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    • Not at all.  The onus is on them to ensure that their invoice respects the provisions of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 to establish keeper liability.  Which it can't as the area is covered by bye-laws. Spot on. Irrelevant as to whether you entered into a contract with VCS to pay them £100 if you didn't obey what was written on their silly signs. Who cares?  What about their ridiculous generic Particulars of Claim where they deliberately mix up driver and keeper. And where do they mention this?  You haven't shown us anything. Of course you have to prepare a Witness Statement and you'd better get on with it. This is the problem here - you've disappeared for months & months, haven't kept us updated and presumably haven't read other VCS threads.  That needs to change - now. Otherwise you will lose - simple as that. For a start - please upload the court order which fixes the hearing date plus plus where "VCS mentioned my initial defence was generic and clearly copied from the internet".  We're not mind readers.
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    • Hi,  It has been a long time but I have had confirmation claim will proceed to hearing in roughly 1 months time.  I was wondering if anyone could advise on defence please.  A few questions I have are: 1) I didn't notify VCS that I was not the driver of the vehicle and the judge may look negatively on this point.  I did not receive any direction in correspondence from VCS  that I should inform them if I was not the driver and that was going to be the foundation for may argument on this point. 2) The vehicle is stopped at a zebra crossing.  Based on the images from VCS for around 10 seconds.  At that time there is someone standing near the zebra crossing and someone else enters my vehicle.  I was going to raise the point that stopping at a zebra crossing when someone is standing near it is to be expected.  I was also going to ask the question how you can have a no stopping zone when there are zebra crossings where the driver is required to stop. 3) The no stopping zone is clearly signposted, however, no drop off or pickup is not clearly signposted with one small sign at the zebra crossing, parallel to the road and on the passengers side.  I was going to challenge that no-drop off or pickup is clearly signposted.  4) VCS mentioned my initial defence was generic and clearly copied from the internet.  It covered 1) Claimant not being in a position to state if the Defendant was the driver at the time.  2) No evidence that claimant's contract with landowner supersedes byelaws & signage isn't legally binding contract. 3) No contractual costs and interest cannot be accrued on speculative charge. I am interested to know if anyone has had success or been unsuccessful with this 'generic' defence. 5) If I should submit an updated defence to the court based on questions 1, 2 & 3.  Or if it is better to only raise these points in court? Thanks.  Any guidance would be appreciated  
    • I honestly don't know, Baz. In addition what I don't  understand (from that pamphlet) is this: The s88 criteria are quite clear and don't need a medical professional to interpret them . The one most relevant to his topic says that an application is not a "qualifying application" if a relevant disability has been declared. The problem with the word "may" is how does the applicant establish whether me "may" driver under s88 when he has not complied with its conditions? I don't know the answer to that either. But to further muddy the waters, the pamphlet says this (about : But the s88 statute says absolutely nothing like that at all. It simply says that if you have declared a relevant disability s88 does not apply. The DVLA pamphlet is simply confusing as far as I can see. That's actually my opinion and that's what I would stick to if it was me making the application. But I'll seek a few opinions from others over the next couple of days.
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Is an unsigned contract enforceable? Being sued for damages in lieu of notice


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Wonder if anyone out there can help. I starting having guitar lessons towards the end of last year.

 

The agreement handed to me wasn't to my satisfaction.

I didn't like fact there wasn't enough flexibility,

also the notice period.

I raised this with the tutor he said that was ok he can be flexible,

so we confirmed time and day of my lessons and cost and I started the lessons.

 

A couple of months in

he put the price up, but I didn't really have a problem with that.

 

However about 6/7 months into lessons due to unplanned work situation.

I had to temporarily move away immediately.

 

I let my tutor know at the end of the term, that I wouldn't be coming back next term.

 

He said I would have to pay the fees anyway, as I'm required to give a months notice.

I said I didn't sign up to that, he said I came to the lessons meaning I agreed to the T & Cs.

 

Clearly he is now going against what he originally said, what we verbally agreed.

 

I didn't sign the paperwork can he make me pay?

 

He has sent me a small claims warning before proceedings letter from his solicitors.

I don't want pay the guy a penny as I'm not gonna have the lessons.

 

All advice welcome.

 

Cheers.

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Hi and welcome to CAG, I would say you are not tied to the agreement as you never signed, but the guy has a point in that you attended for several months. Depends how a judge would view it if it went to small claims court and the costs you could incur as a result.

Would it really be out of the question to pay a months notice- and save the hassle ?

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Appreciate the reply; yeah I was thinking that but when I got the snotty letter from his solicitor, I wanted to know where I stood legally because I didn't agree to the written contract that's why I didn't sign it. So it's a bit annoying him trying to enforce an unsigned agreement.

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It is usual for this kind of arrangement to have a cancellation period. The tutor will generally use this to fill slots in his class and ensure continuity of income.

 

Keeping in mind that a verbal contract is just a binding a s a written one( despise common belief), the judge will decide based on the evidence provided.

You may claim that, due to the situation with your work and the uncertainty of any extended arrangement you would never have agreed to a period of notice, he may claim that it was a standard clause and that he ensured all his students were made aware of it.

 

As said the judge will decide which is the most probable case based on the pleadings.

 

I don't know if that helps at all.

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Well hindsight is a wonderful gift I suppose, but why didn't you change it at the time to something that you both agreed was acceptable. Not doing so might imply your acceptance.

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You may have to pay a cancellation fee - but that fee must reflect any administrative losses caused by your early cancellation.

 

If the cancellation charge is greater than that then that would be a disproportionate unenforceable penalty.

 

Ask him in writing what his actual losses are caused by your cancellation and offer to pay those. These losses are not to include fees for lessons which you didn't have. They are merely to compensate him for losses such as advertising for a replacement pupil or wasted materials etc.

 

I suggest that you pay him one month fees and tell him to sue for the rest - but put everything in writing

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Thanks. I think that is what he wants one month fees in lieu of notice. But I just thought I might have a stand as we agreed something verbally contrary to what was in the agreement. You do wonder the point in signature areas on contracts if you don't actually need to sign them! Also he entered the lessons without me signing up...maybe he's a bit at fault too.

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The common law requirements for the formation of a contract do not include signing a piece of paper sadly, 1 month is usual in these cases.

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

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Hi GuitarBoy,

 

I was asked to look in on this ...............

 

As said above, whether or not you signed the agreement is not the only factor. However, without a signed agreement, the tutor would have a harder job if he took the case to court. In any event, court action is most unlikely.

 

Your best move is to write confirming that you have relocated and were unable to continue lessons.

 

Say you recognise it is fair to offer to pay a months fee in lieu of notice. Accordingly, you now offer to pay one month's fee in full and final settlement of all amounts payable to the tutor. If he will confirm in writing that he accepts your offer, you'll pay the money promptly to end the matter.

 

See how he responds and send the letter to him by RM Signed For Post or get a free Certificate of Posting from your PO when you send the letter.

 

Let us know ..............

 

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You say that you raised the issue of the notice period. But what was actually agreed? If you did not agree a specific new notice period, then there is no verbal variation of the contract, and the terms govern the relationship.

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I can't help but disagree with some of the comments above. You didn't accept the T&C's and you didn't accept them through conduct as there was no offer to accept - I will explain.

 

Ok had you been given the contract (the offer), not signed and said nothing then you'd have accepted through conduct. However you clearly said the T&C's were not suitable as they were not flexible (clearly a rejection of the offer and once rejected an offer cannot subsequently be accepted) and he said he would be more flexible (uncertain term) and you agreed a price and proceeded. I think what we have hear is a verbal contract where the only certain terms are indeed the price. I think if those are the facts they would have a very difficult task in establishing the terms and conditions are the governing contract and therefore the notice period would not be enforceable.

 

Contract law is based on case law, however over the years the process of formation of contracts has become pretty established, you need an offer, acceptance (though conduct will do), consideration and sufficent certainty. The facts are pretty clear, offer, rejection, parties proceeded on verbal contract with limited certain terms, oral contract is varied when the price is put up to which you agreed. There is no signed document, which will push the burden onto him as claimant (that is a practical point rather than a legal point).

 

There are also other factors which should be considered, you will be afforded the benefit of the unfair terms regulations and there is the concept of fustration (it has been a while since I've looked into that).

 

I think you should set out a well worded letter to that effect and explain you will defend yourself in the small claims court - post the letter on here so people can comment. I would place a fairly good bet that he wouldn't proceed with court action.

 

Interestingly if you are moving address and he doesn't know your new address he can't serve on you.

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I think the fact that the OP took lessons and paid for them would bee prima facia proof of the existence of a contract.

 

However this matter should be settled without going to law IMO, the reasonable thing would be to negotiate a reasonable offer.

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DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

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There is a contract - yes, but a verbal contract based on very simple terms, not the terms and conditions the OP refers to or upon which the tutor is trying to enforce this claim.

 

I agree that it is always best to try to settle where possible - but the OP doesn't want to pay a penny and I think has a reasonable chance of not paying anything.

 

Personally I would write to the tutor and say that I would pay and attend for two more lessons for the reasons set out above - I am pretty sure the tutor will not be interested in teaching the OP anymore and silence would follow!

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This is confusing. Were the lessons term time only. When did you find out you couldn't return and when did you tell the tutor. I think those points may be relevant should it get nasty

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  • 3 months later...

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