Claimform Carter/Lowell old welcome rewrite of a car finance 'debt' - already VT'd

[dx100uk]

yes ofcourse it does

 

 

dx

[AndyOrch]

Responding to your PM BM

 

If you could bring forward their particulars of claim.

 

Andy

[BIGMAN2708]

Okay. Just to clarify the following points. Even though they have cashed the cheque there is nothing to say that I will receive the documents prior to me submitting my defence. If this is the case, do I still submit the holding defence letter? Or if I do receive the CCA request documents, can I still defend the claim? Thanks.

[BIGMAN2708]

Responding to your PM BM

 

If you could bring forward their particulars of claim.

 

Andy

 

Hi, sorry to sound stupid but what do you mean by “bring forward their particulars of claim”?

[AndyOrch]

The wording on the claim form exactly what they are claiming ...verbatim less any accounts numbers.

[BIGMAN2708]

THE CLAIMANTS CLAIM IS FOR THE SUM OF 6032.19

BEING MONIES DUE FROM THE DEFENDANT TO THE CLAIMANT UNDER AN AGREEMENT REGULATED

BY THE consumer credit ACT 1974 BETWEEN THE DEFENDENT AND WELCOME FINANCE

UNDER ACCOUNT REFERENCE ///// AND ASSIGNED TO THE CLAIMANT ON 05/09/2012

 

NOTICE OF WHICH HAS BEEN GIVEN TO THE DEFENDANT.

 

THE DEFENDANT FAILED TO MAINTAIN CONTRACTUAL REPAYMENT UNDER THE TERMS OF THE AGREEMENT AND

 

A DEFAULT NOTICE HAS BEEN SERVED WHICH HAS NOT BEEN COMPLIED WITH.

 

THE CLAIM INCLUDES STATUTORY interest PURSUANT TO S.69 OF THE COUNTY ACT 1984

AT A RATE OF 8% PER ANNUM (A DAILY RATE OF 1.32)

FROM THE DATE OF ASSIGNMENT OF THE AGREEMENT

TO DATE BUT LIMITED TO A MAXIMUM OF ONE YEAR AMOUNTING TO 66.11

[AndyOrch]

This was a car that you VT..they sold the vehicle and assigned the debt and are now claiming the difference ? Or the total value?

 

How much did you borrow initially ....how much did you pay back.... what was the last payment date?

 

You have requested a copy of the agreement ...they have yet to comply....have you also requested information via CPR?

 

Andy

[BIGMAN2708]

Hi. Attached is an amended defence letter containing your advice regards bringing claim forward.

[AndyOrch]

The above means nothing to me Im afraid BM.... if you could answers the points in my last post...then we can start to construct a defence.

[BIGMAN2708]

Hi,

this loan was a rewrite of an original loan for £13,820.64 (inc. interest)

paid off £6184.68,

there were lots of ridiculous charges added to this account which I disputed but was never resolved.

 

 

The rewrite amount was for £8257 with interest added £14368.80, paid back £1257.14.

 

 

Last payment 25/10/2008 for £119.74.

 

 

Requested CCA to Claimaint on 31st August,

no response yet but have noticed that £1 cheque fee was cashed this morning.

 

 

CPR sent to Solicitors on same date,

received letter back stating that they would not supply requested documents.

 

 

Attached are statements and letter from Solicitors.

[AndyOrch]

So just outside the statute barred limitation....tell me about the car you VT.....what happened...was it credited back to your account?

Was this an HP agreement or personal finance?

[BIGMAN2708]

Yes it us unfortunately.

 

 

I had to VT as my wife had been seriously ill and was unable to work so debts were mounting.

 

 

Welcome did nothing but hassle me constantly so ended up having to VT as I had already defaulted.

 

 

The car was constantly breaking down and with my wife being partially disabled from her illness

I needed a car that was reliable to transport her to hospital.

 

They credited me approx £1200 for the sale of the car.

The original loan was HP but on the rewrite I cannot see anywhere on the form that it is a HP Agreement,

but assume it was as the loan was against the car.

[AndyOrch]

Very confusing this

 

You bought a car and requested a HP loan from welcome for £13,820.64 (inc. interest)

You made payments of £6184.68,

You VT the car they credited £1200

 

What is voluntary surrender? Voluntary surrender means that you volunteer to give the car back to the finance company but still have to pay what you owe - your debt does not disappear with the car. You sign a voluntary surrender form, the finance company sells the car and the money they get goes towards your debt but you will still have to make repayments until the entire debt is paid off.

 

The ‘half-rule’ is part of the Consumer Credit Act, 1995 and gives you the right to end a hire purchase agreement at any time. Your documentation (the agreement) from the finance company must show the figure for half the hire purchase price of the car. The ‘half-rule’ allows you to end the hire purchase agreement and limits your liability to half the hire purchase price of the car.

 

You do not have to pay half the hire purchase price to the finance company before you return the car using the half rule. A recent High Court decision clarified this. If you have not paid half the hire purchase price you can still return the car. However, you will still owe the difference between the payments you have made and half the hire purchase price .

 

 

 

You then requested a further loan (unsure if its a HP or personal loan) for £8257 with interest added £14368.80, paid back £1257.14.

 

Why did you request a further advance ?

[BIGMAN2708]

Hi, sorry for the confusion.

 

 

it is the other way round regarding finance.

 

 

I original took out a HP agreement for £13,820.64,

got into arrears with it after paying back £6184.68.

 

 

They then advised me to rewrite the agreement for £8257 plus interest so they didn’t have to repo the car.

 

 

I then got into further difficulties as explained earlier after paying back £1257.14.

 

 

It is at this point that I VT’d the vehicle.

 

 

The original loan of £13,820.64 is made up of the loan, interest and PPI.

[BIGMAN2708]

Hi Andyorch, did my last reply make a bit more sense?

[AndyOrch]

So in effect you owe them as per their claim?

[AndyOrch]

Particulars of Claim

 

1.THE CLAIMANTS CLAIM IS FOR THE SUM OF 6032.19 BEING MONIES DUE FROM THE DEFENDANT TO THE CLAIMANT UNDER AN AGREEMENT REGULATED

BY THE consumer credit ACT 1974 BETWEEN THE DEFENDANT AND WELCOME FINANCE UNDER ACCOUNT REFERENCE /////

 

2.AND ASSIGNED TO THE CLAIMANT ON 05/09/2012 NOTICE OF WHICH HAS BEEN GIVEN TO THE DEFENDANT.

 

3.THE DEFENDANT FAILED TO MAINTAIN CONTRACTUAL REPAYMENT UNDER THE TERMS OF THE AGREEMENT AND A DEFAULT NOTICE HAS BEEN SERVED WHICH HAS NOT BEEN COMPLIED WITH.

 

4.THE CLAIM INCLUDES STATUTORY interest PURSUANT TO S.69 OF THE COUNTY ACT 1984 AT A RATE OF 8% PER ANNUM (A DAILY RATE OF 1.32)

FROM THE DATE OF ASSIGNMENT OF THE AGREEMENT TO DATE BUT LIMITED TO A MAXIMUM OF ONE YEAR AMOUNTING TO 66.11

[BIGMAN2708]

So in effect you owe them as per their claim?

 

Yes. But there are charges and interest on there that I disputed but they sold the debt on. Not received CCA docs in post today. Can I still defend?

[AndyOrch]

Have you totalled those charges and interest and PPI ? you may be able to defend using a set off defence.

[AndyOrch]

Clocks ticking BM ...Im logging off for dinner now so here is an example of a set off defence...you will have to edit and substitute the particulars and make the defence fit your points 1/2/3/4.

 

Insert your figures as to how much you wish to set off.

 

 

Regards

 

Andy

Edited September 23, 2014 by Andyorch
Defence example removed

[BIGMAN2708]

Thanks Andy. I have compiled my defence using the information you supplied. Will send this to you via PM for you to check over if that is okay. Many thanks.

[dx100uk]

best to ost it here just remove any id

 

 

dx

[AndyOrch]

Okay that fine..checked and amended ....you dont submit your particulars ...just the defence .

 

Regards

 

Andy

[BIGMAN2708]

Here you go... Would someone be so kind to get back to me before 11pm please. Need to get it uploaded on Moneyclaim website. Many thanks.

 

Particulars of Claim

 

1.The Claimant claims the whole of the outstanding balance due and payable under an agreement referenced XXXXXXX and opened effective from 31/08/2007. The agreement is regulated by the consumer credit Act 1974. was signed by the Defendant and from which credit was extended to the Defendant.

 

2. The Defendant failed to make payment as required and a default was recorded. As at 22/08/2014 the Defendant owed Lowell Portfolio I Limited the sum of 6,098.30.

 

3. By an agreement in writing the debt has been legally assigned to the claimant effective 05/09/2012 and made regular upon the Claimant serving a Notice of Assignment upon the Defendant shortly thereafter.

 

4. And the Claimant claims:- 1. 6,098.30 2. interest pursuant to Section 69 county court Act(1984) at a rate of 8% per Annum from 05/09/2012 to 04/09/2013 of 66.11.

 

Defence & Set Off

 

1.The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.This defence is made pursuant to CPR 16.6 (a/b) as a defence of set off.

 

2.Paragraph 1 is noted I have in the past had credit facilities under the agreement reference referred to with xxxxxxxx.The account is currently in dispute with regards to its crippling oppressive historic unfair charges and penalty fees regime and interest being levied to this account. It is averred that any alleged balance consists completely of charges and not of any indebtedness from the defendant.

 

3.Paragraph 2 is denied neither xxxxxxxx or the Claimant has served a Default Notice pursuant to sec87(1) of the CCA 1974. Furthermore It is questioned whether as an assignee they have legal right to register a default after assignment. Welcome Finance are fully aware of the dispute and why payments were reduced having received intended notice of litigation.

 

4.Paragraph 3 is accepted, due to the above xxxxxxxx quickly assigned the debt as they were aware of impending litigation and the ongoing dispute.

 

5.Paragraph 4 is denied not only as the claimant states a different value earlier in its pleadings but is and remains in default of a section 78 request.,also failed to serve Notice of Sums In Arrears pursuant to the CCA 2006 amendments and is therefore prevented from seeking any relief or realise any surety.

 

6. Therefore it is denied with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant ,as per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed and therefore the Claimant is put to strict proof to:

 

(a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement with the Claimant; and

(b) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for; and

© show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim;

 

8. On the alternative, if the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of theconsumer credit Act 1974.

 

9.Incorporated within the sums demanded by the Claimant are sums claimed for their administration fees, late payment charges over limit penalties and like provisions. It is denied (if it be alleged) that the Claimant has incurred any such fees and charges, alternatively that such fees and charges if incurred accurately represent sums lost by the Claimant by reason of late payment.I the Defendant aver the incorporation of such claims are penal and unenforceable at law.

 

10.To quantify the above in set off since 11th June 2004 the fees applied to this account accumulate to

£5452.38 excluding interest.

At 24.90% accruing daily equate to £6,810.02.

 

11.It is therefore requested pursuant to CPR 16.6 (a&b) that any Judgment the court deems fit be set off to a fair and justifiable amount and that my defence should be taken into account.

 

12.In the circumstances with the facts and matters set out given the Particulars of Claim do not give rise to an entitlement to claim the relief now sought .The Claimants have not established any legal right to issue a claim or proven that any debt exists. It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant’s claim be set off against this defence.

[AndyOrch]

Dont submit that version...but the one I have already checked for you and amended