My Pending Charges Claim Against HSBC

[Spiceskull]

Oh dear, will they ever learn. Just logged on to my account, and I see that another £50 of charges are due to be applied to my account on 7th July. This raises two interesting points:

• They will receive another letter, and another invoice, requesting the removal
  
• They will need to explain how they intend to apply the charges, considering that they are closing the account on June 26th. If I do not have an account on 7th July, it implies that there is no contract. If they apply the charges as stated, how will they be able to enforce them, as the contract will have expired on June 26th...

Oh well...more fun in the pipeline.

 

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

[simm1701]

Can a solicitor tell you that all communication has to go through them....

 

I know I can tell someone that all future communication has to go through my solicitor.... but not sure if the solicitor can initiate it.

 

The second question on that is can a bank supposedly supplying a service insist all communication goes through their solicitors....

 

I suspet they could if the clarififed it as "all communication on this matter" but in the general case while you have an account open with them..... might be a breach the responsibilities that banks are required to follow.... (even though DG are part of HSBC... I wonder if that depeartment has increased head count recently)

[simm1701]

I must have missed something.... why are they closing the account?

 

Or did you ask them to?

[ehake]

Hello i am about to ask HSBC for my overdraft charges back. Could you help me with advice on how to/ what to write in the first letter. Should it be to the Ombudsman? Do you have a copy i could use?

Thanks

Ed

 

[steve!]

Spiceskull: Did it occur to you that they might not actually have the facility to stop all future charges? You know, like someone hasn't taken the time yet to program a button that someone clicks called "Override all charges" or something. I know it sounds dappy, but it's all electronic and their systems will be immense. And if what you're doing is a first then they won't be prepared for it.

 

Either way, I like your style. If you can charge them £75 for posting a letter then all power to you.

[bram stoker]

Spiceskull: Did it occur to you that they might not actually have the facility to stop all future charges? You know, like someone hasn't taken the time yet to program a button that someone clicks called "Override all charges" or something. I know it sounds dappy, but it's all electronic and their systems will be immense. And if what you're doing is a first then they won't be prepared for it.

 

Either way, I like your style. If you can charge them £75 for posting a letter then all power to you.

We discussed this and how it almost proves an automated system with no manual intervention facility actually possible!

[Spiceskull]

Sorry guys - I've been out tonight, and will get back on this tomorrow. It is only after a couple of beers that I realise how convoluted and complicated this is going to become...at 18:00 today it was just amusing...now I can see many opportunistic avenues opening up before my eyes...

[mailmannz]

StrThat said, I did receive a letter from DG, stating that in future ALL communications are to be through them. Right...I don't ever remember opening a bank account with them, or indeed nominating them to act as my fiduciary...indeed, I have never actually requested that they write to me at all...

 

Ask the solicitors if they have a local branch so you can go down and withdraw your money through them

 

Mailman

[Spiceskull]

Update - letter received Saturday 24th, indicating charges to be applied on 7th July:

 

Letter requesting refund (with further invoice attached):

On Saturday I received a further statement from HSBC, stating their intent to unlawfully apply penalty charges to my account on 7th July to the sum of £50. Clearly my letter of 28th April has been ignored, and I find myself writing to you for the fourth time, and requesting that these penalty charges are not applied to my account.

 

As you are no doubt aware, I have, in the past, asked you to demonstrate to me that these punitive charges are fair and just, that they are lawful, and that they are being lawfully applied. I have also asked you to demonstrate that they represent a true cost to the bank of the bank's actions, or that they represent a fair pre-estimate of cost for those actions. You have failed to demonstrate this to date, and therefore it is implied by your refusal or inability to supply such demonstration, that these penalties are, indeed, unlawful.

 

I have also asked you to clarify how these charges can continue to be applied in defiance of the OFT statement of 5th April. When the OFT makes a ruling, then creditors are expected, and indeed required, to comply.

 

Furthermore, you will be aware from my account history that the bank has refunded earlier applications of these penalty charges on 7th April and 7th May. Additionally, after raising a claim in the courts, the bank credited my account with refunded penalty charges in the sum of £x,xxx.xx, plus court costs plus interest at 8% APR.

 

I would draw your attention to the following point: you have stated that these charges will be applied on 7th July. If these charges ARE applied, then you will be required to explain why you have, in my view, committed a pre-meditated breach of the law, and I will be reporting such breach to all of the relevant authorities. However, as this has not yet happened, I require that you take action forthwith, and cancel this transaction prior to its execution. Furthermore, I require confirmation, in writing, that this transaction will, indeed, be cancelled.

 

You therefore have until 7th July, to prevent these penalty charges from being applied. I am fully aware that my account will have ceased to be operational by this date, and therefore I fail to comprehend how the bank will be able to apply charges to a terminated account. Clearly this is yet further proof, if proof were needed, of the fully automated processes operated by the bank, and therefore that no manual intervention occurs whatsoever. Additionally, and due to this automation, it further demonstrates the ludicrous, and frankly piratical, regime of penalty charges that the bank applies.

 

I would also draw your attention to my letter of 28th April. This indicated that should I find myself in the position that further actions by HSBC required manual intervention on my part to correct breaches committed by HSBC, I would be supplying you with an invoice to compensate me for my time and efforts. The bank has had eight weeks to either accept or decline this condition, and it is implied by your silence on this matter that the term is acceptable. Therefore I enclose an invoice to the sum of £75.00 with this request. Please settle this account within 28 days.

To further add spice to the stew, I received a telephone call this evening - my response to this call:

Last evening I received a telephone call from someone purporting to be from HSBC. They were more than insistent that before proceeding with the call that I should divulge my security details.

 

I am not in the habit of divulging security details to someone calling from an unknown number, purporting to be from HSBC, as to do so would be a breach of the terms and conditions of my account.

 

The person then offered to confirm my date of birth, address and postcode to me, to verify that they were indeed calling from HSBC. I refused this offer, as this would have meant being a party to HSBC breaching all the regulations governing Data Protection. As I am currently in the habit of recording my telephone calls, I have a recording of this conversation on file.

 

I shall be reporting this attempted breach to The Information Commissioner, as well as supplying a copy of this sound file. I also request that HSBC deal with the member of staff concerned, as I would be horrified to learn that HSBC agents are willing to give my personal security details to anyone who answers my telephone. In these days of identity theft, this could result in all manner of criminal activity being committed in my name.

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

[sparkey1]

They never learn do they. Another bank took two direct debits instead of one. I asked for £25 compensation and warned that the next time I would ask for £37.50 and would raise my demand by £12.50 every month they took the money. I based the initial charge on their own scale of charges. They agreed to the compensation and paid up. The following month it happened again. So they paid £37.50.

 

Great service. HSBC learn from this.

[Spiceskull]

They never learn do they. Another bank took two direct debits instead of one. I asked for £25 compensation and warned that the next time I would ask for £37.50 and would raise my demand by £12.50 every month they took the money. I based the initial charge on their own scale of charges. They agreed to the compensation and paid up. The following month it happened again. So they paid £37.50.

 

Great service. HSBC learn from this.

They paid compensation? You actually said you would charge them and they paid? Wow - that is unbelievable...looks like I have £150 coming my way...

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

[mailmannz]

Update - letter received Saturday 24th, indicating charges to be applied on 7th July

 

Thats interesting, I had £50 taken in charges for this month but received now correspondence. The previous 2 times this has happened I got an email from the bank stating the amounts being taken and what they based this on...but this time not a thing.

 

So it was on to the phone and 30 minutes later had the charges refunded and a note put on my account...but whether this note works is another thing altogether!

 

Regards

 

Mailman

[Spiceskull]

A further interesting development. The account was apparently closed yesterday - the bank wrote to me, stating categorically the the account would be closed on June 26th. Today I managed to log onto the account, rooted around in my details, and see that I still have an overdraft limit of £500...what, exactly, do they do in the offices of HSBC???

 

I also took a screen grab of the account, with the logging in date as today...just in case...

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

[norvernrob]

I have to say SS, your threads are a cracking read and everytime I look in there's something else that makes me grin.

 

Keep it up, great stuff!

[bze lizzy]

Hi,

 

I really could do with some help, I've been struggling to find a way to find the best advice to take on HSBC. My problem with them seems to have been going on FOR EVER. In fact it has been going on since 2004. I've been down to the branch so many times now I feel as if I've been camping out there. At first they made polite noises & attempted to help but that wasn't their motive. Every month they have been charging me for being overdrawn plus interest charges too. Most times they have been charging me 24hrs before they know my wages go into my account. This is SO UNFAIR & VERY UNREASONABLE, when I told them that their unfair charges were making matters worse & to please do something about it after all I'd been a customer of theirs for some time now. All I was met with was " there's nothing we can do".

 

Good customer service! I don't think so.

 

bze lizzy

[Spiceskull]

Hi Lizzy,

 

You have come to the right place.

 

The first thing you need to do is read the forum material thoroughly A first port of call should be "step by step instructions" in the FAQs.

 

Then you should have a look at the library, the templates and all the other FAQs. You should also check out some of the completed claims in the HSBC forum. My own is a good example, but there are many others as well, so have a good read.

 

This is going to take a couple of days, and is well worth it. Don't forget, claiming a refund of bank charges could end up in court. You need to be fully prepared for this eventuality.

 

Finally, need to start your own thread in the HSBC forum - something like lizzie v HSBC. Here you can ask all your questions, and people will be able to answer them all in one place.

 

Good luck.

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

[sparkey1]

Thats right they did pay up, although as I said that was another bank not HSBC. That said other companies have good service. For example whenever I take items back to a store I always ask for petrol money. Ikea is one company that always pays. (Although the money is then spent in the cafe!)

 

About 2 weeks ago the Tonight program on ITV was about bank charges. Following the program I requested £30 back from First Direct via their email service for a fee charged in 2004. It was paid back within 48 hrs.

 

However when I sent the same email to HSBC for other charges they fobbed us off. So I looked on the web and found this website.

 

Ironic, if they had paid up then the matter would have been closed. No more said. Now of course I have told my friends and they will now be seeking repayment of their bank charges and I have sent my first formal claim letter.

 

What amazes me is the fact that they know we are on this site, and they know we are all going to follow our claims through to settlement. By not holding their hands up, apologising and refunding the money within 24 hours they are giving more momentum to the campaign which will lead to more people claiming their charges back.

 

If everyone claimed for their time based upon the banks own charges, I am confident that the banks would lower their charges to something more reasonable. (ie a few pence)

 

Good luck in claiming for your time.

[sparkey1]

and whilst I think about it. Although I don't know the HSBC system, most software products have some sort of override for charges and discounts. For example I used to work for an IT wholesaler. Every customer had an account and the default delivery charge was £10. However it was possible to set the delivery to £0, £3.50 , £5 or £7.50 as a default when a supervisor inputed a code into a field. It was also possible for individual sales staff to increase the delivery charge to reflect the actual costs. Although they couldn't lower the charge. Banks must have the same types of system. Ie They should be able to change individual charges for customers by changing a field. Therefore common sense dictates that you don't keep charging a customer who is going to claim back every illegal charge when you could simply override the default charge and set it to zero.

[Spiceskull]

Oh my - I'm going to have so much fun. Today, for the fourth day in a row, I received a call from someone claiming to be from HSBC. On each occasion they were determined to get me to reveal my security details, and they tried to argue Data Protection Act for this.

 

Spicey, being the awkward git that I am, countered with exactly the same DPA argument for NOT providing security details to someone calling from an unknown number, and claiming to be from HSBC. Each time I asked that they write instead, and today I received a letter.

 

The letter was quite simple, noticing that my overdraft limit had been breached, and confirming that bank charges had been applied to my account. In a nutshell, to avoid further bank charges HSBC wanted to discuss upping my overdraft...!...on an account that has been closed for FOUR days...!

 

Today's 'phone call was the last straw, and I resolved to put a stop to them. First was a call-centre monkey, followed by their supervisor, followed by the senior supervisor and finally the call-centre manager/ess. After finally revealing my date of birth (I knew it was HSBC all along) we got to the point of the call - my overdraft and what was I going to do about it.

 

I queried why a call was necessary for a closed account, and she was completely unaware of this. She then put me on hold whilst she called my branch, and then informed me that I would receive a call from my branch...in Essex. R...i...i...ight! My branch is in Kingston, so ten minutes was spent discussing why she lied to me.

 

I then went on to ask why she thought my account was overdrawn. HSBC owe me over £4K in unlawful bank charges, so my account is in credit by thousands of pounds...additionally, the invoice I raised, for "manual intervention," is due to be settled today. "Can you tell me when these monies will be credited to my account...?"

 

I admit it, I am a complete and utter bar steward. She was completely flummoxed, none of the relevant information was to hand, and I kept her on the 'phone for 59 minutes and 36 seconds. I am suffering a severe overdose of smug satisfaction...which only leaves me with a letter to write.

 

To be continued...

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

[Spiceskull]

I have been really busy for the last couple of weeks, trying to fill my blunderbuss in preparation of hitting HSBC with everything. However, a couple of points have come to light in the last couple of days, and I wanted to quickly share them with all my fans (:o)

 

The charges pending of £50, due to go out tomorrow (7th) will now not do so. A letter from DG Solicitors indicated that the charge would be reversed. They also indicated that "...there is no chance of HSBC meeting your invoices..."

 

As we all know, my invoices, in respect of "manual intervention" are £75 a time.

 

This morning I received a letter, stating that £125 would be credited to my (closed) account, and that this would be in respect of "refund of charges." I don't know where £125 comes from...

 

Having just checked the account online, I can see that £75 has been refunded in respect of "refund of charges..."

 

What has happened is clear, assuming that the bank have not just bal*sed it up: the charges pending (£50) will go out and be refunded again tomorrow. The £75, which would be the balance of the mentioned £125, can only be for the outstanding invoice - I have no other correspondence relating to £75.

 

I will try to get to the bottom of all this, but this is what I believe has happened...:lol:

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

[barracad]

Fantastic!!

[Bookworm]

Confusing.

[Movingon]

The charges pending of £50, due to go out tomorrow (7th) will now not do so. A letter from DG indicated that the charge would be reversed. They also indicated that "...there is no chance of HSBC meeting your invoices..."

 

So.. they have told you that they are going to be breaking the Law, having "signed" your contract by not responding to your notification letter... and then pay you anyway just to shut you up!!

 

If you wanted to be mischievous you could tell them that you were only owed £50 in refund of bank charges this time and that they should therefore take the £75 back; but there's still the matter of your separate invoice for £75 which remains as yet unpaid...

 

Sounds like fun to me though!

[Spiceskull]

I haven't even had a chance to respond to the £125 refund letter. When I do so, I will ask them to detail what the £125 is for, as I only made a request that £50 be refunded.

 

To add to the fun, I received a separate letter that opened "...following your instruction to close the above HSBC account..."

 

My instruction? Sorry mate - to suggest that I issued that instruction is slander, and a gross slur on my character...etc etc...:-)

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

[Sarah139]

Everybody seems to be getting money back - I will be filing a court claim against them tomorrow. not really had anything positive from them yet - just your basic standard letters. Is it going to happen - or am I just wasting my time.

 

I am really nervous - I bet they take it all the way

 

Good luck in pusing your charges by the way.