I purchased a motorcycle via ebay auction Misdescribed-Vehicle court claim

[jsa986]

I purchased a motorcycle via ebay auction

 

The auction described "Excellent Condition" & "Custom Paint".

 

Contrary to this,

 

1. Vehicle broke down within 100 miles. Upon inspection by mechanical engineer it was found: Charging system not working, rectifier and/or stator defective (components that that charge the bikes battery system and electrics). Likely both are unusable. He informed me the new battery seller put on would have masked this problem for approx. 100 mile use. I suggest this shows priorer knowledge of the fault.

2. Faring cracked by right wing mirror

3. Fault indicator (fi) warning light illuminating. This means the bike has an undisclosed fault

4. Damage noted to Stator casing

5. Rear tail light indicator mounting broken/ lens insecure

6. Various scuffs and scratches not consistent with the description wording "excellent condition"

7. Missing inner offside fairing lining

8. Fairing linings insecure thorough out and missing fixings

9. vehicle there is NO custom paint, the bike is standard Suzuki black, with carbon fibre stickers/vinyl over the panels.

10. When i rang seller he informed me the vehicle had been recovered from his friend as a non runner

 

I have issued County court proceeding on the basis: My decision to enter into contract to purchase this vehicle was influenced by the wording in the auction: "Excellent condition" (which it is not) and the fact it had a custom paint job which it also did not have" .



No test ride could be taken as no MOT could be provided

 

This was an auction not a classified add, I was in legally binding contract to pay for the purchase as bidders and sellers signal their assent to eBay's umbrella terms of business when they participate in the site's activities.

 

My Question

The seller had decided to defend all of claim and appoint a solicitor. If this does not go my way will i be liable for his solicitors costs. Will i be at a disadvantage if i dont get a solicitor?

[Conniff]

An inspection was possible though, so why didn't you notice the cracks and paintwork ?

[jsa986]

The inspection was done AFTER the vehicle broke down the next day after purchase. The so called custom paintwork turned out to be a vinyl wrap which was pointed out by the mechanic who inspected the vehicle.

[raydetinu]

Ebay do have buyer protection, did you raise a dispute through them first?

If goods are miss described or faulty then they are usually on the side of the purchaser.

[jsa986]

Yes but as it was not paid through pay pal it was not eligible unfortunately. This really is a last ditch attempt as the seller wont reply or be reasonable

[raydetinu]

As far as I know you do not have to use paypal to get protection ( that is separate issue ). As long as the deal was done on Ebay for the as sold price and not conducted outside ebay.

You have may have a valid court claim, however did you have the opportunity to inspect and test drive before you paid for it? this would certainly limit any success in your claim as it is a private sale.

[jsa986]

eBay have confirmed they will not help despite opening a case with them. The deal was done for the price I could not test drive the vehicle for any distance due to an absence of valid MOT. The total failure of the electrical charging system would not have been evident on any test drive due to the seller putting a new battery on it. The bike was working on charged battery, as the charging system was not working correctly, as soon as the batt went flat the, bike would not start. (seller had previous knowledge of the fault)

 

The claim is mainly based on a misdescribed auction, this is valid for even private sales.

[raydetinu]

Absolutely it is.

Is it going down the small claims track? if it is no solicitors costs are allowed. It is fairly informal approach by judge.

You will need an expert report on the bike, not just your word about the faults.

IMHO would not have bought it without valid mot!!

You could have just walked away if not happy once you had seen it though!

[oddjobbob]

This Ebay proterction matter has come up before.

 

There is no buyer protection for vehicles on ebay uk no matter how you pay.

 

also

1. Vehicle broke down within 100 miles. Upon inspection by mechanical engineer it was found: Charging system not working, rectifier and/or stator defective (components that that charge the bikes battery system and electrics). Likely both are unusable. He informed me the new battery seller put on would have masked this problem for approx. 100 mile use. I suggest this shows priorer knowledge of the fault. VERY NAUGHTY BUT I THINK THIS IS THE ONLY FAULT YOU HAVE ANY KNID OF CHANCE WITH

2. Faring cracked by right wing mirror YUO SHOULD HAVE NOTICED THIS BEFORE PAYING FOR IT

3. Fault indicator (fi) warning light illuminating. This means the bike has an undisclosed fault DITTO

4. Damage noted to Stator casing DITTO

5. Rear tail light indicator mounting broken/ lens insecure DITTO

6. Various scuffs and scratches not consistent with the description wording "excellent condition" VERY MUCH DITTO

7. Missing inner offside fairing lining DITTO

8. Fairing linings insecure thorough out and missing fixings DITTO

9. vehicle there is NO custom paint, the bike is standard Suzuki black, with carbon fibre stickers/vinyl over the panels. DITTO

10. When i rang seller he informed me the vehicle had been recovered from his friend as a non runner THIS MAKES NO DIFFERENCE TO THE MATTER

 

If you bought the bike from a dealer in motorcycles then you will have some chance with point number one.

 

If you bought it from a private seller then a private seller is deemed not to have sufficient mechanical knowledge and it's very much a case of buyer beware.

 

Sorry if this isn't what you wanted to hear but it's how it is I'm afraid!

 

Bob

[oddjobbob]

Also with no MOT the bike is, by definition, not fit to be used on the road.

 

You really should have looked at it first and paid later rather than the other way round

[jsa986]

@ Bob

You are completely wrong there, when selling a vehicle they must be as Described and not misleading. Also please read the question I'm asking about solicitors costs not an opinion on if I should bring a claim that is already in process. Also You are also assuming there was an opportunity to view. Please check on the law regarding private sales and descriptions before dispensing advice like that as it could mislead people.

[jsa986]

Also with no MOT the bike is, by definition, not fit to be used on the road.

 

You really should have looked at it first and paid later rather than the other way round

 

 

 

The bike has an MOT but could not be verified at the time of test ride due to no paper cert, eventually it was found online. In the mean time I had to make a decision to purchase or not. It's become evident that was the wrong one which is why in down this road now.

[oddjobbob]

@ Bob

You are completely wrong there, when selling a vehicle they must be as Described and not misleading. Also please read the question I'm asking about solicitors costs not an opinion on if I should bring a claim that is already in process. Also You are also assuming there was an opportunity to view. Please check on the law regarding private sales and descriptions before dispensing advice like that as it could mislead people.

 

I wish I was wrong on your behalf, but I don't think I am.

 

Presumably you bought it privately, in which case unless the ad was an outright and outrageous lie then you won't get far, it's buyer beware.

 

Eg. did it look to you at first glance that it was custom paint? The seller can argue the same.

 

Did it appear to be in good condition? Ditto to the above

 

Did it run ok until the battery went flat? Ditto

 

I hope you get some redress but fear it may be putting good money after bad.

 

Sorry

[oddjobbob]

N.B. I'm not saying he didn't know about the faults

 

Of course he knew! They always do.

 

But private sale, largely = buyer beware

[jsa986]

@Bob It was an ebay auction private yes. I understand your stance on this, here is where I am and why im pursuing this, It might not go my way in court but im going to give it a bash. (and our debate is all good practice for the court room)

 

1. A clear offer and acceptance was communicated by the terms of the auction and the wording forming our contract, specifically "Excellent Condition" & "Custom Paint". Contrary to this Vehicle was not even road worthy and broke down 1 day later. As vehicle is not as described in auction I consider that the contract at an end.

 

2. This was an auction not a classified add, I was in legally binding contract to pay for the purchase as bidders and sellers signal their assent to eBay's umbrella terms of business when they participate in the site's activities. When a buyer places a successful bid on an item, the two parties will have entered into a legally binding contract.

 

3. When I made contact with seller when the bike broke down, I was then told the bike had to be recovered to his address as a non runner. This as not mentioned in the advert or when purchasing and shows he had knowledge of the problem before he sold it

 

4. My decision to enter into contract to purchase this vehicle was influenced by the wording in the auction: "Excellent condition" (which it is not) and the fact it had a custom paint job which it also did not have" The maximum bid amount would shave been significantly lower if i had been given correct information

 

Trading standards on private sales: "Whether you bought privately or from a motor trader, you are entitled to expect that the bike is roadworthy when bought, unless you and the seller clearly agree it is to be sold as scrap. "

[oddjobbob]

Yes, completely understand, good luck.

 

although the clincher there is 'roadworthy when bought'

 

When you bought it, it started, stopped, was MOT'd and presumably performed satisfactorily, albeit for only 100 miles.

 

So it was actually fit to be on the road at the moment you handed over the money.

 

I do hope you get somewhere, too many rogues on ebay.

[raydetinu]

Seller does not have to declare anything about the vehicle unless you ask the question!

As said you may some redress, hope judge agrees or maybe settle before!

Good luck anyway.

[jsa986]

Thanks for input everyone will let you all know the result

[Kiki1]

As far as I know you do not have to use paypal to get protection ( that is separate issue ). As long as the deal was done on Ebay for the as sold price and not conducted outside ebay.

 

Ebay will fob any buyer off for as long as possible with a string of auto responses starting with 'I'm sorry to hear about your problem' or 'I appreciate your concern', with what look like real employee names and titles at the foot, eg Chuck, Milo, Tawnee. They are computer generated, designed to wear down any potential claim from the s c a mmee, befor they commence suspending /shutting your account for some bogus reason. Scan image all of them for future compensation claims

[oddjobbob]

once again THERE IS NOBUYER PROTECTION whatsoever for vehicles bought on ebay

 

From their own site

 

What's covered

 

Most transactions on eBay.co.uk are covered by eBay Money Back Guarantee.

Covered

• Cases opened within 45 days of payment.
   
  
• Purchases on eBay.co.uk made with PayPal via checkout or an eBay invoice.
   
  
• Items that are paid for with a single payment.
   
  

Not covered

• Buyer’s remorse (see the seller’s returns policy for returns options).
   
  
• Duplicate claims through other resolution methods.
   
  
• Items sent to another address after original delivery.
   
  
• Vehicles, Real Estate, Business & Websites for Sale, Digital Content, Intangible Goods, Classified Ads, Services, and some Business Equipment categories.