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    • Please see my comments in orange within your post.
    • no i meant the email from parcel2go which email address did they send it from and who signed it off (whos name is at the bottom)
    • I understand confusion with this thread.  I tried to keep threads separate because there have been so many angles.    But a team member merged them all.  This is why it's hard to keep track. This forum exists to help little people fight injustice - however big or small.  Im here to try get a decent resolution. Not to give in to the ' big boys'. My "matter' became complicated 'matters' simply because a lender refused to sell a property. What can I say?  I'll try in a nutshell to give an overview: There's a long lease property. I originally bought it short lease with a s.146 on it from original freeholder.  I had no concerns. So lender should have been able to sell a well-maintained lovely long lease property.  The property was great. The issue is not the property.  Economy, sdlt increases, elections, brexit, covid, interest hikes etc didn't help.  The issue is simple - the lender wanted to keep it.   House or Flat? Before repo I offered to clear my loan.  I was a bit short and lender refused.  They said (recorded) they thought the property was worth much more and they were happy to keep accruing interest (in their benefit) until it reached a point where they felt they could repo and still easily quickly sell to get their £s back.  This was a mistake.  The market was (and is) tough.   2y later the lender ceo bid the same sum to buy the property for himself. He'd rejected higher offers in the intervening period whilst accruing interest. Lenders have a legal obligation to sell the property for the best price they can get. If they feel the offer is low they won't sell it, because it's likely the borrower will say the same. I had the property under offer to a fantastic niche buyer but lender rushed to repo and buyer got spooked and walked.  It had taken a long time to find such a lucrative buyer.  A sale which would have resulted in £s and another asset for me. Post repo lender had 1 offer immediately.  But dragged out the process for >1y - allegedly trying to get other offers. But disclosure shows there was only one valid buyer. Again, points as above. Lender appointed receiver (after 4 months) - simply to try acquire the freehold.  He used his powers as receiver to use me, as leaseholder, to serve notice on freeholders.  Legally that failed. Meanwhile lender failed to secure property - and squatters got in (3 times).  And they failed to maintain it.  So freeholders served a dilapidations notice (external) - on me as leaseholder (cc-ed to lender).   (That's how it works legally) Why serve a delapidations notice? If it's in the terms of the lease to maintain the property to a good standard, then serve an S146 notice instead as it's a clear breach of the lease. I don't own the freehold.  But I am a trustee and have to do right by the freeholders.  This is where matters got/ get complicated.  And probably lose most caggers.   Lawyers got involved for the freeholders to firstly void the receiver enfranchisement notice. Secondly, to serve the dilapidations notice.  The lack of maintenance was in breach of lease and had to be served to protect fh asset. Enfranchisement isn't something that can be "voided", it's in the Leasehold Reform Act 1967 that leaseholders have the right to buy the freehold of the property. It's normal, whether it is a "normal" leaseholder or a repossession with a leasehold house, to claim this right of enfranchisement and sell the property with said rights attached and the purchase price of the freehold included in the final completion price. That's likely what the mortgage provider wished to do. The lender did no repairs. They said a buyer would undertake them. Which was probably correct. If they had sold. After 1y lender finally agreed to sell to the 1st offeror and contracts went with lawyers.  Within 1 month lender reneged.  Lender tried to suggest buyer walked. Evidence shows he/ his lawyers continued trying to exchange (cash) for 4 months.  Evidence shows lender and receiver strategy had been to renege and for ceo to take control.   I still think that's their plan. Redact and scan said evidence up for others to look at? Lender then stupidly chose to pretty much bulldoze the property.  Other stuff was going on in the background. After repo I was in touch by phone and email and lender knew post got to me.   Despite this, after about 10 months (before and then during covid), they deliberately sent SDs and eventually a B petition to an incorrect address and an obscure small court.  They never served me properly.  (In hindsight I understand they hoped to get a backdoor B - so they could keep the property that way.)  Eventually the random court told them to email me by way of service.  At this point their ruse to make me B failed.  I got a lawyer (friend paid). The B petition was struck out. They’d failed to include the property as an asset. They were in breach of insolvency rules. So this is dealt with then. Simultaneously the receiver again appointed lawyers to act on my behalf as leaseholder. This time to serve notice on the freeholders for a lease extension.  He had hoped to try and vary the strict lease. Evidence shows the already long length of lease wasn't an issue.  The lender obviously hoped to get round their lack of permission to do works (which they were already doing) by hoping to remove the strict clauses that prevent leaseholder doing alterations.  You wouldn't vary a lease through a lease extension. You'd need a Deed of Variation for that. This may be done at the same time but the lease has already been extended once and that's all they have a right to. The extension created a new legal angle for me to deal with.  I had to act as trustee for freeholders against me as leaseholder/ the receiver.  Inconsistencies and incompetence by receiver lawyers dragged this out 3y.  It still isn't properly resolved. The lease has already been extended once so they have no right to another extension. It seems pretty easy to just get the lawyer to say no and stick by those terms as the law is on your side there. Meanwhile - going back to the the works the lender undertook. The works were consciously in breach of lease.  The lender hadn't remedied the breaches listed in the dilapidations notice.  They destroyed the property.  The trustees compiled all evidence.  The freeholders lawyers then served a forfeiture notice. This notice started a different legal battle. I was acting for the freeholders against what the lender had done on my behalf as leaseholder.  This legal battle took 3y to resolve. Again, order them to revert it as they didn't have permission to do the works, or else serve an S146 notice for breach of the lease. The simple exit would have been for lender to sell. A simple agreement to remedy the breaches and recompense the freeholders in compensation - and there's have been clean title to sell.  That option was proposed to them.   This happened by way of mediation for all parties 2y ago.  A resolution option was put forward and in principle agreed.  But immediately after the lender lawyers failed to engage.  A hard lesson to learn - mediation cannot be referred to in court. It's considered w/o prejudice. The steps they took have made no difference to their ability to sell the property.  Almost 3y since they finished works they still haven't sold. ** ** I followed up some leads myself.  A qualified cash buyer offered me a substantial sum.  The lender and receiver both refused it.   I found another offer in disclosure.  6 months later someone had apparently offered a substantial sum via an agent.  The receiver again rejected it.  The problem of course was that the agent had inflated the market price to get the business. But no-one was or is ever going to offer their list price.  Yet the receiver wanted/wants to hold out for the list price.  Which means 1y later not only has it not sold - disclosure shows few viewings and zero interest.  It's transparently over-priced.  And tarnished. For those asking why I don't give up - I couldn't/ can't.  Firstly I have fiduciary duties as a trustee. Secondly, legal advice indicates I (as leaseholder) could succeed with a large compensation claim v the lender.  Also - I started a claim v my old lawyer and the firm immediately reimbursed some £s. That was encouraging.  And a sign to continue.  So I'm going for compensation.  I had finance in place (via friend) to do a deal and take the property back off the lender - and that lawyer messed up bad.   He should have done a deal.  Instead further years have been wasted.   Maybe I only get back my lost savings - but that will be a result.   If I can add some kind of complaint/ claim v the receiver's conscious impropriety I will do so.   I have been left with nothing - so fighting for something is worth it. The lender wants to talk re a form of settlement.  Similar to my proposal 2y ago.  I have a pretty clear idea of what that means to me.  This is exactly why I do not give up.  And why I continue to ask for snippets of advice/ pointers on cag.  
    • It was all my own work based on my previous emails to P2G which Bank has seen.
    • I was referring to #415 where you wrote "I was forced to try to sell - and couldn't." . And nearer the start in #79 .. "I couldn't sell.  I had an incredibly valuable asset. Huge equity.  But the interest accrued / the property market suffered and I couldn't find a buyer even at a level just to clear the debt." In #194 you said you'd tried to sell for four years.  The reason for these points is that a lot of the claims against for example your surveyor, solicitor, broker, the lender and now the receiver are mainly founded in a belief that they should have been able to do something but did not. Things that might seem self evident to you but not necessarily to others. Pressing these claims may well need a bit more hard evidence, rather than an appeal to common sense. Can you show evidence of similar properties, with similar freehold issues, selling readily? And solid reasons why the lender should have been able to sell when you couldn't.
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Gilly35
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I was very seriously ill and the debts defaulted because I was made redundant on medical grounds with a brain tumor.

 

The debts have caused me to have serious anxiety to the point that I am now agoraphobic.

 

I am scared of these companies and what they will do to me.

 

I couldn't cope with the letters and phone calls starting again....

 

seems to me that you've been duped on all your debts

 

sadly that's what happens where you are scared of them.

 

now you know.

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Wow ok....this helps. Nationwide was a personal loan not a bank account. Lloyds was a bank account

 

yes its getting confusing now

 

why don't you start a thread for each debt in the named bank forum

off the main forum tab top left

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Thank you so very much for all of your help.

It still feels like a minefield but I will make a start on all of it.

 

I will send a CCA to Idem for M&S and Nationwide personal loan and also the 2nd default needs a letter to Nationwide compliance manager.

 

I will go and try and search the site for templates for the default and start the CCA for the others.

 

Thank you again you have been an amazing help :)

 

Will do thank you

 

I wonder if anyone could help me.

 

I have been issued with 2 defaults on a Nationwide Personal Loan account.

 

One was in 2007 and one in 2013.

 

My understanding is that they can not issue 2 defaults on the same account.

 

I have been advised by the site team to start a new thread on this.

 

The site team told me I would need to write to Nationwide's compliance manager,

 

can anyone give me a letter template?

 

Also should I raise a CCA on this account?

 

I am very new to all of this and the debt has caused me really problems with anxiety

I am scared to move forward but the thought of a life with this hanging over my head is also not appealing.

 

I am looking to write a letter to Nationwide as they have put 2 defaults on the same account.

 

I have found the following letter but I wonder if someone would check over it for me and tell me if it is correct.

 

Also does anyone have the correct address for the Compliance manager at Nationwide that I should send this too?

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

 

FORMAL COMPLAINT UNDER YOUR CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 2006 COMPLAINTS PROCEDURE

NOTICE TO CORRECT DATA UNDER DATA PROTECTION ACT 1998

 

I note that you have 2 defaults registered against me in relation to account xxxxxxxxx originally issued by Nationwide Trust. This is against the guidelines issued by the information commissioner, and is an unfair practice.

 

Please take this as a request to correct data under the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

Please send me a copy of your complaints procedure as required by law, with acknowledgement of this formal complaint.

 

Yours Faithfully,

Edited by dx100uk
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just to clarify for readers

 

BOTH the defaults were issued by Nationwide themselves

 

and the debt is still owned by NW

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi, Are both these entries under the Nationwide name or is one in the name of a debt purchaser/DCA?

Any Letters I Draft are N0T approved by CAG and no personal liability is accepted.

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Nemo Mortalium Omnibus Horis Sapit: Animo et Fide:

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Ok you need to check Equifax or Experian (both have 30 day free trials).

My guess is you may have two default notices possibly with different dates, but NW have in my experience have sent two separate DNs to make sure that at least 1 is read by the account holder.

 

 

So you will have only on entry on CRA files.

 

 

If there is more than one entry on CRA files a simple letter to the Data Controller at NW is all that is needed to request the removal of one entry.

Any Letters I Draft are N0T approved by CAG and no personal liability is accepted.

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I have a Default Notice dated 8th December 2007 so this is no longer showing as it is over 6 years old.

The account is still not paid so they have issued me with another one dated 16th May 2013 which is showing on my CF.

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Gilly, I have answered on your other thread but, the situation appears different on this one.

 

I guess that what has happened here is that you remedied the first default and NW did NOT register a default on the account and did not report to CRA files which is all normal.

 

Then when payments failed NW defaulted the account and registered it with CRAs so only one entry will appear on the files.

 

Simply the issue of a DN does not mean a default has been put on credit files.

 

Gilly can you please keep to one thread on this.

 

Yes you may have a DN but that does not mean that a default was actually placed as you say in the other thread you remedied the default so NW would not have reported to the credit files.

 

You will see on the other thread a fully explanation you have only one entry on credit files.

 

I will ask the site team to merge the threads.

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Sorry about that, it is because I am new to this.

 

The account as far as I can recall did not get fixed until after the DN in 2007 was served.

 

I will need to look back at my statements but I am pretty sure it did default

then I brought it back into performing a few months later..

 

.. Does that mean they maybe cancelled the first DN?

 

Also the account was defaulting since 2011 but they served the DN in 2013..

 

.I kind of need to get this fixed as otherwise I have another 5 years of this nightmare :(

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Yes as said getting a DN does not mean the default was placed on the account and/or reported to the CRAs.

So only one default is showing on CRA files.

A SAR to NW will get you all the data on this.

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Nemo Mortalium Omnibus Horis Sapit: Animo et Fide:

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Ok I will raise a SAR

 

....what should I be looking for to see if the original DN was served?

 

Thank you for your help with this.

 

Also if the 2013 DN is correct would I maybe have a case for asking them to change the date to reflect when the account actually went in to DF?

 

Thank you for your help in this,

 

my apologies for being dumb

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Ok I will raise a SAR....what should I be looking for to see if the original DN was served? Thank you for your help with this. Also if the 2013 DN is correct would I maybe have a case for asking them to change the date to reflect when the account actually went in to DF? Thank you for your help in this, my apologies for being dumb
.

Yes you will be looking to see if the first DN was followed through, but if it was not then the 2013 DN will stand.

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Ok I will raise a SAR and come back to you when I have the information.

I am pretty gutted that I now have another 5 years to wait till I can clean up my file,

I hate that they have penalized me for being ill, it is very unfair.

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If the 2013 DN does stand would I have a case for asking for it to be backdated to when the account DF the second time? It would have been in 2011

 

I have had a look through my paperwork and the account defaulted in February of 2011.

 

However I reclaimed PPI and they put the money owed to the account reducing the overall debt.

 

Also they said that some of the PPI would count towards monthly payments and as such the account came out of default for a number of months but closed 2011 in default again.

 

The date of the second default notice and the one that is on my CF is 06/02/2013 on the credit file but on the Default Notice the date is 16/05/2013 with the date set to fix the arrears by 05/06/2013....

 

Then there is the issue of the first DFN from 2007.

 

So I will raise a SAR today but I just wanted to give this update and see what anyone thought.

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  • 1 month later...

Hi, an update on this.

 

I raised a SAR and I am still waiting for it to come back (today is the 40 day point)

 

however, I have looked at my credit report today via Noddle and this account has disappeared!

 

Do you think they have realised their mistake?

 

I have raised a dispute via Noddle which I know they are looking into.

 

Do they take disputed accounts off your file until they can check or has this been removed altogether?

 

I want to get excited that this has now been removed but I am concerned I am being premature..

 

..any advice as always would be most helpful.

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The default notice date is Not the date that the actual default is placed on an account it may be some time later.

 

 

The default notice date and the default date are not the same.

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Hi, thanks for responding.

Yes I understand that the two are not the same thing However it was 2 defaults one in 2007 and one in 2013 for the same account.

I raised the SAR to see if the 2007 Default notice was served and I am still awaiting the paperwork...

.however on checking my credit file today the account has disappeared...

so my questions are: have they realised their mistake or has the CRA removed the account as I have disputed it with them?

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Was the first default notice followed through and did a default entry appear on credit reference files?

If so what was the default date showing on the files then.

 

 

There is some confusion here post # we have the account "defaulted" in 2011 and " out of default" and back into default after some months, and the "original" DN in 2007.

 

 

I'm guessing here that none of the earlier DNs were followed through probably because of PPI reclaim payment and that the account was properly defaulted in 2013.

 

 

Also Noddle is not always reliable and seems often to be out of date, because it uses 2nd hand data from its parent call credit.

Any Letters I Draft are N0T approved by CAG and no personal liability is accepted.

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Ok sorry for the confusion hopefully I can clarify:

 

Checked CRF and saw that Nationwide had posted a default for 2013 for an account that I couldn't pay from 2010 onward.

 

I recalled that I had already got a default from them and

 

when I looked about the forum I saw that they could not file to DFN against the same account.

 

I found the paperwork for the notices however I was still not sure if the 2007 DFN had been served so I raised a SAR.

 

The SAR is due back now (today is the 40th day).

 

Up until 3 weeks ago Noddle was showing the account with the default date of 2013.

 

Today the account has disappeared from my file.

 

I raised a dispute with Noddle regarding the default dates and they are investigating.

 

My question is,

has Nationwide made a mistake, and the 2013 default should not be on my file and have removed it,

or has Noddle just taken the account off my file while they investigate?

 

Not to worry if nobody knows the answer,

I am sure all will be revealed with the SAR.

 

Thank you as always for your input and advice it is really welcomed and helpful

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As said the DNs are not defaults just notices that the account may be defaulted after a certain date if the situation is not remedied.

 

 

You can ask Noddle why this has been removed, personally I would check Experian and or Equifax to see what data the hold.

Any Letters I Draft are N0T approved by CAG and no personal liability is accepted.

Please Consider making a donation to keep this site running!

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  • 4 weeks later...

I have got the SAR back and there are 4 default notices that have been sent to me.

 

I have never received a sums in arrears notice before but just last week I finally got sent one...which I thought was odd.

 

the first default for 2007 said I had to bring the account back up-to-date by a certain date,

the statements after this show that the account was still in arrears but that I paid an extra £50 a month towards the arrears

whilst still paying the monthly agreed amount.

 

The other DFN are from 2010 till 2013 when the account completely defaulted.

 

The default on my CF is 2013.

 

Now I appreciate that I need to have the DFN however what I find unfair is that the clock has only started counting down since last year when the account has been in default since at the very latest March 2011.

 

Can I do anything to get them to change the default date?

 

Also if I was served a DFN in 2007 I can't see anywhere whether this notice,

or any of them for that matter, were ever served on my CF....

 

Because the DFN is supposed to fall off after 6 years I have no way of knowing if it was served.

 

However I got car finance in 2009 so I am thinking that is wasn't.

Edited by dx100uk
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Hi,

 

 

As you paid extra on top of the required payments the creditor did not default the account at that point, ( a fair and reasonable decision)

however when you failed to continue the agreed payments a further DN was issued (again correct procedure)

 

it would appear from what you say that the account was brought back to an agreed level between 2010 and 2013 and the once again broke down and a default was finally placed and recorded on CRA files in 2013.

 

All previous default notices are of no consequence now, the creditor has finally decided that the contractual " relationship" is not recoverable and had placed the default.

 

There is no reason what so ever in this situation for the default to be back dated.

 

If the terms of a DN are met by a debtor to the satisfaction of the creditor a default is not placed and not recorded on credit reference files.

 

Not what you wanted to hear I know but that is how it stands.

Any Letters I Draft are N0T approved by CAG and no personal liability is accepted.

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Nemo Mortalium Omnibus Horis Sapit: Animo et Fide:

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if the account has gone from the CRa file

 

I would suggest the accounts original default has run its course

and it & the Account have now been removed under the ICO guidelines.

 

wont matter how manymore DN's they issue

 

its gone ..end of it causing you Credit issues

 

though the debt of course still exists.

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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