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    • Is the letter headed Letter of Claim/before Claim or similar? If not, it sounds like more of the threatogram chain. If you're not sure, post up an anonymised copy of the letter and we'll check. HB
    • So guess what, we have received a final demand letter for £100. It states if payment is not made by 11/06 they will have no option but to forward the case to their litigation dept with a view to commence County Court Proceedings. So just wondering if anyone has any advice. Do we ignore this? or do we need to take action? Thanks 
    • hi dx, thanks for helping just re-reading everything this morning and I must have missed this one from uncle in his thread "What you should not do, is not contact the Banks and simply default on payments. "  are you in disagreement with this based on your last sentence?
    • Thanks for the reply and clarification, that might just explain why in my case contact has pretty much ceased. Though with such companies it doesn't mean they won't ever threaten to return to court as a tool to force one's hand if they feel they are not self informed on their chances etc.  But concerning how last year they tried to use the CCJ to get a charging order and the court granted an intirum order on our mortgage using the CCJ that would have been a good 2-3 months beyond the 6 years, should the court not have checked the age of the CCJ in the first case or would they always grant an interim order simply off the back of a CCJ being produced without even checking the age of it?.  Had I not defended that action at the time they may well have got a default using a CCJ older than 6 years which could be a concern going forwards. At the time when I contacted the court to question the paperwork for a final order application the clerk suggested people don't get informed when companies apply for interim charging orders, they are automatic if a claimant has a CCJ and people only get contacted once a date for a final order application goes through. kind of begs the question if such companies can continue a seemingly backdoor method to attempt default action if un-defended if the initial application doesn't need to check the age of a CCJ?.
    • Hello!  Wondering if someone can help with this.  I suspect not but worth a go.  I appreciate the "contract is with the seller" line, which is what Evri has fed me but wanted to see if someone with experience in these things could suggest anything else I could do here.  I appreciate there are many topics about lost parcels - My parcels weren't lost, until the driver walked up to my door with them and then decided to make them lost/stolen... I'll summarise what has happened.  Wednesday of last week - Evri delivery driver stole / walked off with 3 of my parcels.  -  Arrived outside my properly, took photos (3 separate photos as its 3 separate deliveries) of the tops of the parcels (pointlessly zoomed in on just the labels, couldn't see anything else, other than a small piece of the pavement and a little weed, which doubly confirms it was outside my door as I can see the same plant), marked the order as delivered and walked off with them.  He's marked on the Evri GPS marked that he was outside.   -  3 different deliveries, from the same company (same boxes etc.), but 3 separate tracking numbers. -  Went through the Evri bot which opened a case on each tracking number.  I then phoned them and left a voicemail explaining what had happened. -  24 hours later had a canned response asking me if the packages had turned up and to check around etc..  I responded explaining again what happened and that they've definitely been taken. -  4 days later,  this morning, I get a response telling me to ask the merchant to refund me. I've responded to this message with a long email, repeating what I said, that I believe the driver has stolen these packages and that he took those suspicious top down shots of the packages, marked them as delivered without ringing or knocking etc.  I've said that I expect them to investigate further, but I gather they won't. In my several messages to them initially and later, I told them I don't care about a refund and wanted the parcels.  They contain some sentimental stuff, nothing of high monetary value, hence me going to this trouble.  I only paid £25 for the contents. I did contact the merchant when this first happened and they asked me to wait a few days.  They ended up refunding me despite me asking them not to and that I wanted them to escalate it with Evri because this appears to be a case of theft.  They didn't seem bothered - Refunded me and told me to go back to Evri and escalate it with them? So - Is there any way to compel Evri to conduct a proper investigation with this driver?  Search for my parcels? I have quite a lot of deliveries handled by Evri (not out of choice) - They used to have a fantastic chap and I rarely had any issues.  He has been replaced by a new guy and I believe the route is handled by this same guy who I believe has taken my packages.  Naturally, I fear this is going to happen again in the future if no investigation occurs. Appreciate any assistance - Thanks for reading. Al.  
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

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      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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HFO claimform - old Morgan Stanley Card Debt **WON**


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Excellent IGNM! This is what the Cabot people came up against because the assignment instruments were copies contained in a book debt transfer. Although obiter it could be cited at disclosure and in a Part 18 request - don't you think?

 

Best - Richard.

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Does a book debt transfer amount to a valid assignment - depends on what the documernts say.

 

Court of Appeal obiter actually carries a lot of weight in the County Court so it should be cited.

 

I personally wouldn't use Part 18 to try and get a copy of the actual assignment - use CPR 31.14 - it specifically requires disclosure of any document mentioned in any claim form. witness statements etc

 

As an example if you just wanted them to answer a question - say asking the date of assignment that is what I would generally use Part 18 for IF HOWEVER you wanted the document I'd generally use 31.14

If I've helped feel free to add to my reputation.

 

I am not a Practising Lawyer. My comments are my opinion only. You should not rely upon those comments and should always take your own professional advice from a practising Solicitor or Barrister

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Back from my hearing.

Application for permission to appeal granted.

 

Well done BA. Now we can all help with the appeal itself if you like.

Arrow Global/MBNA - Discontinued and paid costs

HFO/Morgan Stanley (Barclays) - Discontinued and paid costs

HSBC - Discontinued and paid costs

Nationwide - Ran for cover of stay pending OFT case 3 yrs ago

RBS/Mint - Nothing for 4 yrs after S78 request

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The Judge recomended the appeal be heared by a chancery Judge who would have more knowledge of credit law.

 

I made him aware of s127, which he looked up and I quoted Wilson v FCT.

 

In general the judge was understanding and listened to my points unlike the previous hearing.

 

He still raised the moral argument though.

US President Barack Obama referred to Ugland House as the biggest building in the world or the biggest tax SCA* in the world.

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Excellent...that is seriously well done...and of course we'll all help out - did he give any directions - presumably you've got to serve the other side.

 

Just out of interest which court is it in?

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I am not a Practising Lawyer. My comments are my opinion only. You should not rely upon those comments and should always take your own professional advice from a practising Solicitor or Barrister

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Excellent result Broken Arrow. Sounds like this was a fairer judge than the last. I do wonder if the events of the past six months (bankers, banks, greed and devastation) has given these DJs a different insight. One can but hope.

 

Re the moral argument though - courts only deal in points of law. Don't they?

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Whooo hoooo! Made my day :D

 

Quite right Rhia - courts deal in law, not morals. As if HFO had any morals...whose morals are in question, I wonder?

 

Well done BA. Makes the first judge look like a bit of a monkey. Incidentally, a deputy district judge was sacked the other day - the first one in 30 years! Talk about a safe job!

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Excellent...that is seriously well done...and of course we'll all help out - did he give any directions - presumably you've got to serve the other side.

 

Just out of interest which court is it in?

 

Leeds

US President Barack Obama referred to Ugland House as the biggest building in the world or the biggest tax SCA* in the world.

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Leeds

 

I'm in Sheffield - who was the Judge who did the permission to appeal.

 

If you post the date of the appeal, assuming I'm free, I'll come over and provide a bit of moral support

If I've helped feel free to add to my reputation.

 

I am not a Practising Lawyer. My comments are my opinion only. You should not rely upon those comments and should always take your own professional advice from a practising Solicitor or Barrister

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Well, we need to get all the CAG big guns onto this to make sure it's watertight and that any 'moral' issues get blown out of the water. Look forward to another battle in the war against the vermin!

 

(Sorry, IGNM, didn't mean your 'moral' support!)

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Whooo hoooo! Made my day :D

 

 

Well done BA. Makes the first judge look like a bit of a monkey. Incidentally, a deputy district judge was sacked the other day - the first one in 30 years! Talk about a safe job!

 

That's unusual - although they do actually get rid of Deputy DJ's - a Deputy is only on a fixed term contract - its' not unknown for contracts not to be renewed but to sack one - do you know why? If so do tell

If I've helped feel free to add to my reputation.

 

I am not a Practising Lawyer. My comments are my opinion only. You should not rely upon those comments and should always take your own professional advice from a practising Solicitor or Barrister

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The Judge recomended the appeal be heared by a chancery Judge who would have more knowledge of credit law.

 

I made him aware of s127, which he looked up and I quoted Wilson v FCT.

 

In general the judge was understanding and listened to my points unlike the previous hearing.

 

He still raised the moral argument though.

 

Well done BA. Don't worry about the 'moral' argument. This is a court of law - and Lord Hoffman's speech on 'unfair enrichment' will deal with the moral point.

Arrow Global/MBNA - Discontinued and paid costs

HFO/Morgan Stanley (Barclays) - Discontinued and paid costs

HSBC - Discontinued and paid costs

Nationwide - Ran for cover of stay pending OFT case 3 yrs ago

RBS/Mint - Nothing for 4 yrs after S78 request

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Quotes from the Daily Hansard Parliamentary Debate regarding Debt Collection and the Consumer Credit Act on 22 April 2009 beginning at column 338.

At column 341 Mr Andrew Mackinlay (Thurrock) (Lab) states:

The industry is rotten to the core, whether it is in-house recovery and collection, or where agents are used, or where the debt has been sold.” [my emphasis added]

At column 342 The Minister for Trade, Development and Consumer Affairs (Mr. Gareth Thomas) states:

“The OFT would expect the debt collection agency concerned to have checked the accuracy of the client data details that it received from the creditor or agency, and, where possible, to have obtained a copy of the original consumer credit agreement.” [my emphasis added]

See the original Hansard publication on the link below:

House of Commons Hansard Debates for 22 Apr 2009 (pt 0019)

HTH

Regards – Richard.

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I don't know what I'm doing then...I'll check when I get home...if I'm free I'll come over to Leeds - what time are you up

Edited by I've got no money

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I am not a Practising Lawyer. My comments are my opinion only. You should not rely upon those comments and should always take your own professional advice from a practising Solicitor or Barrister

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Have you been orderes to file a skeleton - even if you haven't as an LIP you'd get away with filing one - likewise doing an amended defence...

 

We need to come up with something good - and we will

If I've helped feel free to add to my reputation.

 

I am not a Practising Lawyer. My comments are my opinion only. You should not rely upon those comments and should always take your own professional advice from a practising Solicitor or Barrister

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