Failure to notify, almost at court stage...

[KingKayzee]

Thanks. It's a good basis for me, I may make it less aggressive for my first letter, but it helps with the different Sections & Acts etc. involved

[KingKayzee]

Hello after sending my letter off 2 weeks ago I received a letter today, they're taking me to court! I will receive a summons date soon. Damn.

 

So... what's next in preparation terms? Obviously I need to be quoting the Interpretation Act as my main defence (although I have already done so on my letter) how do I go about obtaining Freedom of Information Act about their lost mail?

 

Thanks for all your help so far, I hope this doesn't end badly! Not much looking forward to going to court...

[postggj]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?307136-postggj-gets-a-dvla-summons-for-failing-to-notify-new-keeper-get-real-*-CASE-WITHDRAWN**

 

no worries on any court claim

 

have a nose at my thread

[marlon-dingle]

Hi,

Just been to magistrates court in Sheffield and thought I would share my experience with you.

Edited October 24, 2011 by marlon-dingle

[marlon-dingle]

Hi,

Just been to magistrates court in Sheffield and thought I would share my experience with you.

I had been summons for failing to notify a change of owner.

When the summons arrived (still trying to get me to pay a fine, sorry penalty first) I filled it out and said

i would plead not guilty.

I did my research on here - s7 Interpretation Act 1978 and a Freedom of Information request that proved they

don't receipt in returned mail.

I arrived at court and all 40 names were for DVLA "offences" but at the start time of 10am there were only 2 of us present.

I was sat outside and this woman in a suit came up and asked me who I was and was I defending myself etc.

She then looked down at her paperwork and said my case had been withdrawn.

I was furious because I wanted my day in court.

I said I was still going in as I was not leaving until someone had paid my costs.

When I went in,the court usher and another guy were in there plus this aforementioned woman.

I asked if the DVLA prosecutor was present and the same woman replied it was her.

(So basically they "interview you" before you go in without telling you they are the prosecution.

I believe she saw my evidence and knew she would lose so she told me it has been withdrawn and I should

have had a letter in the post.

The 2 magistrates entered the room and because I was in there the DVLA woman had to say that she had withdrawn my case.

If that had been true my name would have been removed from the court list beforehand so I don't believe this.

Basically if you turn up to defend they will run a mile but the other 38 didn't bother so would have presumably been

found guilty and fined..........a good money making scaam!!

I asked the magistrate to award me costs and was told they would only pay my travel and not my lost working day.

So all in all, it cost me a days pay but at least they never got my money.

NEVER EVER PAY UP,FIGHT THEM AND THEY WILL BACK DOWN AS THEY CAN'T PROVE YOU NEVER POSTED THE LETTER.

Edited October 24, 2011 by marlon-dingle

[winston73]

Hi,

Just been to magistrates court in Sheffield and thought I would share my experience with you.

I had been summons for failing to notify a change of owner.

When the summons arrived (still trying to get me to pay a fine, sorry penalty first) I filled it out and said

i would plead not guilty.

I did my research on here - s7 Interpretation Act 1978 and a Freedom of Information request that proved they

don't receipt in returned mail.

I arrived at court and all 40 names were for DVLA "offences" but at the start time of 10am there were only 2 of us present.

I was sat outside and this woman in a suit came up and asked me who I was and was I defending myself etc.

She then looked down at her paperwork and said my case had been withdrawn.

I was furious because I wanted my day in court.

I said I was still going in as I was not leaving until someone had paid my costs.

When I went in,the court usher and another guy were in there plus this aforementioned woman.

I asked if the DVLA prosecutor was present and the same woman replied it was her.

(So basically they "interview you" before you go in without telling you they are the prosecution.

I believe she saw my evidence and knew she would lose so she told me it has been withdrawn and I should

have had a letter in the post.

The 2 magistrates entered the room and because I was in there the DVLA woman had to say that she had withdrawn my case.

If that had been true my name would have been removed from the court list beforehand so I don't believe this.

Basically if you turn up to defend they will run a mile but the other 38 didn't bother so would have presumably been

found guilty and fined..........a good money making scaam!!

I asked the magistrate to award me costs and was told they would only pay my travel and not my lost working day.

So all in all, it cost me a days pay but at least they never got my money.

NEVER EVER PAY UP,FIGHT THEM AND THEY WILL BACK DOWN AS THEY CAN'T PROVE YOU NEVER POSTED THE LETTER.

 

Thanks for that....

 

 

Iv'e heard this before - someone else made a mention about this sort of thing happening a while back..... It does look like a good money earner for them !

[alexltw]

I am in court for trial on wed 14th for the same I sold a car to person in the village over a year ago posted v5c have wife as witness now for the interpritation act 1978 sect 7 post .

definition of delivery : to hand over deliver by hand.

and the united postal union act for the uk . letter is the recipients property after entering the postal system.

[Raykay]

Make sure that they don't try the 'you are guilty because you cannot prove it was delivered' argument.

That's the stunt they pulled on Paul Kennedy and the magistrates believed them, when he appealed at Crown Court, they didn't even bother to contest it!

[alexltw]

Hopefully with the definition of Deliver = by hand ,I want to know how I can deliver to a box no ?

with 35 million cars that would be about 86,000 cars a day trying to deliver there paper work to one place nice traffic jam. and on the v5 it says send ,so they expect you to post it and they give a postal address totop it all.

[alexltw]

Hopefully with the definition of Deliver = by hand ,I want to know how I can deliver to a box no ?

with 35 million cars that would be about 86,000 cars a day trying to deliver there paper work to one place nice traffic jam. and on the v5 it says send ,so they expect you to post it and they give a postal address totop it all. If you could add anything to help my situation Raykay would be great

[Raykay]

I would stick to the tried and trusted argument - s7 Interpretation Act 1978, once it is posted it is deemed to be served - (whether the expression “serve” or the expression “give” or “send” or any other expression is used - which covers 'deliver') they have to prove that you didn't send it, not that you have to prove it was delivered.

 

Another thing they try is that you are guilty because you cannot produce their acknowledgment letter, there is no legislation that requires them to send an acknowledgement letter, or you to anything if you don't receive an acknowledgement letter.

 

They also may try to contest the Interpretation Act with 'Pettit vs Mitchell, 1842' but that is more of a Sale of Goods problem involving the 'offer to make available for collection' rather than delivery, a bit irrelevant to the DVLA's case - unless the Secretary of State is going to collect it!

[alexltw]

cheers raykay yep good old ia78 s7 will be used thank you and will look up 1842 as for warned is for armed thanks again.

[alexltw]

Hi went to court and after 1/2hr of the judge deliberating .he asked the dvla would they like more time to look at my facts they said they were still persuing the it was not delivered line .he then asked them again more forcefully they then said yes and the case was adjurned. Until end of jan.Is this the judge asking the dvla to drop the case ? I hope.

Edited December 16, 2011 by alexltw
didnt have glasses on lol

[crem]

Seems strange that he ffered them "more time". why didn't he just dismiss their case?

[SURFBOY]

Maybe he is hoping the defendants will ramp up their costs.

[alexltw]

roll on new year lol postal act 2000 section 125 part 3 deliver deliver

[Tony P]

Alexltw

Something I am unclear about. What level of Court is this?

In post 32 you say 'trial'. In post 38 there is a 'Judge'.

 

Although my knowledge of Court processes is scanty and could be totally lacking here, these terms suggests it is not a Magistrates Court but a Crown Court.

 

If a Crown Court the case could become highly significant as I believe it becomes a legal precedent that can be cited in lower Courts which must follow it.

 

Sorry for timewasting if I am wrong.

[alexltw]

no sorry Tony only magistrates but will be the third time I appear on at end of jan . the jp ask if this had goneto case and i said that it had not yet gone to crown. After deliberation he then said that he did not want the dvla to be ambushed and asked her twice if she wanted more time first answer was no and then stated about it was not delivered .then the jp asked her again would she like time to look at all my points of law in a stern manor to wich she said yes . the bench were smiling in my direction though!cheers imo ok maybe

alexltw

Edited December 18, 2011 by alexltw