Un welcome Finance PPI Missale

[hannah8686]

Hiya

 

last year my husband took out additional borrowing on his loan he had with welcome finance. he originally did not have PPI insurance with his original loan.

 

When he got home, (the whole loan process actually took 10 minutes as they were rushing as it was a friday and they wanted to go home) I checked through the agreement olny to discover that it was a brand new loan and not an extra amount on top of the old one. My husband did not realise this either at the time as the whole loan was rushed.

 

He then realised that as well as signing for the loan he had also been signed up for PPI and something called medicare.

 

I phoned them to say that we did not want these included and was not aware why we had been signed up for them as it was meant to be additional borrowing and we assumed it would be on the same basis as before. They then told me that we could not cancel as it was to late, even thou i explained that it was not wanted and my husband did not even realise he had signed for it as it was not explained during the application.

 

the lady on the phone then said. He was fully aware has had loans before so he knows what he signed for. I then cot into a debate that he didnt have it before so he didnt etc.

 

I have then sent various faxes/letters to the branch over the past 6 months trying to get it cancelled but they still havent done it. each time i state that it was never wanted and we didnt know it had been signed for etc.

 

and what so i get nothing, no response for months until saturday - it just staed that he had been passed to the local branch which is bristol (i took the loan out in swindon) and they would contact me shortly. I dont believe they will but i firstly need to know if my reasons for wanting a refund are good enough and if anyone else agrees that this was missold seeing we didnt even know we had it!!!

 

I have sent my SAR yesterday for the charges details etc and asked for a copy of the original agreement.

enclosed my cheques.

 

Ant help will be great..thanks. i have read through the most of this frum and Welcome finance any dealings

[hellhasnofury]

Hello and welcome(no pun intended)

 

I read your post with interest. They are all the same, trick you and then say its your own fault.

 

You are heading in the correct direction doing the SAR, but don,t be surprised that they don,t send you everything. I mean things like the credit agreement letters of correspondence etc.

 

You will have to be prepared for a fight, but with the help and support of others you will get there.

 

Good luck anyway

[reidnet]

How long after you got the loan did you phone them regarding the cancellation of the PPI and Medicare ?, If it was within days then they are wrong to say that you cannot cancel, You should have a cooling off period with the PPI Policy, this varies from Company to Company but is normally in the region of 7 to 30 Days.

 

I would have a read through the terms and conditions of the PPI and Medicare Policies, it should be stated in their about cancellation etc.

 

Ian

[hannah8686]

whet was said about the cancelation is not really the real issue in my mind, as no loan documents were issued untill a week after, due to them having to be sent in the post so we didnt even know we had PPI

 

The main point of mine is that we didnt ask for it, their was no assesment as to if we needed it or would even be covered by it, and we specifically stated that the loan was in addition to our borrowing we had already so therefore it would be on the same terms. We were signed up for it without havingit explained that we were, and we were not given an option, just rushed through the application in 15 minutes and told to sign. x x and x.

[craigamc]

Stick at it

 

I have just had my "full" premium refunded after 2 letters sent!

 

craig

[hannah8686]

Stick at it

 

I have just had my "full" premium refunded after 2 letters sent!

 

craig

 

Can you give me the adddress you sent it to, i am about to send the LBA tommorow as i have rec'd a letter saying its been passed to the bristol branch manager but have heard nothing since, that was 8 days ago and the letter stated i would hear within a couple of days

 

thanks

[craigamc]

Can you give me the adddress you sent it to, i am about to send the LBA tommorow as i have rec'd a letter saying its been passed to the bristol branch manager but have heard nothing since, that was 8 days ago and the letter stated i would hear within a couple of days

 

thanks

 

Heres the contact and address

Alexandria Mace

Senior Compliance Officer

 

Welcome Financial Services Ltd

Mere Way

Ruddington Fields Business Park

Ruddington

Nottingham, NG11 6NZ

 

Regards

Craig

[hannah8686]

thanks, i had another fob off letter today, saying they would forward my complaint onto another dept in another office to deal with.

 

did you use a template from this site and do the prelim/lba etc

[hellhasnofury]

thanks, i had another fob off letter today, saying they would forward my complaint onto another dept in another office to deal with.

 

did you use a template from this site and do the prelim/lba etc

 

There are quite a few lba letters in some of the threads. I wrote this one after my SAR came.

 

I sent this one you can amend it to your own needs. It might just give you a few pointers.

 

 

Dear Sir or Madam

Loan Account no: XXXXXXXXXXX

I write in response to my recent Subject Access Request dated 14th January 2007. I thank you for your information. After reading the information it has now come to my attention, that the loan account no XXXX, which I took out on the 4th April 2001 had payment protection insurance applied to it. the loan was for £XXXXXXplus £XXXXcharge for credit/ interest. The payment protection insurance was calculated by yourselves at £XXXXX. Total amount of money payable £XXXXXover ten years and I would assume unless otherwise directed by yourselves that 8,9% interest on the ppi of £XXXXwas included into the interest applied to this loan. The insurance policy no of the payment protection insurance is XXXXX. I have never received any policy or terms and conditions regarding this policy. I have received this information from the SAR you have recently sent to me

I am extremely disappointed that your company have conveniently failed to locate any copies of Contracts regarding the loan. I feel this statement hard to believe that you cannot locate these documents and by law under the data Protection Act 1998 and the Limitation Act of 1980 you must supply me with this information. There was another loan running prior to the above loan which I have also request information about. I shall be reporting this matter to the Information Commissioners Office.

 

When I took the loan with your company, I was not given offered a full and detailed explanation of payment protection insurance and was lead to believe by your company/representative that it was part of the conditions of the loan. I have thought that for the last five years and more. It has only become apparent to me after the recent coverage by the media, and following the recent OFT and FSA investigations regarding the mis-selling of ppi by finance companies.. This is when I requested the Subject Access Request. Regarding the loan with the ppi applied, I believe I that I have been gravely mis-led and have been mis-sold this expensive insurance that I did not need or want.. At the time of this application I was enduring financial difficulties and being my main bank account of this you were well aware. I am frankly shocked that you have operated my loan account in this way as I had always reposed confidence in your integrity and expertise as my fiduciary.

 

 

Your responsibilities

 

I would draw your attention to the terms of the contract which you agreed to at the time that I opened my account. It is an implied term of that contract that you would conduct yourselves lawfully and in a manner which complies with UK law.

 

 

Firstly, I understand that at the time I entered into the loan contract with you your bank was running an incentive scheme to encourage your employees to sell PPI schemes, as were several other High Street banks. This information was posted on a public website in September last year:

 

 

SECRET documents leaked from two major banks show how bosses get their staff to sell big loans and the profitable insurance policies that go with them Commission tables for the RBOS and NatWest reveal a score system in which bank workers amass disproportionally more points for selling larger loans and for those sold with insurance - sparking fears that inappropriate products are being pushed

.

In-branch customer service advisers are able to earn a quarterly bonus of £1,200 if they consistently reach a weekly target of about 2,700 points over three months and if their branch also reaches its three-monthly target. Staff earn 30 points if they sell a customer a personal loan of between £3,000 and £4,999, but they earn 90 points if the loan is sold with payment protection insurance - the controversial cover that is supposed to pay out if a borrower loses their income.

 

I was not aware of this and even if it is untrue, I consider that there was a clear conflict of interest between your fiduciary responsibilities to me and the direct selling by your employees of PPI schemes, given the very large profit margins they generate.

 

When I took the loan/loans with your company, I was not offered a full and detailed explanation of payment protection insurance and was led to believe by your company/representative that it was part of the conditions of the loan. I have thought that for the last five years and more. It has only become apparent to me after the recent coverage by the media, and following the recent OFT and FSA investigations regarding the mis-selling of ppi by finance companies.. This is when I requested the Subject Access Request of the 14th January 2007.

 

Regarding the loans with the ppi applied, I believe I that I have been gravely mis-led by your company at a time when I was facing financial difficulties and have been mis-sold this expensive insurances that I did not need or want.. At the time of this application I was in full-time employment with no risk of redundancy ,a fully paid salary for 6months of sickness, had a generous life insurance and critical illness insurance policies.

 

No attempt was made to ascertain if the product provided was fit for purpose, suitable for my needs or if indeed it at all. No inquiry was made as whether I had pre-existing insurance for accident, illness or unemployment. I was not given a copy of the insurance policy nor were any rights to cancel explained. I believe you manifestly failed in your fiduciary responsibilities, your duty of care.

 

Secondly, I understand under the Consumer Credit Acts and following a House of Lords judgment, that you are not allowed to make a loan conditional on taking PPI unless you include the costs of PPI as part of the charge for credit and not the credit itself.

 

You did not do this. You added it to the total for credit and then charged me further interest on the premium on top of the interest for the loan. This is unacceptable.

 

Finally I believe insurance contracts are contracts uberrimae fidei (contracts of the utmost good faith) which imposes on you a “duty of disclosure of all material facts because one party is in a strong position to know the truth.” Inter alia, I believe that you should have disclosed to me that the type of policy you sold me, a single payment premium, did not give a pro-rata refund in event of early settlement. I believe you should have made it clear to me that the policy generated large profits for you. You failed to do this. I believe that you have also therefore failed in your duty of disclosure. Your failure to disclose is misrepresentation at common law.

 

What I require

 

Your concealment of the act of mis-selling has prevented me from asserting my right until now. I believe that there are strong grounds for action against you under common law, statute and consumer regulations.

 

The original premium was £XXXXadded to the loan amount on the 4th April 2001. I presume that interest at 8.9% was added to this amount.(unless you can inform me otherwise). Interest XXXXXXTotal amount £XXXXX The Statutory 8% interest (S69 of the County Court Act) allowed by the Courts will amount to £XXXXXXMaking the total amount payable at the Court Stage £XXXX

My targets to resolve this matter

I am writing to ask you to refund the premium paid together with interest equal to your APR at the time under the accepted principle of mutuality and reciprocity.

I hope that you will enter into a sincere dialogue with me about this matter and I am writing this letter to you on the assumption that you will prefer to do this than merely respond with standard letters and leaflets. I will give you 14 days to reply to me accepting, unconditionally, my request in principle and letting me know a date by which I will receive this payment.

 

If you do not respond, or you do not respond positively, within this time period, I shall send you a letter before action giving you a further 14 days in which to reflect. I believe that this time frame is sufficient for a large company such as yours with its dedicated staff and departments. After that, there will be no further communication from me and I shall issue a claim at the expiry of the second deadline.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

 

Hope this gives you a idea

anybody got any other advice.

 

 

 

 

[reidnet]

Arghhhhhhhhh the ferrets Back...lol

[hannah8686]

well i goot my SAR through. the cheque has not been cashed thou which i am quite shocked by. about £200 worth of charges, i am in arrears by £650 at the moment i am still paying the standered payment and have not missed a payment since last year but have not been able to make up payments yet, hopeing the charges etc will reduce this right down lol.

 

Pr lim will go for charges tommorow

[itsmeandonlyme]

well i goot my SAR through. the cheque has not been cashed thou which i am quite shocked by. about £200 worth of charges, i am in arrears by £650 at the moment i am still paying the standered payment and have not missed a payment since last year but have not been able to make up payments yet, hopeing the charges etc will reduce this right down lol.

 

Pr lim will go for charges tommorow

 

 

well done you:))keep going...do not forget to send a FSA a copy...and FLA...i believe if WF wouldn't refund before the court stage..you can show the judge you did everything you could and gave WF more time and chances to refund......

 

 

Good Luck

[reidnet]

The more you exhaust these Companies Complaints procedures will look better in court. At least it will show that you have tried all resonable ways to resolve the complaint without having to use the already busy court system.

 

Ian

[hannah8686]

Well, i finally rec'd a reply to my initial complaint that i sent some weeks, ago

 

It said this

 

 

Dear Mr Blick (its on behalf of my husband)

 

Thankyou for bringing to or attension your concerns regarding the service you have recieved

 

I have now reviewed all outstanding issues and thankyou for remaining patient.

 

After looking into this your complaint i have found the following options available to you.

 

. the payment protection that was sold as part of your original loan was subject to a pro rata renbate when the loan was stlled by your second loan. we therfore are unable to refund this.

 

In order to remove you the optional insurances from your current agreement new contracts must be signed. please arrange an appointment with the above office to arrange this

 

then just the normal rubbish about ombudsman etc etc.

 

 

 

so what a load of Bull**t that is

 

any way not all of it is correct so it just shows how much they did look into it.

 

the first loan was paid off a year before the second loan was taken out not by the second loan etc, and we did not select ppi on the second loan, it was selected by them without our knowledge when we topped it up.

 

So im going to writ another letter.

 

now i have details of the charges etc aswell do you thinki i should

 

1, write a new prelim, put the charges and PPi in 1 complaint, then when court comes around it can all be done together.

 

2, keep it as 2 seperate complaints??

 

I also have details of telephone conversations in the SAR, it does mention the PPi and that they are hgoing to cancel it etc, they still havent so i do have proof that i have asked and they havent, just no proof it was missold. i suppose the biggest thing is for them to prove they havent

 

any help would be appreciated

 

thanks

hannah

[hannah8686]

Just realised i never updated this, basically i discovered that my local office had been closed - i heard this was due to the malpractice etc but not 100% sure

 

So i wrote to the new area manager who was actually rreally nice about the whole complaint.

 

What they did was, re-write the loan kind of (*sounds bad i know but really wasnt)

 

What then happened was my loan account was credited with the full value of medicare and payment protection. She then refunded all my charges - everything except the initial set up cost of £50

 

then she lowered my payment by £25

 

so my husbands account was credited by over 2K and my payments reduced. when i started the complaint my loan balance was about 3500, its now only 830 quid

 

im so happy with the result, anyone else i suggest you just persist cause i managed it with no court etc etc

[itsmeandonlyme]

Congratulation

Very happy for you....

Well done:)

[hellhasnofury]

Just realised i never updated this, basically i discovered that my local office had been closed - i heard this was due to the malpractice etc but not 100% sure

 

So i wrote to the new area manager who was actually rreally nice about the whole complaint.

 

What they did was, re-write the loan kind of (*sounds bad i know but really wasnt)

 

What then happened was my loan account was credited with the full value of medicare and payment protection. She then refunded all my charges - everything except the initial set up cost of £50

 

then she lowered my payment by £25

 

so my husbands account was credited by over 2K and my payments reduced. when i started the complaint my loan balance was about 3500, its now only 830 quid

 

im so happy with the result, anyone else i suggest you just persist cause i managed it with no court etc etc

 

Excellent new Hannah,

 

It does go to prove that if you keep going with no let up, they will pay up:-D