Dutch collection agency contacting me in uk

[sirdrumsalot]

Hi there,

i lived in holland for 10 years in this time i bought a house and fell on hard times couldnt pay the mortgage after ony 3-4 months so decided to throw the towel in and return to England.

 

This was December 2004,i never told anyone the bank or anyone apart from friends and just expected the apartment to be repossessed eventually and sold and any debt i had wiped out or as near as damit.

 

Today i received an e mail from a dutch debt collection agency stating the debt has been submitted to them by the bank for collection a debt of over 40,000 euro after reminders have been sent to me (in holland)

 

dont know if they have bought the debt or are actually working for the bank ,they have said if debt isnt paid in full by 2 weeks time they will be obliged to take matters further which will add more costs to the debt and also could insure a writ of summons to a Dutch District court.

 

Has anyone got any fact based information on this kind of situation?

 

Can i be forced back to holland to appear in court?

 

Can the debt be transferred to an english collector?

Or as it has been just over 7 years can the debt still be valid as i believe in uk after 6 years if no contact made the debt comes off your credit score ?

 

I guess i was foolish to think i could just run away but i was quite young and at my wits end,

 

i havent contacted anyone about this debt the collection agency etc shall i just keep ignoring them ??

 

Thanks in advance for any help i can get.

Edited December 27, 2018 by dx100uk
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[cerberusalert]

The statute of Limitations in Holland is five years for a normal debt, but a mortgage is 30 yrs I believe. I'll just do some checking & get back.

[cerberusalert]

It appears it is 20 yrs http://ec.europa.eu/civiljustice/time_limits/time_limits_net_en.htm

[sirdrumsalot]

Cheers,does that mean they can chase me for 30 yrs??

[cerberusalert]

Do they have your UK address?

Can i be forced back to holland to appear in court?

As you are no longer a NL resident any action will have to be brought in the UK.

Can the debt be transfered to an english collector?

Yes.

[cerberusalert]

I've moved your thread into the Overseas forum http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?266-Overseas-Debt-Overseas-Account-issues but you can still access it through the welcome forum where you originally posted for the next few days.

[sirdrumsalot]

The collection agency has my old address, they contacted me by e mail tho,so at best they will have to go through an english high court?

 

i believe this would be very costly to do which would make my debt even greater,is this likely do you think if the current scare tactics by e mail

 

dont work

,im confused they are threatening me with a summons to a dutch district (county) court as this cant be enforced to an english citizen??

 

any thoughts?

Thanks.

Edited December 27, 2018 by dx100uk
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[cerberusalert]

They may try and serve papers at your old address, but technically they cannot obtain a judgment against you as you are not a Dutch resident... it should be brought to a UK court using Dutch law. Even if they managed to obtain a Dutch CCJ they wouldn't be able to enforce it if they don't know your present whereabouts.

[sirdrumsalot]

I see ok,what is quite scary was the fact that they have my old address which was current up until 2 weeks ago so they seem on the ball and maybe they can find my new one just as easy,obviously i am gonna play the waiting game but i am worried this is gonna bite me big time??

[cerberusalert]

Put it this way, they are chasing 40K euros & they don't know where you are. They more than likely have contacted your old address trying to find you & have hit a brick wall so they've tried your email address instead and are fishing at the minute.

 

They will probably probably try some tracing methods but I doubt whether they'll spend too much time & money as they cannot be certain as to whether they'll in fact recoup their money, particularly if you do not have any assets. Ultimately, you could declare yourself bankrupt which would only affect you for six years. Unless you had a job where bankruptcy was a no-no it would be no great hardship & they would have wasted their time, money & effort.

 

What will be more likely is that they will eventually sell the debt on to a third party debt collector and claim tax relief.

[sirdrumsalot]

if i decide to do nothing,

which is what i will in fact do

,they could contact the uk high court to get back the debt then i would be forced to pay by uk law but wouldnt have a bed credit rating as it wasnt an english debt?

Thats worse case scenario i think?

 

They could keep trying by e mail to contact me a put the frighteners on which i will of course ignore.

 

As it has already been 7 years and the bank will have received most of the debt back from the sale of the property if this has already happened?

 

The rest of the Debt is possible shortfall and costs interest etc, so might have in fact already sold this debt on to this collection agency trying to contact me now which if the debt is shortfall and interest on this will that still be classed as mortgage or typical debt which has a 5 year lifespan?

 

Whatever the case do you recommend i play the waiting game ?

 

I very much appreciate your help in this matter.

[cerberusalert]

They would have to find you first before they can ask a UK court for permission to enforce.

 

No it wouldn't be registered on your UK credit file as it is not a UK debt.

 

The bank would not have kept the debt on their books too long, it's classed as toxic debts & does not look good.

The rest of the Debt is possible shortfall and costs intrest etc, so might have in fact already sold this debt on to this collection agency trying to contact me now which if the debt is shortfall and interest on this will that still be classed as mortgage or typical debt which has a 5 year lifespan?

If the original mortgage was cleared and the amount they claim are ancillary charges then yes I think it will be covered by the 5 year limitations period.

 

Whatever the case do you recommend i play the waiting game ?

Yes, after all that email could have come from a Nigerian spammer for all you know.

[sirdrumsalot]

Haha seems unlikley,but we shall see what happens and stand firm, thanks very much for your thoughts and help i feel a bit more at ease.

Be well

[sirdrumsalot]

BTW forgot to mention i had a phone call before xmas off a dutch speaking person but i just hung up ......that phone number is in my wifes name and is ex directory

do they have the power to get details like that because that was quite spooky?

[cerberusalert]

It has been alleged that BT and mobile companies sell this kind of information. how true it is I don't know but there have been numerous cases where it's happened.

[sirdrumsalot]

I found an auction site in Dutch that has sold the property in question in june 2005 by auction no price of course so deffo gonna keep shtum.

[cerberusalert]

The Statute of limitations for a mortgage debt in the NL is 20 yrs http://ec.europa.eu/civiljustice/time_limits/time_limits_net_en.htm

[sirdrumsalot]

this collection agency now has my current address and has written if i do not pay in 10 days they will seek autherisation to contact the courts the letters seem standard and are are threatening even if its on the dutch system for 20 years can they force a Brit to pay when there are no records in England ?

[cerberusalert]

There are reciprocal agreements between EU member States see; http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?250889-Can-I-Be-Sued-For-An-Overseas-Debt

[sirdrumsalot]

According to that then i am screwed?

[cerberusalert]

Not necessarily, a lot depends on how much they are chasing you for. In the majority of cases it is not financially viable for them to, particularly if you have no assets.

[cerberusalert]

they have said if debt isnt paid in full by 2 weeks time they will be obliged to take matters further which will add more costs to the debt and also could insure a writ of summons to a Dutch District court.

If Dutch law is anything like UK law they won't be able to obtain a judgment in the NLs as you are no longer a Dutch resident. They would have to bring an action here in the UK & as I said above they would need to be certain that they'd get the money otherwise it wouldn't be cost effective for them.

[sirdrumsalot]

40k seems enough to chase up i would say i will just keep ignoring until im forced to act if and when that day comes i hope not

thanks for your help.

[cerberusalert]

If they did try and you have no assets you could consider bankruptcy here which would include that debt.

[sirdrumsalot]

Hi all a quick update on how things are progressing had one or 2 letters asking to pay the debt from holland from 2004 of 40k euro

 

first had a dutch CA sent a letter and e mail which i ignored in late 2011

since then cci legal have been sending several letters for the recovery of the debt

which i have also ignored

 

latest letter today states:

that because they havent had any response they are obliged to seek the clients immediate authority to serve legal procedings and to avoid further difficulty it would be helpful if their agent called for the purposes of serving the court form and for me to confirm my address for the service of legal documents copies of all prior correspondance will be placed before the courts as evidence of our efforts to resolve this matter or i can still pay of course...........

 

is this a ploy to try and get me to acknowledge the debt which i have so far refused to do and will continue to do so

 

Im still not convinced i can be made to pay and will simply refuse to open the door to anyone i dont recognise

does anyone have any helpful advice in this matter thanks.

Edited December 27, 2018 by dx100uk
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