OFT debt collection guidance

[WinstonDog]

Why should u never sign letters to DCA?

[rory32]

It removes the temptation to be creative with photoshop when supplying copies of credit agreements, etc.

[sosumi]

Just found OFT664 as a web page through Google: - and just checked, no longer works

OFT664 as Web:)

Edited June 27, 2009 by sosumi
link no longer works

[sauheil]

where do I find the templates in order to reply to a debt collection company for a card I never had nor obviously used?

[rory32]

If you start your own thread and give some background info on which DCA has contacted you and how you'll receive all the help you need sauheil. If you don't know how to start your own thread have a read here "How do I...?" A Dummies' Guide to this Forum

[Mr Mutley]

Hiya Colin, I had dealings with this pond life as well. After my heart attack they phoned AGAIN and my wife said she part blamed them for my MI and said she would contact OUR solicitors. Nothing else has been heard, but the alleged debt has been passed to other pond life HFO.

[JR1]

Hi

 

I am new to this site. This site is very good. could youplease sign the petetion below -

 

Petition to: Control the use of Charging Orders as a means by which lenders are routinely securing unsecured debts against peoples property. | Number10.gov.uk

 

Thank you

Edited September 20, 2008 by JR1

[amw]

I am sorry to butt in but I am looking for some advice, after reading this thread I thought maybe somebody on here would be able to help. I am being chased by a DCA, I have disputed the debt I CCA them and received a letter from them that since it is a bank overdraft a CCA does not cover this. They have refused to give me any indication of where the total amount has come from..could I S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) them? I really am at a loss at the moment any help will be appreciated.

 

Just a quick point with regards to notice of assignments from DCA's.

If the notice includes an amount demanded that is incorrect it renders the notice legally invalid (e.g. unlawful charges or DCA admin/collection charges).

Even if the amount doesn't include charges but is misstated it is still invalid.

If the date is incorrect it is legally invalid (i.e. does not tie in with the deed of assignment - the execution of assignment should be the same as the date shown on the notice).

The case that supports this is W.F.Harrison & Co Ltd v Burke [1956] 1 WLR 419

 

P.S Thanks go to Laiste for pointing this out.

 

Hi Rory32,

 

1st crude says, " Deed of Assignment- we would refer you to section 136 of the Law of Property act 1925 which provides that the debtor is notified of the assignment in writing and not a copy of the Deed itself".

Now, i just happened to scrutinise both letters from citifinancial NOA and 1st crude's letter introducing themselves and saying that citifinancial has assigned the debt to them.

I noticed they are exactly of the same kind of paper used, the positioning of my address(after my name, then there's a gap one line down)then typed the remaining portions of my address. also the positioning of the barcode of their reference number. The NOA alledgedly from citifinancial looks like it has been a photoprint.

Citifinancial logo is in blue ink and with Capital letter ® at the top of after the letter "l". (i think it's probably their trademark). Now this NOA alledgedly from citifinancial's logo is in black ink and with no ® at the top. Cti's normal logo's used in correspondence only uses "citi" (in blue ink/colour) they don't used letterheads as "citifinancial". Me thinks that citi did not gave them Deed of Assignment/NOA in the first place. 1st crude made it to appear they did so they can start collection asap. They knew the DOA cannot be requested(?) so they can write whatever they like!

it would be interesting to know if indeed the DOA and the Execution of Assignment has the same date shown on the notice ( as to what i understand from your thread above?) if you can clarify me with this dates please. It could that 1st crude doesn't have a valid NOA after all!

sorry about my conspiracy theory-but it makes one's brain work! and not idle.

Anyone has a thought of these? thanks

[amw]

Having read the OFT guide, am I correct in the following statements:

 

1. DCA's can only collect if there is contractural basis - deed of assignment.

2. DCA's can only add charges or interest if there is contractural basis as point 1.

 

Correct?

 

1970.

 

Hello

 

Just a thought it was obvious (as mentioned from my other thread) 1st crude DCA has no real and true NOA document from citi; much more no real and true Deed of Assignment from citi either. it was a photoshop letterhead. the envelope it came with , came from 1st crude's address! surely if citi will write to it's customer, it will be their own paper and with their distinctive letterhead and logo, much more using their own envelope. DCA's buy these debts in bulk at a great discount from citi, so they can't really be bothered as it will cost them time and money. so it's up to the DCA's to do all the work and use their wand! So the bottom line is if 1st crude do not have this, they cannot and should not be collecting the debt! As per their letter, it said according to Article xxx( i will post the article later) that debtors will only received NOA in writing and not the Deed of Assignment. so in other words, if they indeed have the Deed(or not at all!) they won't let us see a copy of it. so are they hiding something we ought not to know then? i wonder?

Anyone please share your views on it.

[amw]

Hello there

 

hope it's ok for a few more questions? ta.

 

i have copied default letter ( for the DCA) and, a letter to be sent to the DCA's solicitor stating that DCA failed to provide CA on the prescribed time.

The letter to the DCA, do i have to put a title " DEFAULT NOTICE"? And a "COMPLAINT" heading? do i have to include in the letter as well that , i will be giving them 14 days to resolve this matter?

 

Also, i plan to send DCA and their solicitor each separate letters(although they are with the same address) only so can they cannot deny it.

Do i have to send them both special delivery so it could signed for by them? or just a recorded mail which is not guaranteed to be signed for( as what happened with my other letter not been signed as they get bulk mail, therefore only signing for 1). it is just too much to spend on for these bunch and, they only use second class sending for us.

Does it really matter now that it gets signed by them? still if i could choose it will be on recorded mail for both the letters.

 

Please- could someone please who's available for any advice please. i need to finalize the letter tonight.

 

many thanks all of u!

[blind-as-a-bat]

Just a quick point with regards to notice of assignments from DCA's.

If the notice includes an amount demanded that is incorrect it renders the notice legally invalid (e.g. unlawful charges or DCA admin/collection charges).

Even if the amount doesn't include charges but is misstated it is still invalid.

If the date is incorrect it is legally invalid (i.e. does not tie in with the deed of assignment - the execution of assignment should be the same as the date shown on the notice).

The case that supports this is W.F.Harrison & Co Ltd v Burke [1956] 1 WLR 419

 

P.S Thanks go to Laiste for pointing this out.

 

Just what i was looking for:D

 

GE money defaulted my OH in may, but only allowed 14 days from the date on the default notice was written, so that is invalid. I then CCA GE and they send what would be an enforceable front, but no T&C,s refered to in it, so are still in default of the CCA request, albeit on a technicality, but it still should mean they cant enforce the agreemant untill they correct that issue.

 

GE then decide to sell it to CL finance while still in default of sec78 request so sec (6) still applies, i still have not had a single corispondence from CL finance to this date by the way, but there pet sols, HC, write me a NoA on friday the 8th claiming assignment was made on the 6th, i recieved it on the 13th but they start court procedings on the monday the 11th, the court papers for wich arive the 12th

 

So the NoA is already duf as its not sent by the assignee, it was sent by normal post, not recorded as the LPA states, and arives after the court papers, but in responce to my CPR request they supply a Deed of Assignment dated the 7th so does not match the NoA nor the POC

 

CL finance also sent CCA request, they have not replied, but there sols sent me the same front of the agreement and nothing else so one way or another are also in default of a CCA request

 

First hearing in court in febuary, the derections for which from the judge state all origanal documents must be brought on the day, copies sent to court, and opposite parties no less than 14 days before hearing.

 

How do you think the hearing will go?

[Sparkie1723]

Taken from The Consumer Protection Regulations that came into force 26th May 2008 .

 

Section about debt collector methods

 

 

"A debt collector threatens consumers with recovery of

money by bailiffs for unenforceable debts. This could

amount to harassment, coercion or undue influence.

(Exploitation of circumstances and threat to take action

which cannot legally be taken)"

 

sparkie

[anyoldiron]

Hello everyone. I am new to this so forgive any mistakes on how to use it etc please.

 

I have debt collectors after me for a council tax bill incurred around three years ago. I had already paid off a big chunk of a bill that was in the flat I moved into from a previous tenant. I had sorted this out with the council but three years later it turns out that there was still £500 owing. I missed the letters from the council and so it was passed to debt collector. My most recent bill was for £950!

 

They are constantly phoning me and when I tried to set up a payment plan they said the best they could do was let me pay in three installments- £300 a month for three months. Impossible.

 

I have just read the OFT guidelines and see that this is not lawful. What should I do next?

 

In addition, I received a notice from them before xmas to say that my account had been paid in full. I called to find out what this was and they said they had no record of any payments.

 

How do I get to pay in installments and why do I have to pay the debt collectors and extra £400?

 

Please help!!

 

Thanks. anyoldiron

[Brassed off]

Hi Anyoldiron

 

Start a new thread in the following forum:-

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/local-authority-council-tax/

[Richard Spud]

PUBLIC INFORMATION

 

Online Search of the OFT Consumer Credit License Register

 

LINK: http://www2.crw.gov.uk/pr/default.aspx

 

Check if DCAs have current Consumer Credit Licences!

 

INTERESTING NOTES:

 

Check if the Trading Names used are covered under the licence (and the dates declared)

 

Check that any Company Officer changes are notified

 

Check the history

 

HINTS:

 

Metropolitan Collection Services Ltd (in-house HSBC) did not have a CCL for 3 months

 

Close Assistance was not a registered Trading Name of Close Credit Management Ltd

 

NB: Both the above HINTS are verifiable by information contained in the OFT CCL Public Register.

[Sparkie1723]

Collections Direct ( one company they collect for is Npower) who are owned by Rebyl Ltd (a non trading Ltd Co) neither of them have a credit have a Data Controllers license or a Consumer Credit License.

 

sparkie

[spartathisis]

Just rang the OFT to check on a DCA not listed on their site, wow talk about about poor attitude! No wonder they let DCA`s get away with whatever they want if they are staffed by people Ive just spoken to.

[Guest atsgreig]

Thanks all for share with me. it's really nice tips.

[Richard Spud]

EXCELLENT WORK BY THE OFT AGAINST A DCA

 

See the latest action published on 21st April 2009 and valuable OFT opinions to cite to other DCAs and the County Courts.

 

http://www.oft.gov.uk:80/news/press/2009/44-09

 

“Under the Limitation Act 1980, which applies to England and Wales, a debt is considered to be statute barred when no payments have been made against it or where it has not been acknowledged for six years. A statute barred debt cannot be legally recovered. Whilst the OFT accepts that the debt still exists, the OFT considers that it can be unfair to pursue the debt in the circumstances set out in our Debt Collection Guidance”

 

Quote from the OFT MACKENZIE HALL PDF document:

 

“REQUIREMENTS IMPOSED BY THE OFT REQUIREMENTS RELATING TO:

 

MACKENZIE HALL LIMITED

 

A debt is considered as in dispute where:

 

A request under section 77 or 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 has not been complied with, and this prevents the agreement being enforced without the permission of the court”

 

I suggest that the above reference to ss.77 and 78 of the CCA 1974 is a very strong endorsement of the rights of consumers to be provided with true copies of Regulated agreements.

 

HTH

 

Regards – Richard.

[make them aktiv runners]

Thames credit claim to be a trading name of Aktiv Kapital operating under license 510166. Not listed as a trading name under Aktiv (UK) CCA license of 510166.

 

Thames Credit LIMITED does have a license in own right 0469849. One wonders if there is a connection to this license expiring 16 September 2009.

[Richard Spud]

Quotes from the Daily Hansard Parliamentary Debate regarding Debt Collection and the Consumer Credit Act on 22 April 2009 beginning at column 338.

 

At column 341 Mr Andrew Mackinlay (Thurrock) (Lab) states:

 

“The industry is rotten to the core, whether it is in-house recovery and collection, or where agents are used, or where the debt has been sold.” [my emphasis added]

 

At column 342 The Minister for Trade, Development and Consumer Affairs (Mr. Gareth Thomas) states:

 

“The OFT would expect the debt collection agency concerned to have checked the accuracy of the client data details that it received from the creditor or agency, and, where possible, to have obtained a copy of the original consumer credit agreement.” [my emphasis added]

 

See the original Hansard publication on the link below:

 

House of Commons Hansard Debates for 22 Apr 2009 (pt 0019)

 

HTH

 

Regards – Richard.

[Guest atsgreig]

Greendykes, hopefully this will help.

 

From the Consumer Credit Act 1974:

 

Facts. The manager of the C Bank agrees orally with D (an individual) to open a current account in D’s name. Nothing is said about overdraft facilities. After maintaining the account in credit for some weeks, D draws a cheque in favour of E for an amount exceeding D’s credit balance by £20. E presents the cheque and the Bank pay it.

Analysis. In drawing the cheque D, by implication, requests the Bank to grant him an overdraft of £20 on its usual terms as to interest and other charges. In deciding to honour the cheque, the Bank by implication accept the offer. This constitutes a regulated small consumer credit agreement for unrestricted-use, fixed-sum credit. It is a debtor-creditor agreement, and falls within section 74(1)(b) if covered by a determination under section 74(3).

 

Facts. F (an individual) has had a current account with the G Bank for many years. Although usually in credit, the account has been allowed by the Bank to become overdrawn from time to time. The maximum such overdraft has been is about £1,000. No explicit agreement has ever been made about overdraft facilities. Now, with a credit balance of £500, F draws a cheque for £1,300

 

Analysis. It might well be held that the agreement with F (express or implied) under which the Bank operate his account includes an implied term giving him the right to overdraft facilities up to say £1,000. If so, the agreement is a regulated consumer credit agreement for unrestricted-use, running-account credit. It is a debtor-creditor agreement, and falls within section 74(1)(b) if covered by a direction under section 74(3). It is also a multiple agreement, part of which (i.e. the part not dealing with the overdraft), as referred to in section 18(1)(a), falls within a category of agreement not mentioned in this Act.

 

Facts. Under an oral agreement made on 10th January, X (an individual) has an overdraft on his current account at the Y bank with a credit limit of £100. On 15th February, when his overdraft stands at £90, X draws a cheque for £25. It is the first time that X has exceeded his credit limit, and on 16th February the bank honours the cheque.

Analysis. The agreement of 10th January is a consumer credit agreement for running-account credit. The agreement of 15th-16th February varies the earlier agreement by adding a term allowing the credit limit to be exceeded merely temporarily. By section 82(2) the later agreement is deemed to revoke the earlier agreement and reproduce the combined effect of the two agreements. By section 82(4), Part V of this Act (except section 56) does not apply to the later agreement. By section 18(5), a term allowing a merely temporary excess over the credit limit is not to be treated as a separate agreement, or as providing fixed-sum credit. The whole of the £115 owed to the bank by X on 16th February is therefore running-account credit.

 

Facts. The G Bank grants H (an individual) an unlimited overdraft, with an increased rate of interest on so much of any debit balance as exceeds £2,000.

Analysis. Although the overdraft purports to be unlimited, the stipulation for increased interest above £2,000 brings the agreement within section 10(3)(b)(ii) and it is a consumer credit agreement.

 

From the Consumer Credit Act 1974:

Excellent Information share here !!!!!!

[Richard Spud]

I have edited Andrew Macinlay’s external links on Wikipedia to highlight his debt collection debate in the House on 22 April 2009.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_MacKinlay

“External links

 

• Andrew Mackinlay speaks out in the House about the debt collection industry being "rotten to the core". 22 April 2009”.
  

Regards – Richard.

[suziq]

Hello,

I'm sorry but i can't seem to find how to write a post!

 

I just want to know - can a company chase you for a debt AFTER they have passed it over to a DCA? Please help.

[bsj]

Hello,

I'm sorry but i can't seem to find how to write a post!

 

I just want to know - can a company chase you for a debt AFTER they have passed it over to a DCA? Please help.

 

 

You need to click on NEW THREAD the button is just above this thred on the left hand side,so your post will be in the debt collection industry forum,you will be in the correct place then and people will be able to help you.

 

I hope this helps.

 

Oh and welcome to GAG:)