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    • statute barring in Scotland is 5yrs from last payment/use date or date of default Notice + 14 days, whichever is the later. dont confuse that with the 6yrs debts show on credit files (DN's 6th bday regardless to payment or not). they'd never get a claim raised by august in 99% of cases . as long all these debts were taken out whilst resident in scotland and you have not moved since taking them out but failed to inform the original creditor before the debt sale....... then stay radio silent until sb date is reached. then if you wish send our scottish sb letter. just remember unlike E&W in scotland debts are extinguished, dead , gone , parrot. once SB'd dx  
    • Hi all, Love this site and it's no nonsense advice, have dipped in and out of the consumer forums over the years, mostly to assure myself that what I was doing was the right thing when dealing with various businesses (almost 100% success rate, thanks in part to reading and more reading here.). Anyway, the time is almost approaching where I might need to ask for some specific help and I have a couple of queries that I can't see definitively answered. Due to financial mismanagement and severe anxiety issues I stopped paying all unsecured debt in December 2018 (one slipped to the first week in Jan 2019 when the last payment was made having rechecked my bank statement from that period - all my unsecured debt direct debits were cancelled in early Jan 2019). This has left half a dozen debts;  a couple of credit cards, a bank loan, Shop Direct and some Hitachi Finance stuff having been sold on and passing the rounds through the usual suspects, Lowells, Link, PRA Group, others related to them, and then back to them again. I have somehow successfully managed to maintain radio silence and avoided anything more worrying than their begging letters.  I have blocked their phone calls and texts, bumped all emails to the spambox and had a chuckle at their desperate letters.  I've never had anybody at the door.  I have been at the same address since before I defaulted and all correspondence comes to my current home address.  I have NEVER contacted them or admitted any debt. In anticipation of them perhaps ramping up action at the last minute I've had a look at my credit report on Credit Karma (rec'd from this very place) and I see that the default dates on these range from May 2019 to November 2019. Also in preperation I've been reading, reading and reading lots here as advised. Obviously being in Scotland there are a lot fewer posts relating to these matters and it's always quite annoying when OP's do not follow up with any outcome on their cases - how rude! This has also left me a bit confused of when I am able to finally breathe easy (although cancelling all the direct debits in Jan 2019 was the biggest sigh of relief as I knew it was all going to be unmanageable and, well, default one, default all.). I've been reading that defaults should be filed 3-6 months after the missed payment but one of my larger debts was defaulted on 27th August 2019 when the last payment I made was 10th December 2018, meaning the first missed payment was 10th Jan 2019.   My query for now is - when should I infer that these debts are prescribed?  From when the payment was missed, or taking the default date plus 5 years from the credit report? The three I have with the May date are moot anyway as either way they are gone  - some letters from Lowell offering me 90% off to settle is what got me thinking these must have been near SB status, however I have one big 10k+ with a July date and another 10k+ at the end of August I am feeling a bit anxious again, even though I know there is nothing to worry about with the begging letters.  Reading the various forums I am not sure why the OC's didn't take action against me when I read time and again the surprise that other posters haven't already been taken to court for lesser amounts - I'm also surprised I've avoided any action this long as there are plenty in this forum and sub forum who are whisked off to the court by the beggers minions after only a year or so after defaulting.  There are no CCJ/decrees listed on my credit report and I have not received any such judgements against me.  I still just regularly receive the begging emails to the spambox, the blocked phone calls and the letters from the they. I'm also reading that there is no need in Scotland to send an LBC so what should I be looking out for to know that the time has come to engage with CCA requests etc? I'm afraid in a fit I threw a lot of the paperwork out but I have a box of stuff I'm going to go through which may have the original letters from the OC's. Thanks in advance for any advice.  
    • I'm at work now but promise to look in later. Can you confirm how you paid the first invoice?  It wasn't your fault if the signal was so poor and there was no alternative way to pay.  There must be a chance of reversing the charge with your bank.  There are no guarantees but Kev  https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/09766749/officers  has never had the backbone to do court so far.  Not even in one case,  
    • OK  so you may not have outed yourself if you said "we". No matter either way you paid. Snotty letter I am surprised that they were so quick off the mark threatening Court. They usually take months to go that far. No doubt that as you paid the first one they decided to strike quickly and scare you into paying. Dear Chuckleheads  aka Alliance,  I am replying to your LOCs You may have caught me the first time but that is  the end. What a nasty organisation you are. You do realise that you now have now no reason to continue to pursue me after reading my appeal since you know that my car was not cloned. Any further pursuit will end up with a complaint to the ICO that you are breaching my GDPR.  Please confirm that you have removed my details from your records. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I haven't gone for a snotty letter this time as they know that you paid for your car in another car park. So using a shot across their bows .  If it doesn't deter them and they send in the debt collectors or the Court you will then be able to get more money back from them for  breachi.ng your data protection than they will get should they win in Court-and they have no chance of that as you have paid. So go in with guns blazing and they might see sense.  Although never underestimate how stupid they are. Or greedy.
    • Thank you. Such a good point. They did issue all 3 before I paid though. I only paid one because I didn’t have proof of parking that time, only for two others.    Unfortunately no proof of my appeal as it was just submitted through a form on their website and no copy was sent to me. I only have the reply. I believe I just put something like “we made the honest mistake of using the incorrect parking area on the app” and that’s it. Thanks again for your help. 
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GOT A COURT DATE? Important, please read......


GaryH
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Gary, could you please advise me on how to present my bundle. Should this be sent in a ring binder or is it best to have it bound? Could you also confirm if I need to include Case Summary and Disclosure by list in addition to Witness Statement and Statement of Evidence. I am claiming against Yorkshire Bank and have been allocated to York County Court Small Claims Track Standard Directions. I am sorry to keep bombarding you with questions, just want to get it right,but my head is spinning with all the reading I have done.

 

Your help in clarifying this for me would be very much appreciated.

 

Thanks Yosemite

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Hi

 

sorry to be a bit dim but....

 

Quote:

2, Is the scottish law report relevant and has anyone else included this.

 

Yes, its relevant in respect of disguised penalties and how they should be subject to the penalty provisions regardless of presentation

 

Would I be warm if I was looking at section 6 of the report. Is this the relevent section to us. Also if it relates to Scotland how does it this tie in to claims in England.

 

Again apologies if I'm missing the obvious here. :-|

 

Brasic

Brasic and Lloyds TSB

Followed the guidance on the site and won :D

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Right, Im just going over my bundle noe before I send it off in the morning and have come across this paragraph in the witness statement:

 

Section 5.8 - Disguised penalties.Objections under the Regulations to an unfair financial penalty can apply to any term which requires excessive payment in the event of early termination, or for doing anything else that the supplier has an interest in deterring the consumer from doing. The Regulations are concerned with the intention and effects of terms, not just their mechanism. If a term has the effect of an unfair penalty, it will be regarded as such, and not as a 'core term'. Thus a penalty cannot be made fair by transforming it into provision requiring payment of a fee for exercising a contractual option.”

 

Section 18 1.3

"These objections are less likely to arise if a term is specific as to what must be paid and in what circumstances. In that case, it may be considered a 'core' term and exempt from consideration for fairness provided it is in clear language and properly drawn to consumers' attention – see Part IV, paragraph 19.12. (But note that this may not hold good if it is a 'disguised penalty', that is, a term calculated to make consumers pay excessively for doing something that would normally be a breach of contract.”

 

I have printed off the document and can find section 5.8 ok but cant find 18 1.3 the document only has 17 sections:confused:

Lloyds settled in full

£4010.02:D

 

Halifax CC settled

£417.00 :D

 

Lloyds PPI

£3672.15 Refunded off loan :D

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Thanks the link in the 1st post only goes down to section 17 but the witness statement refers to section 18 so that was a great help.

Lloyds settled in full

£4010.02:D

 

Halifax CC settled

£417.00 :D

 

Lloyds PPI

£3672.15 Refunded off loan :D

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I'm going to include the Lloyds TSB card TnCs in my bundle, but should i then include a para about clause 9.2 in my witness statement re breach?

 

i guess i'm also asking should i detail in my witness statement every document i intent to refer to?

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hi gary in my order from court sc&m were supposed to send me their statment of evedence by the 1st of this month as i did to them but they havent do i let the court know right now or let them know when i take my bundle in any day now!? u can see my order on my thread 24nickp vs low life lloyds! thanks im in need of sum advice so if u could help me that wub be great thanks! Nick

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We've got a June 28 hearing for £1300 of penalties with LTSB and today got copy of Court Order instructing [problem] to provide :

1. A copy of original signed lending agreement(incl.Tand Cs).

2. A schedule of the actual charge costs for each and every charge as listed in P's of C.

 

I say we because I have stepped in as as it is my son's claim and HM Gov. has sent him overseas. He asked court by letter to allow me to be his Lay Representative with Rights of audience on the 28th but Judge asked for another N244 application and £65 and he to return to UK to make the application in person.

We now have to think about whether to ask for the case to be judged "on paper" as per Rule 27.9 or (as recommended by court staff) for me to just turn up at court on the 28th and ask judge to review my son's letter (which is on file) and to allow me to speak for him. We are minded to file letter at court by fax on June 20th giving 7 days notice of non-attendance of Claimant in accord with Rule 27.9 (1) (a). Anybody got experience or views?

Having won against Nationwide (£2,600), Morgan Stanley (£600) and Student Loans Co. (£130) we were able to do a nice bundle for the Lloyds claim and [problem] have failed to deliver their doc's and we are keen to finish off the LTSB nicely. I am old, not much good at this computer stuff, but am no idiot and enjoy hitting rip-off organisations.

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If they honoured your DD when you had no money to pay it (Type 2), then I myself cannot put up a convincing argument why Lloyds had not done you a favour, a benefit, a service, deserving of a service fee.

 

Hi Mastermind, just caught your post above and thought that i could put forward a very convincing argument why by paying a DD when there was no available funds to pay it, LTSB did not do me any favors.

A couple of years ago I had 2 DDs one was set up to pay my council tax of £120.00 and if LTSB had paid it I would have been just £3.00 overdrawn. LTSB did not pay it and i was charged both by LTSB and the council. The other DD was for a LTSB loan, again for the same amount of £120.00 and by paying it I was overdrawn by £120.00 yet I did not want this paying as I could not afford it, i thought the council tax was more important, LTSB however did not see it that way. they did not pay my loan to do me any favors, the only reason they paid the loan was because it was their loan. they did not care if i was over my overdraft limit as long as they where being paid. So by making me OD for £120.00 rather then £3.00 they did in fact do me a mis-service. I did try to cancel the DD for the Loan but was informed that because it was set up by LTSB it could not be canceled.

 

That is exactly what has happened with the majority of my charges! I had a Lloyds loan for £2000 which i asked to increase by £1000. They said they could not do this but instead will give me a £3000 loan and pay the £2000 one back. I didn't have enough of the £2000 left to repay so I had to take on both loans over a 4 year period. These were direct debits that could not be cancelled as they were lloyds tsb loans, and these were never returned as it was to the benefit that payment was taken, as they were assured of my monthly income covering the overdraft! It is a very crafty way of behaving! Is there anything about this I can submit to the courts? cos i'm sure that they will claim they were doing me a 'service' for it. Arrrgghhhh i'm so angry!! :mad:

*Court date set for 20th Aug*:eek:

*Lloyds TSB defence filed 14th May 2007*:mad:

*LBA sent 2nd April 2007*:cool:

*Prelim sent 5th March 2007*:D

*SARS sent 26th January 2007*:rolleyes:

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That is exactly what has happened with the majority of my charges! I had a Lloyds loan for £2000 which i asked to increase by £1000. They said they could not do this but instead will give me a £3000 loan and pay the £2000 one back. I didn't have enough of the £2000 left to repay so I had to take on both loans over a 4 year period. These were direct debits that could not be cancelled as they were lloyds tsb loans, and these were never returned as it was to the benefit that payment was taken, as they were assured of my monthly income covering the overdraft! It is a very crafty way of behaving! Is there anything about this I can submit to the courts? cos i'm sure that they will claim they were doing me a 'service' for it. Arrrgghhhh i'm so angry!! :mad:

 

 

Couldn't agree more, exactly the reason I started my mission against the banks. How can you honour your own loan with insufficient funds in the account, yet decline another on exactly same date and charge a 'service fee'

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Does anyone know if you have to include the unfair contract terms guidance which is referred to in Witness Statement sections 5.8 Disguised penalties and Section 18.1.3. Instead of whole document could I just include the relevant pages showing the appropriate clauses referred to.

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If your bank manager personally realises it really is a case of either the D/Ds or food in your mouth, then he has to use discretion to stretch the rules -- over a limited period, especially if you are an old customer.

 

All DDs are authorised by your personal signature, and you could have cancelled any or all DDs, if you feel honouring DDs were doing you no service. However even managers have auditors poring over lists of loan accounts falling further and further into arrears. There will be certain trigger points when overseeing auditors will instruct the branch manager to get tough and issue bankruptcy proceedings etc.

 

I agree that in certain situations honouring a DD will not help the customer. But bouncing it will not help him either. It is a question which triggers the bigger alarm upstairs -- a loan account falling into arrears, or a current account falling into the red. Whatever institution (e.g. external credit card) is expecting to receive an instalment DD will kick when it stops receiving same. The customer can choose the lesser evil -- either to rely on the bank to pay the uncovered DD, or to formally cancel the DD.

 

In the case of a bank using discretion to honour an external DD in the absence of funds, the bank is risking a bad debt. I would think there should be no difficulty about a customer issuing a standing instruction to the manager "under no circumstances honour my bad cheques and DDs". In which case the bank will NOT be performing a lender-borrower service. Lloyds already have 3 types of accounts with such a builtin T&C.

 

Just one view.

 

 

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MM, I'm sorry but I totally disagree, firstly we don't have a personal manager anymore, my local branch has not had one for yonks!, all decisions are done using computer analysis. D/Ds set up by the bank to pay loans cannot be cancelled by the customer, I have tried many times.

 

a loan account falling into arrears, or a current account falling into the red. you can easily put a current account back in the black if your salary is paid in each month, personally I would rather have had the loan going into arrears then I might have been able to negoiate reduced payments for a set period or no interest payments.

There are other ways to sort it for the benefit of the customer but that's not the banks way of doing things. I had a 5 yr loan with just one year left to pay, with the interest I had been paying, I had payed the original sum of the loan nearly twice over, but what happened when i became in arrears due to the bank taking chargers out of my account instead of the loan payments, I was forced to consolidate the loan with another loan for another 5 yr period just to get the reduced payments I wanted, that in itself is extortionate yet we are forced into it. if my bank had of paid my loan instead of the chargers each month my loan would have been paid off, even if they had excepted reduced payments for a while, it still would have been paid off, it might have taken 3 months longer then planned but it would have been paid, but !!!! that was not in the banks interest so for the sake of a couple of hundred pounds in chargers over a 6 month period I was forced to take out a loan for a couple of thousand. I am sure the banks must love bad debters because they realise more money then customers who are always in the red.

 

That's my theory and i'm sticking to it:p

:x if i have been off any help to you please click my scales

 

cases won

28th July Single Claim for bank charges against LTSB, £6,800 WON with CI to date of Judgement

 

18th July Joint Claime against LTSB £7,800 WON with CI to date of Judgement.

 

 

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I agree, the decimation of the branch-customer relationship has been awful. In complex difficulties it takes two humans to set down and work out the least bad option including debt rescheduling, it takes two humans to find a realistic workable option.

 

Perhaps one day when banks finally come to digest and review their current experience under seige from one million unlawful charge reclaimants, that banks would realise cutting staff and contact with customers was a false economy, one which backfired big time. Customer injury and dissatisfaction was allowed to accumulate then to eventually explode, where a face-to-face safety valve would have allowed an earlier resolution.

 

I would say though, that rigid automation is not limited to banks and credit cards. Anybody who found banks unhelpful and has tried out alternative money-lenders in the high street will know -- they are even worse.

 

 

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Perhaps one day when banks finally come to digest and review their current experience under seige from one million unlawful charge reclaimants, that banks would realise cutting staff and contact with customers was a false economy, one which backfired big time. Customer injury and dissatisfaction was allowed to accumulate then to eventually explode, where a face-to-face safety valve would have allowed an earlier resolution.

Hear, hear!:)

Please remember to DONATE! Help CAG keep up the fight!

 

 

Any advice or opinion is offered informally & without liability. Use your own judgment and if in doubt seek advice of a qualified and insured professional.

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I have had a notice of transferral to my local court (for £603 worth of charges) now. Does anyone know what sort of timescale I should be working on in terms of preparing my bundle and ending up in court? Thanks. Very scared. I knew mine would end up in court. They are completely defending the claim. Such a small amount as well, relative to alot others have claimed with NO hassles at all. I am gutted.

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I have had a notice of transferral to my local court (for £603 worth of charges) now. Does anyone know what sort of timescale I should be working on in terms of preparing my bundle and ending up in court? Thanks. Very scared. I knew mine would end up in court. They are completely defending the claim. Such a small amount as well, relative to alot others have claimed with NO hassles at all. I am gutted.

 

 

Don't panic, all quite normal so far.

 

They have to transfer to your local court, so nothing unusual there. Same has happened to me, although on their deadline date they happened to transfer £750 goodwill refund into my account. I wrote to say remove it or I shall only accept as a part payment, so now continuing with claim for the balance, which is less than £500.

 

Had my notice of transfer on 14th May and court date set for 24th July, if this is anything to go by? They also always say going to defend claim, amount seems to be irrelevant, so just carry on! no need to be guuted, you WILL get your money!!!!

 

RR

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I have my Preliminary hearing on Monday for which I had to put forward my case - which I did - by 08/05. The bank had to respond by 22/06 but has not responded in any way. Can I request on Monday that the judge strikes them out for not responding?

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Don't panic - its highly unlikely you'll need them.

 

Have you got a court date? If so make sure you get your bundle in on time as per the instructions in post #1 of this thread.

 

If they haven't settled with a week - 3 days to go then PM me. Mind you, the T&C library and Lloyds bundle should be ready to go this week anyway.

Please remember to DONATE! Help CAG keep up the fight!

 

 

Any advice or opinion is offered informally & without liability. Use your own judgment and if in doubt seek advice of a qualified and insured professional.

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