Debt following death.

[sillygirl1]

Nuthatch, it must be difficult going through what you are on your won - but you have this site behind you and all our varied experiences...

 

The worse we had was when my gran died, she was in sheltered accommodation (own flat but warden controlled) and the warden was really great - all her bills had been paid the day before she died and we had a week to clear the flat (we could have had longer but it wasn't needed). The electricity board however kept writing to my sister (who was executor) and asking for the bill to be paid up to the end of the month - which she didn't need as she only had two days to pay! They asked for her forwarding address - so my sister wrote the plot no and the address of the cemetery and they wrote there!!! In the end we asked for a person who could use sign language to come to a meeting with the local MP as they clearly couldn't understand spoken or written language (one of my sister in laws teaches sign language) and that put a stop to it.

 

There are heartless bureaucrats out there - and there are some nice ones, but the majority are 'just doing their jobs' and churn out their rubbish.

 

One bit of advice I was given when my mum died unexpectedly was "Nobody has the right to tell you how and when you can do your grieving, it is an individual thing and cannot be regulated by law or custom."

 

Hopefully things will become easier over the months ahead, the light at the end of the tunnel isn't really there in some cases, its just your eyes getting used to the darkness.

[The GodMother]

You have to laugh at how these company deal with the greaving familys.

[JonCris]

All the more reason to stuff em at every opportunity

[The GodMother]

nuthatch.

 

Next time someone speaks to u like that just thank them and bid them a nice day then hang up.

 

U are well within your rights to tell them were to go and to refuse to deal with them.

[nuthatch]

Ok. I have just printed out 2 copies. One for Egg and one for the file.

I have not signed it, just put a squiggle and will send it off RD tomorrow.

 

I have had a little panic. I did actually send them a copy of my husband's will which does state I am the only beneficiary.It was only one page...we haven't got much.

My 2 sons are named as beneficiaries in the event of both of us dying. I have blanked out their addresses though.

Is that a big mistake on my part?

[The GodMother]

Not really it is helpful to know u are the beneficary. You could always put it down to u not knowing any better.

[JonCris]

You or you children being beneficiaries doesn't make you liable for the debts. Your deceased husbands estate is liable for any enforceable debts

[The GodMother]

and with no money i the estate then there is not much they can do anyway.

[nuthatch]

Have received a reply from Robinson Way re my CCA request on the HFC debt (Marbles CC)

I have been checking back through recordes I have of this debt which you may be interested in.

Had been paying via CCCS since beg 2006 on DMP.

 

19.03.08 Letter from HFC advising that a Default Notice had been issued and agreeing to accept reduced payments which was accepted 22.10.07 and to review account on 1.04.08.

 

26.03.08 Letter from HFC agreeing to extend DMP.

 

15.04.08 Letter from CCCS advising that HFC had notified them that they were no longer dealing with the debt and so they would hold onto the DMP money until they knew where to send it.

 

15.04.08 Letter from Robinson Way (Formal demand for payment).

"As we have now purchased the debt we are authorised to recover the full amount due. This is a formal notice of intended court action we intend to take unless you pay, or agree an arrangement with us" etc

 

17.04.08 Letter from Robinson Way to say they had purchased the debt

"and are wholly responsible for administering your account noted above. We note you are paying through a debt management company etc....."

 

Letter received today dated 13.08.08 from Robinson Way

 

We refer to your recent correspondence requesting a signed agreement under the CCA 1974.

We have requested a signed agreement from our client and this will be forwarded to you as soon as possible. Please be advised that your account is on delay in the meantime.

As a simple assignee from the original creditor we have acquired the rights but not the duties of the creditor as defined 189(1) of the CCA 1974 and accordingly are entitled to pursue the customer for the monies that remain due by reason of section 136 of the Law of Property Act 1925.

 

Yours sincerely etc

 

Don't understand this. From reading around CAG forums, I thought that when a DCA purchased a debt, they took over all responsiblities?

Edited August 30, 2008 by nuthatch

[TheChancellor]

Here's a link to the Act quoted.One for the CAG Legal Eagle's !

 

 

High Court Judgment Template

[TheChancellor]

Here's a link to the Act quoted.One for the CAG Legal Eagle's !

 

 

High Court Judgment Template

 

...or maybe this one -

 

Law of Property Act 1925 (c.20)

 

Both heavy going.

[The GodMother]

u could always send them this

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-1665051.html

 

Some of it is not applicable but most of it is.

 

this is the relivant part

 

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

Edited August 18, 2008 by The GodMother
adding stuff.

[JonCris]

Yeah they are attempting, not for the 1st time & mistakenly to hide behind the 1923 property act

 

Write back & tell them the CCA the OFT nor LACORS agrees with them & that they have the same duties under the CCA as the original creditor. Furthermore with regard to the duties AND liabilities you'll rely on Dimond v Lovell amongst others

[PriorityOne]

I'll be very surprised if you get an enforceable Marbles Agreement from the HFC archives Nuthatch.... because I read on here ages ago that HFC haven't got any; either because they destroyed them or because they weren't enforceable in the first place.

 

I also suspect Robbers Way may have bought a bulk of these toilet roll accounts:p... which is why they're coming out with garbage about rights and responsibilities, etc. I've been helping another member on a different thread with RW and HFC Marbles account.... and also had one myself, which was sold to Cabot some time ago. You may get an Application Form sent through.... but that should be all they have.

 

If that does prove to be the case..... then they can just bog off. Stupid bergers....

[JonCris]

They could only sue the estate which won't impress the court & the Judge can't exactly ask the alleged debtor if he agrees that he owes the debt can he?

[The GodMother]

well that would be different.

[nuthatch]

The debt I have CCA'd Robinson Way on is actually one of my debt's, not my husband's. I haven't CCA'd any of my husband's debts yet...just asked Egg for proof that they have the right to collect the money.

 

I don't want things to get too complicated at this stage as I can't get my head round it.

 

I have bought a pile of files and am going to start putting things in seperate creditor order.

Now, that is a simple job my brain can process

 

I did attempt to start reading the link posted by The Chancellor (thank you) but could feel my eyes glazing over.

The relevant piece posted by The Godmother I can understand. So should I just write back to RW quoting that bit?

 

And JonChris....who are Dimond and Lovell? I will Google it to try and find out so silly question really.

I have now read this....3 times...and I still don't really understand it

 

In a perverse way, dealing with these people is helping my grief. I need someone to be mad at and I have had so much help from friends, relatives and the Medical Profession, I can't find a target there.

And as my DH tried so hard to get us out of debt and worried so much about it, these creditors are going to get the full blast of my anger using all the combined expertise of CAG.

Thank you all so much.

Edited August 19, 2008 by nuthatch

[The GodMother]

no need to let RW no of there obligations they should know them. good on u for buying the folders. If u want to have a go at the dcas then u go for it.

[PriorityOne]

Agree with GM.... don't bother writing back at this stage. They've not sent you anything yet anyway.

 

This "rights & responsibilities" claptrap appears to be a fairly recent Robbers Way tactic. Cabot used to do it and seem to have given up on it now, as I've not seen it posted up on here recently and they didn't event try quoting it to me a few months ago either.

 

Just file the RW letter away for now and see what they send next.

 

It's good to hear that you're getting angry Nuthatch... it needs to come out and I can't think of a more deserving bunch of t*ssers than these guys. DCAs are an excellent target to get mad at... because they care for no-one.

[JonCris]

Nuthatch sorry if I appear a little blunt but there's now't they can do about your husbands debts that you need bother about just yet.

 

On the other hand there's plenty they can do about yours so it's important that you start the process of disputing your debts now rather than wait for it all to build up.

 

Better slowly slowy catchee monkey rather than waiting until you HAVE to do something thereby causing you more grief

[PriorityOne]

Fair comment JC.... am just worried about over-burdening Nuthatch though.

[nuthatch]

As long as you lead be by the nose and tell me what to do I will do what you say.

I will tell you if my brain seizes.

 

I was supposed to be getting an email from the CCCS this week about my DMP review but have heard nothing yet.

When they do contact me, should I say I have CCA'd 2 of my creditors and if they don't reply by Friday they are out of time as it is more than 12+2 days I calculate?

[JonCris]

Yes but don't expect to much from CCCS. They have the mistaken belief that no matter how your treated by the creditor YOU have a moral obligation to pay.

 

Its' also worth remembering that whilst a charity much of their 'funding' comes form the finance industry. So before confirming anything or giving any suggested undertaking come back here for unbiased advice

[The GodMother]

here here JC

[overdone]

Yes but don't expect to much from CCCS. They have the mistaken belief that no matter how your treated by the creditor YOU have a moral obligation to pay.

 

Its' also worth remembering that whilst a charity much of their 'funding' comes form the finance industry.

 

That explains a thing or two. We do not normally ask the pheasant to award the prize for the best shot. Lots of financial institutions recommend c.c.c.s over citizens advice b.