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    • An update to this case as I’ve not been on in a while.    I am still awaiting a charging decision in the case. The two police officers involved have said their personal belief is a section 47 ABH charge is the most likely outcome but this isn’t a sure thing of course.    The EA certificate from the issuing court has now lapsed. The court have refused to recertify him until they’ve had a hearing in to the case, and the district judge has issued orders to surrender all evidence, footage, photos etc.    I have done so promptly.    the EA, not so much . Equita have claimed they cannot provide his bodycam footage as the camera he was wearing is the EA personal one not one of theirs.   the EA has claimed he has asked Equita and the police for the footage as he claims he doesn’t have it.    the police have confirmed they didn’t seize his camera and they don’t have it.    so they are basically pointing the finger at each other all the while failing to comply with the district judges order to provide all evidence they intend to rely on at the rescheduled hearing.    The district judge has stated the hearing for his certification will NOT be the hearing for my complaint as there is no charge as of yet, and just as to whether he should be recertified or not.    I’m not 100% on why that can’t be done at the time, but I’m not about to question a judge…..      
    • Thanks FTMDave, I like the cut of your jib - I'll go with that and obtain proof of postage. Encouraging that NPE have never followed through and seem to blowing hot air, let's see where they go after this   Regards
    • Please see my comments in orange within your post.
    • no i meant the email from parcel2go which email address did they send it from and who signed it off (whos name is at the bottom)
    • I understand confusion with this thread.  I tried to keep threads separate because there have been so many angles.    But a team member merged them all.  This is why it's hard to keep track. This forum exists to help little people fight injustice - however big or small.  Im here to try get a decent resolution. Not to give in to the ' big boys'. My "matter' became complicated 'matters' simply because a lender refused to sell a property. What can I say?  I'll try in a nutshell to give an overview: There's a long lease property. I originally bought it short lease with a s.146 on it from original freeholder.  I had no concerns. So lender should have been able to sell a well-maintained lovely long lease property.  The property was great. The issue is not the property.  Economy, sdlt increases, elections, brexit, covid, interest hikes etc didn't help.  The issue is simple - the lender wanted to keep it.   House or Flat? Before repo I offered to clear my loan.  I was a bit short and lender refused.  They said (recorded) they thought the property was worth much more and they were happy to keep accruing interest (in their benefit) until it reached a point where they felt they could repo and still easily quickly sell to get their £s back.  This was a mistake.  The market was (and is) tough.   2y later the lender ceo bid the same sum to buy the property for himself. He'd rejected higher offers in the intervening period whilst accruing interest. Lenders have a legal obligation to sell the property for the best price they can get. If they feel the offer is low they won't sell it, because it's likely the borrower will say the same. I had the property under offer to a fantastic niche buyer but lender rushed to repo and buyer got spooked and walked.  It had taken a long time to find such a lucrative buyer.  A sale which would have resulted in £s and another asset for me. Post repo lender had 1 offer immediately.  But dragged out the process for >1y - allegedly trying to get other offers. But disclosure shows there was only one valid buyer. Again, points as above. Lender appointed receiver (after 4 months) - simply to try acquire the freehold.  He used his powers as receiver to use me, as leaseholder, to serve notice on freeholders.  Legally that failed. Meanwhile lender failed to secure property - and squatters got in (3 times).  And they failed to maintain it.  So freeholders served a dilapidations notice (external) - on me as leaseholder (cc-ed to lender).   (That's how it works legally) Why serve a delapidations notice? If it's in the terms of the lease to maintain the property to a good standard, then serve an S146 notice instead as it's a clear breach of the lease. I don't own the freehold.  But I am a trustee and have to do right by the freeholders.  This is where matters got/ get complicated.  And probably lose most caggers.   Lawyers got involved for the freeholders to firstly void the receiver enfranchisement notice. Secondly, to serve the dilapidations notice.  The lack of maintenance was in breach of lease and had to be served to protect fh asset. Enfranchisement isn't something that can be "voided", it's in the Leasehold Reform Act 1967 that leaseholders have the right to buy the freehold of the property. It's normal, whether it is a "normal" leaseholder or a repossession with a leasehold house, to claim this right of enfranchisement and sell the property with said rights attached and the purchase price of the freehold included in the final completion price. That's likely what the mortgage provider wished to do. The lender did no repairs. They said a buyer would undertake them. Which was probably correct. If they had sold. After 1y lender finally agreed to sell to the 1st offeror and contracts went with lawyers.  Within 1 month lender reneged.  Lender tried to suggest buyer walked. Evidence shows he/ his lawyers continued trying to exchange (cash) for 4 months.  Evidence shows lender and receiver strategy had been to renege and for ceo to take control.   I still think that's their plan. Redact and scan said evidence up for others to look at? Lender then stupidly chose to pretty much bulldoze the property.  Other stuff was going on in the background. After repo I was in touch by phone and email and lender knew post got to me.   Despite this, after about 10 months (before and then during covid), they deliberately sent SDs and eventually a B petition to an incorrect address and an obscure small court.  They never served me properly.  (In hindsight I understand they hoped to get a backdoor B - so they could keep the property that way.)  Eventually the random court told them to email me by way of service.  At this point their ruse to make me B failed.  I got a lawyer (friend paid). The B petition was struck out. They’d failed to include the property as an asset. They were in breach of insolvency rules. So this is dealt with then. Simultaneously the receiver again appointed lawyers to act on my behalf as leaseholder. This time to serve notice on the freeholders for a lease extension.  He had hoped to try and vary the strict lease. Evidence shows the already long length of lease wasn't an issue.  The lender obviously hoped to get round their lack of permission to do works (which they were already doing) by hoping to remove the strict clauses that prevent leaseholder doing alterations.  You wouldn't vary a lease through a lease extension. You'd need a Deed of Variation for that. This may be done at the same time but the lease has already been extended once and that's all they have a right to. The extension created a new legal angle for me to deal with.  I had to act as trustee for freeholders against me as leaseholder/ the receiver.  Inconsistencies and incompetence by receiver lawyers dragged this out 3y.  It still isn't properly resolved. The lease has already been extended once so they have no right to another extension. It seems pretty easy to just get the lawyer to say no and stick by those terms as the law is on your side there. Meanwhile - going back to the the works the lender undertook. The works were consciously in breach of lease.  The lender hadn't remedied the breaches listed in the dilapidations notice.  They destroyed the property.  The trustees compiled all evidence.  The freeholders lawyers then served a forfeiture notice. This notice started a different legal battle. I was acting for the freeholders against what the lender had done on my behalf as leaseholder.  This legal battle took 3y to resolve. Again, order them to revert it as they didn't have permission to do the works, or else serve an S146 notice for breach of the lease. The simple exit would have been for lender to sell. A simple agreement to remedy the breaches and recompense the freeholders in compensation - and there's have been clean title to sell.  That option was proposed to them.   This happened by way of mediation for all parties 2y ago.  A resolution option was put forward and in principle agreed.  But immediately after the lender lawyers failed to engage.  A hard lesson to learn - mediation cannot be referred to in court. It's considered w/o prejudice. The steps they took have made no difference to their ability to sell the property.  Almost 3y since they finished works they still haven't sold. ** ** I followed up some leads myself.  A qualified cash buyer offered me a substantial sum.  The lender and receiver both refused it.   I found another offer in disclosure.  6 months later someone had apparently offered a substantial sum via an agent.  The receiver again rejected it.  The problem of course was that the agent had inflated the market price to get the business. But no-one was or is ever going to offer their list price.  Yet the receiver wanted/wants to hold out for the list price.  Which means 1y later not only has it not sold - disclosure shows few viewings and zero interest.  It's transparently over-priced.  And tarnished. For those asking why I don't give up - I couldn't/ can't.  Firstly I have fiduciary duties as a trustee. Secondly, legal advice indicates I (as leaseholder) could succeed with a large compensation claim v the lender.  Also - I started a claim v my old lawyer and the firm immediately reimbursed some £s. That was encouraging.  And a sign to continue.  So I'm going for compensation.  I had finance in place (via friend) to do a deal and take the property back off the lender - and that lawyer messed up bad.   He should have done a deal.  Instead further years have been wasted.   Maybe I only get back my lost savings - but that will be a result.   If I can add some kind of complaint/ claim v the receiver's conscious impropriety I will do so.   I have been left with nothing - so fighting for something is worth it. The lender wants to talk re a form of settlement.  Similar to my proposal 2y ago.  I have a pretty clear idea of what that means to me.  This is exactly why I do not give up.  And why I continue to ask for snippets of advice/ pointers on cag.  
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Intrum Justina/HL Legal claim Secured Welcome Finance debt***Claim Discontinued***


mikecymru
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hi

 

Ive recieved a claim form - Intrum justia ltd

Issue date 4th november

Service acknowledged but I need help of what to do next.

 

Its in relation to an old debt with Welcome finance - claim is for best part of 30K.

(my ex wife is also named on the claim, we are not in touch)

The debt doesnt show in my file.

 

Ive no paper work relating to it..

 

Can someone point me in the right direction?

 

Thanks

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please answer the following as fully as possible

 

thread moved to financial legal issues as claim issued

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?419198-You-have-received-a-Claim-What-you-need-to-do.-**UPDATED-April-2014**%282-Viewing%29-nbsp

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Any help I am able to give is from my own experience only. Should you have any doubt you should contact a qualified professional.

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So this is a joint debt ?

 

Has the claim been issued in your name only and is there anyway you can make contact with your ex to establish if a claim has been issued against her as well ?

 

Once you have provided us with the answers to the questions oldrouge directed you to, we can then move forward with helping you.

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you should be an old hand at this looking at all the wins you've had already

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Name of the Claimant ? Intrum Justitia limited

 

 

Date of issue – 4th November

 

 

def date: - 7th December

 

 

What is the claim for – the reason they have issued the claim?

 

 

Monies due under a regulated credit agreement number XXXXXXXXX

between welcome financial services and the defendant

The agreement was terminated upon the defendants failure to comply with the terms of the agreement.

Any payments or agreements should be directed to the claimants solicitors on....XXXX

 

 

What is the value of the claim?approx 30k

 

 

Is the claim for a current or credit/loan account or mobile phone account?

Credit agreement secured on property

 

 

When did you enter into the original agreement before or after 2007? Before 2007

 

 

Has the claim been issued by the original creditor

or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim.

assigned to the debt purchaser (but I dont recall a assignment letter)

and the Debt purchaser has issued the claim.

 

 

Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment?

No I did not, but I moved house. so it may not have found me?

 

 

Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? I dont recall

 

 

- Have you been receiving statutory notices headed

“Notice of Default sums” – at least once a year ? No,

but as mentioned i have moved a few times.

 

 

Why did you cease payments:- Breakdown in previous marriage and home repossessed.

 

 

Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved?

The payment should have been taken from the sale of the house

and i didnt hear from the creditor since.

 

 

Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor

and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan?

No.

 

 

The credit agreement was a joint with my ex wife.

She is also named under her married name,

although after the divorce she changed to her maiden name and since remarried.

The claim form states her married name(Original) and our old address.

Only my address is current.

I dont think she has been served,

I have no communication with her to find out.

(She also went bankrupt shortly after our divorce, but i dont know the details.

That is approximately 4 1/2 5 years ago.)

 

 

I am in the process of sending CPR and CCA.

The debt doesnt show on my credit file.

Edited by mikecymru
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who are the sols please?

 

 

when was the home repo'd?

when did you last pay?

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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have you ack'd the claim defend all?

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Sols are : HL solicitors

 

 

- Redditchhome repo - sometime in 2011

 

 

- I walked away from the house 1 year earlier and have no correspondence from anyone since.

 

 

The mortgage payments would have stopped some time prior to january 2011.

 

 

My ex walked from the home in 2011 and was paying the mortgage herself for 4-6months earlier than this date from her account,

I dont know when they officially stopped.

 

 

I have acknowledged the service on MCOL and ticked i Intend to defend all of this claim.

 

 

re: CPR request

I have a template which has the line Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £10,000.00

and will in all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination upon my delivering a defence

but in this case its more than 10K so what should i respond with? and

 

 

I guess given the sum its not likely to be small claims - how will it track?

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No point making a CCA request on a value of that amount....the agreement will be unregulated if its a balance from a mortgage (or secured loan) which exceeds 25K.

 

Regards

 

Andy

We could do with some help from you.

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Hi Andy,

 

 

ok what should I do...?

 

 

Its a big one, so I dont want to fluff it...

 

 

Do I still proceed with CPR? if so how should I word it?

 

 

Obv..I need to prepare a defence and right now I cant.

.. no paperwork.

 

 

..Whats interesting for me is are two things.

 

 

- The house was sold with a secured debt and the claimant/finance company got nothing?

 

 

- I just checked up on all of my old Credit files.

 

 

The name intrum pops up for a three month period from July'14 to September '14 and then vanishes?

 

 

I smell some not lined up paperwork going on from their side,

 

 

I'd hate to get a default judgement if there are some gaps....

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as its IJ and an old welcome 'debt' behind it

you can bet your bottom dollar it's a fleecing exercise.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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You need to use CPR 31 to request information as to what the debt exactly is and how they equate that sum.You state your ex filed for Bankruptcy...would you know if she included anything with regards to this debt?

We could do with some help from you.

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You need to use CPR 31 to request information as to what the debt exactly is and how they equate that sum.You state your ex filed for Bankruptcy...would you know if she included anything with regards to this debt?

Hi andy

 

Do you mind if I send you an example to check if it's ok?

No I don't know what was included..

We don't speak

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No need to ...I can see what they state in their particulars.....which are very vague...but they do refer to a " regulated "agreement so it may be that the loan was less than 25k at time of inception the above may be penalties and interest that have pushed it through the threshold.Therefore do send a section 77 request (CCA)

 

It may be prudent to also use a CPR 18 with the added threat of asking them to re plead their particulars in line with CPR 16 in case they fail to cooperate.

 

Because the debt is joint and several...hence the question I raised above with regards to your ex ...it would be wise to confirm with her what exactly she knows of this debt.

 

Also would be wise to check your credit files to see if this is still showing.

We could do with some help from you.

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Hi Andy,

 

Ive searched a fair bit for the CPR18 and CPR16, its not something Ive done before.. is there a template?

 

also do I send them all together or separately?

 

Confused...I really want to get these off tomorrow, so I need to prepare them tonight.

 

I have checked my file and its not on there. and as far as my ex goes well we dont speak at all so thats a non starter.

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CPR 18 and the process...

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?255329-CPR-part-18-vs-CPR-31.14-Confused-well-read-here

 

CPR 16 .2&4 is the Civil Procedure Rule Practice Direction you use if they fail to comply...when a claimants particulars are inadequate.

 

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part16

We could do with some help from you.

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Thanks andy

 

sorry to be a pain.

 

..what goes in where the XXXX's are?

 

The finance companys name?2.

 

What is the XXXXXXX account number shown on the Deed as being the Claimants/Defendants account?

 

Also I send this to the DCA? or sols?

 

And you mentioned using CPR16,2 but I dont know where to tag this?

 

on the bottom of CPR18

- which is something I thought you couldnt do reading the notes.

 

..I know these are basic questions to you maybe but im struggling with the lingo a bit...

 

oh and do I sign CPR18 with a real signature???

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The template is just to show you how to set it out mike so disregard the points raised in that example..

 

 

.you write your own.CPR 18 should not be used as a fishing exercise.

 

 

.you cant request documents only answers to various points you wish to raise.

 

CPR 16 is the civil procedure rule all claimants should follow when drafting their particulars of claim..

.so you are referring to CPR 16.2 and in particular CPR 16.4 as the reason for using CPR 18 to clarify its particulars.

 

Your closing paragraph after your requests should read something along the lines of...

 

 

...after the 7 day notice...

 

Because you have failed to particularise your particulars with any concise statement pursuant to CPR 16.4 (1a)

failure to comply to this request will leave me no alternative to make application under CPR 18 to comply or represent further particulars.

 

 

I trust that this will not be necessary and look forward to your speedy response and clarification.

 

Now you just need to draft what you wish to know.

We could do with some help from you.

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I personally would allow 10

We could do with some help from you.

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am I allowed to ask them to prove how the sum arrived at the amout shown?

 

Yes ask them to quantify the amount and how the figure is arrived at.

We could do with some help from you.

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Solicitor..send rec delivery or receipted as proof of postage.

We could do with some help from you.

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Read and read similar threads with the same claimants/solicitors or amounts and get to understand the process and arguments...in particular the need for a default notice and unenforcible agreements etc........in the meantime keep an eye on the status of claim and your due defence date.

We could do with some help from you.

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