement or payment has been made since that time.

 

I reiterate; unless you can provide evidence of payment or written contact from me in the relevant period under Section 5 of the Limitation Act, I suggest that you are no longer able to take any court action against me to recover the alleged amount claimed.

 

I therefore await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed and that no further contact will be made concerning the above account after that last letter.

 

I look forward to your reply.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

 

Harry Stottle (changed that too!!!!)

[ScabHunter]

An excellent letter Harry, easily understood by a literate person.

 

It will be interesting to see if anyone at Crapbot can grasp the meaning of it.

 

SH

[ODC]

This is bog standard Bovine Excrement from the empty heads at Crapbot. Why can they not just admit defeat. They know they are talking nonsense and even they should be aware of Stated Cases proving they are talking out of their downward pointing rear orifices. Maybe they believe if you repeat a lie often enough it will become true (well it works for the Labour Government). If you had a choice of who to believe between Paul and Ken Maynard who would you believe.

 

 

I rest my case

[harrystottle]

Splendid! Thanks for those comments - I will fire it off today...

 

You may notice I'm being polite to them at the moment - I'll save the vitriol for my reply to their next insult to the intelligence

 

Merry Christmas everyone (except those bum holes at Crap Pot, if you're reading this I heartily wish you the Christmas you deserve)

 

Ho ho ho

 

H

[reallymadwoman]

If they contact you again with anything other than 'file closed' ask for their complaints procedure.

[ODC]

One would think that such a professional bunch as Maynards Misfits would have a better grasp of the LAW

[harrystottle]

If they contact you again with anything other than 'file closed' ask for their complaints procedure.

 

yes good idea! I'll keep you posted...

[ODC]

Its hard to see what else they can do. If they try to con you into thinking that there is actually 'legal' action they can take then they leave themselves wide open to an investigation under CPUTR 2008.

[harrystottle]

watch this space!!!

[harrystottle]

Just received this:

 

"This is your last opportunity to agree to a suitable repayment plan, before we move your account to our Pre Litigation (sic) Department"

 

Then they urge me to get in touch on their 0845 no etc etc

 

Any ideas what to hit them with now (although I fear it will be yet another wasted stamp!!!)

 

From the posts before I'm guessing complaints procedure, threat of investigation under CPUTR 2008 - any more suggestions gratefully received :o)

 

Cheers

 

H

[reallymadwoman]

I would assume this has crossed in the post with your letter, and ignore accordingly.

 

However, keep it safe and if you get another one, then it's time to make that complaint.

[harrystottle]

actually just checked the date and you're right - they sent it out on Christmas Eve - bless!

 

I have just cobbled up a reply to them which might come in handy if they do send another similar letter and would appreciate some feedback (esp on the CPUTR thingy)

 

Here goes:

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Mr Crap Pot

 

Account Number xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

You have contacted me again regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by me.

 

As I have already stated in my previous correspondence with yourself and your colleague, Ms Emma Robertson, it is my contention that this debt is now statute barred under the Limitation Act 1980 Section 5

 

I have asked you to provide evidence of payment or written contact from me in the relevant period under Section 5 of the Limitation Act, and this you have failed to do.

 

I therefore suggest that you are not in a position to provide this evidence and therefore no longer able to take any court action against me to recover the alleged amount claimed.

 

By attempting to imply that there is some legal action you can take to recover this alleged debt, I also suggest that you are now in breach of CPUTR 2008 etc (can somebody help with the chapter and verse here pls?)

 

In closing, I now request a copy of your complaints procedure. I feel that your deliberate failure to address the reasonable points that I have raised in my previous correspondence, allied with your continued, unreasonable attempts to press me for payment of this alleged debt, amount to harassment.

 

I would further inform you that, if this harassment continues, it is my intention to report this matter to the Financial Ombudsman Service and the Office of Fair Trading.

 

For your information I would also inform you that I have no intention of discussing this matter with you on the telephone, as, in the circumstances, I feel that this would be inappropriate.

 

 

I look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully, etc

 

 

=========================================================

[harrystottle]

I thought I had already posted this so apologies if it appears twice

 

firstly yes you are right RMW I just checked the date on the letter and it was sent out on Xmas Eve - how nice of them :o)

 

I have just cobbled together a letter that I will send to them if they persist in this nonsense (which if the past is anyting to go by, they surely will)

 

I could do with some feedback (particularly on the CPUTR bit)

 

Here it is:

 

Dear Mr Crap Pot

 

Account Number xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

You have contacted me again regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by me.

 

As I have already stated in my previous correspondence with yourself and your colleague, Ms Emma Robertson, it is my contention that this debt is now statute barred under the Limitation Act 1980 Section 5

 

I have asked you to provide evidence of payment or written contact from me in the relevant period under Section 5 of the Limitation Act, and this you have failed to do.

 

I therefore suggest that you are not in a position to provide this evidence and therefore no longer able to take any court action against me to recover the alleged amount claimed.

 

By attempting to imply that there is some legal action you can take to recover this alleged debt, I also suggest that you are now in breach of CPUTR 2008 etc (can somebody help with the chapter and verse here pls?)

 

In closing, I now request a copy of your complaints procedure. I feel that your deliberate failure to address the reasonable points that I have raised in my previous correspondence, allied with your continued, unreasonable attempts to press me for payment of this alleged debt, amount to harassment.

 

I would further inform you that, if this harassment continues, it is my intention to report this matter to the Financial Ombudsman Service and the Office of Fair Trading.

 

For your information I would also inform you that I have no intention of discussing this matter with you on the telephone, as, in the circumstances, I feel that this would be inappropriate.

 

 

I look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully, etc

[harrystottle]

sorry disregard my last :oP

[harrystottle]

Hi All

 

Just redrafted my response letter as (predictably enough) Crap Pot have sent me another copy of the 'Your account is not statute-barred' letter (the one that states that a default notice was issued in July 2003 and the limitation runs from that date)

 

I would appreciate any feedback on this letter (especially chapter and verse on the CPUTR - not sure if I've got that right...)

 

Here goes (with comments in brackets):

 

Dear Mrs Crap Pot

 

Thank you for your letter of 02 Jan 2009 regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by me.

 

As I have already stated to you, and your colleague Mr Duncan, in my letters of 22 and 12 Dec 2008 respectively, it is my firm belief that this debt is now statute barred under the Limitation Act 1980 Section 5.

 

Your response to these letters has merely been either to threaten me with court action or to re-iterate your assertion that the alleged debt is not statue barred because of the date of a default notice issued by XXX with respect to the alleged debt.

 

Again it seems that I must point out to you the fact that this default notice has no bearing on the status of the debt under the relevant legislation for reasons which I have already set out in previous correspondence as referenced above.

 

I have twice asked you to provide evidence of payment or written contact from me in the relevant period under Section 5 of the Limitation Act, but it appears that you are unable or unwilling to do this.

 

I therefore state once more that you are no longer in a position to take any court action against me to recover the amount claimed as the alleged debt is statute barred.

 

[MAYBE I SHOULD PAINT THEM A NICE PICTURE!!!]

 

Moreover, by attempting to imply that there is some legal action you can take to recover this debt, I also suggest that you are now in breach of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 Section 8.11 .......(is this correct?).........

 

I now require you to send me a copy of your complaints procedure, as I feel that your continued attempts to press me for payment of this alleged debt, allied with your complete failure to acknowledge and adequately address the points I have raised in the letters I have sent to you, constitute harassment, as defined by CPUTR 2008, and again places you in breach of these regulations.

 

I would further inform you that if this harassment continues, it is my intention to refer this matter to the Financial Ombudsman Service and the Office of Fair Trading.

 

I await the requested document and/or your written confirmation that this matter is now closed and that no further contact will be made concerning the above account after that final letter.

 

I look forward to your reply.

 

(and may the fleas of a thousand camels infest your armpits etc etc)

 

 

 

Any suggestions for bits to put in/take out will be much appreciated.

 

Happy New Year to you all

 

H

[ScabHunter]

Excellent letter harry, far more polite than they deserve, but I suppose you have to humour the little children.

 

As you will have noticed, even when you break data down neatly into one syllable words, and repeat them very slowly indeed, it still takes rather a long time for any light bulb to switch on in the Crapbot head.

 

They live in their own fantasy world, with their own laws, customs and practices, probably behind the arched window. The laws which govern the rest of the British Isles hold no interest or meaning for them.

 

As they don't seem to think they are part of the British legal or economic system, it is tempting to send them the amounts they ask for in Monopoly money. It would have as much relevance.

 

The trouble is that they will keep coming at you, like the crazed lunatics they truly are, apparently believing in the delusions and fairy tale world which they have created for themselves. It doesn't matter how many times you tell them that white is white; in their own warped and clouded mind it will always remain black.

 

To avoid donating your entire income to the Royal Mail, you will at some point need to include phrases such as "No further correspondence will be entered into" or "This is my final response." This is will not stop the infant school stories being sent to you, but it will at least reduce your expenses in having to respond to them.

 

As with a psychotic criminal in deepest Broadmoor, the behaviour of Crapbot is totally impossible to predict. They have even been known to drag statute barred debts into court.

 

In a case as blatant as this, all you can do is fire off the complaints. Having already told them once that the alleged debt is statute barred, you should go to the OFT immediately as you should not have to tell them twice. Your letter quite rightly asks for a copy of their complaints procedure, which gives you a possible route to the Ombudsman if they don't satisfy your complaint.

 

They will not bother to supply, or even mention, a complaints procedure in their next output of written diarrhoea. That does not matter. The next letter you send them can contain a complaint, be headed "Formal Complaint", and be enclosed in an envelope marked "Complaint". This would lead anyone with more intelligence than a Crapbot employee to surmise that you have submitted a complaint.

 

This one could run for ever. If it does, make sure they are wasting their stationery and postage money, and not yours. Email is the recommended way of answering Crapbot insanity, if you deem it worth answering at all.

 

SH