Ingeus

[matty39]

All they need is your e-mail and then they'll see you have an account

If you tick the box to allow them permission then they can see your account eg CV etc

sometimes they don't find the account immediately though

 

it said unable to find details so she tried different things like surname and email. for some reason it didn`t show up. to her it looked like i wasn`t registered. not sure why because i am.

[Chester6]

It happens sometimes they don't find you

 

I think it's just another example of UJ being a failure

[jasta11]

it said unable to find details so she tried different things like surname and email. for some reason it didn`t show up. to her it looked like i wasn`t registered. not sure why because i am.

 

This is why UJ is so dangerous; it goes wrong constantly. Some jobsworth JC advisor looking for a sanction target would just check once, find no trace of the account and promptly refer the client for a sanction. Though the JC can't force claimants to show UJ screen prints there's nothing to stop you showing a screen print as proof if you want to.

[matty39]

This is why UJ is so dangerous; it goes wrong constantly. Some jobsworth JC advisor looking for a sanction target would just check once, find no trace of the account and promptly refer the client for a sanction. Though the JC can't force claimants to show UJ screen prints there's nothing to stop you showing a screen print as proof if you want to.

 

I`ve printed one off to show her. she`ll probably say she needs to see me actually go on to the site. had a job interview anyway and been put forward for clearance checks. if all clear which im sure it will be then i get start date. was told it can take a few weeks but hoping its before next meeting in 2 weeks so i can tell

her where to stick her UJ.

[Charlotte_Henderson]

 

Cheeky sod's first words were 'This is your last chance to find a job and get something from the program' (ie make them some money). I replied '..and this is your last chance to actually do something for me as the past 2 years have been a total and utter waste of time'. I'm afraid I went off on a bit of a rant then and told him exactly what Ingeus hadn't done for me, along with the few totally unsuitable things they had done - for their financial benefit, not mine.

 

 

He's only interested in getting his £100 bonus because you got a job while at Ingeus.

 

I dont blame you for going off on a rant, as that place makes you want to do that regularly.

My hubby has now been moved to the training place i was at, i am now back at ingeus. he told his new adviso,r if you think what you do here is going to help me find a job your mistaken. my wife was here for 18 weeks apart from stupid courses and weekly job search sessions you did nothing!!!

 

I will attend each week but dont think your doing me a favour cos your not! she didnt have an answer for that!!!

[Charlotte_Henderson]

This is why UJ is so dangerous; it goes wrong constantly. Some jobsworth JC advisor looking for a sanction target would just check once, find no trace of the account and promptly refer the client for a sanction. Though the JC can't force claimants to show UJ screen prints there's nothing to stop you showing a screen print as proof if you want to.

 

I was once asked to sign in to my UJM at an ingeus meeting infront of my advisor i didnt have a problem doing this.

[jasta11]

I was once asked to sign in to my UJM at an ingeus meeting infront of my advisor i didnt have a problem doing this.

 

I wouldn't put it past Ingeus to use key-logging software on their public computers to record people's passwords.

 

Just think how handy it would be for them to be able to log into a client's email account, UJ account, agency accounts, etc and get the names and addresses of employers the client has contacted. A veritable gold mine!

 

..hope you also told your hubby to record everything, or at least put his phone on the table and pretend he's recording everything

[Chester6]

The last 'adviser' wanted me to use their logs which included addresses

I wonder how many filled them in for the money-grabbers

I didn't as I had my booklet with it all in and I wasn't going to waste paper duplicating info

[Kitten213]

I feel really stupid about something...

 

I have been with my WP a year , They put me with someone aggressive, to the point you felt under arrest. There was one time he was so harsh/vile towards me that i left shaking and signed off my JSA for 1- 2 weeks.

 

I sent a letter to the team leader, who didn't take action apart from change advisor. I saw a new advisor, I later contacted there center who passed information to the manager. I had a meeting with the manager who took notes. During this meeting she was very keen at the end, to get all my employment details including the number and name of my manager. My new advisor even took the page with the details from me firmly, and said 'thats mine not yours, yours is in there..'

 

I withdrew my data consent.

 

I have not seen them since November.

 

I have not had contact since apart from a week ago when the team leader phoned me , i didn't know it was them , I though it was a job I had apply to the day before. He asked me if i was still working at said company, i said yes, it was only when i asked who was calling that I found out it was him. I hanged up. I felt so stupid, i didnt want any contact by phone, but they said they can do this even with data consent withdrawal.

 

Can they use this as evidence to claim sustainable payments? he sent me an email saying i was never bullied off JSA and reminded me that i would need to go back there if something happened. the whole thing is vile and is making me upset.

 

I have recorded evidence and I was going to send a package to there chief executive, should I also tell the DWP my concern?

 

i d appreciated any advice thanks .

[Bakatcha]

I feel really stupid about something...

 

I have been with my WP a year , They put me with someone aggressive, to the point you felt under arrest. There was one time he was so harsh/vile towards me that i left shaking and signed off my JSA for 1- 2 weeks.

 

I sent a letter to the team leader, who didn't take action apart from change advisor. I saw a new advisor, I later contacted there center who passed information to the manager. I had a meeting with the manager who took notes. During this meeting she was very keen at the end, to get all my employment details including the number and name of my manager. My new advisor even took the page with the details from me firmly, and said 'thats mine not yours, yours is in there..'

 

I withdrew my data consent.

 

I have not seen them since November.

 

I have not had contact since apart from a week ago when the team leader phoned me , i didn't know it was them , I though it was a job I had apply to the day before. He asked me if i was still working at said company, i said yes, it was only when i asked who was calling that I found out it was him. I hanged up. I felt so stupid, i didnt want any contact by phone, but they said they can do this even with data consent withdrawal.

 

Can they use this as evidence to claim sustainable payments? he sent me an email saying i was never bullied off JSA and reminded me that i would need to go back there if something happened. the whole thing is vile and is making me upset.

 

I have recorded evidence and I was going to send a package to there chief executive, should I also tell the DWP my concern?

 

i d appreciated any advice thanks .

Hi.

If you feel bullied then you are bullied! You should complain in writing using the {personal abuse removed] complaint procedure. You should send a copy of your complaint to the manager at your local JCP office and, if you feel up to it, to your MP. I would mark the original complaint CC with the name of the MP and the local JCP manager. That way the [personal abuse removed]

The evidence that the [personal abuse removed] has to provide is set out in Chapter 5 of this document

http://www.dwp.gov.uk/supplying-dwp/what-we-buy/welfare-to-work-services/provider-guidance/framework-generic-guidance.shtml

You can read this for yourself but I find the following extracts of interest:

7. You must seek the individual’s written and informed consent, allowing DWP to

contact their employer(s), and confirm to DWP whether or not you have obtained

that consent.

and

Written and Informed Consent

15. It is your responsibility to obtain

the individual’s written and informed consent which allows DWP to contact

employers, and to determine the optimum time for obtaining it. The consent form

contains the appropriate legal wording and therefore cannot be altered in any

way. The declaration should be completed and signed by the individual and you

are required to keep this on file in your premises.

16. You will

need to explain to the individual why their permission is being sought and

inform them that they may themselves be contacted to confirm details of their

employment. If the individual refuses to sign the consent form, you must enter

this into PRaP when making the claim.

17. The consent form has

been designed to ensure that DWP is compliant with DPA requirements for the

purpose of contacting employers. You can also use this form if you are seeking to obtain exactly the same information for exactly the same purpose as that of DWP. The consent form can be found at Annex 1.

I interpret this as showing it is difficult (but not impossible) to claim if you haven't given consent.

The real way to prevent payment is not to tell them who you are employed by (as well as withholding consent).

 

Apologies for txtspk readers who will understand none of the above.

Edited August 10, 2013 by honeybee13
Personal abuse removed.

[Flickyhecky]

I've been forgotton about...

 

Haven't been to Ingeus since March 2012! (I started September 2011), i stopped going because it wasn't doing me any good for my mental well being, i've had various letters and messages on my phone, but have ignored them, but the thing is i've still been signing on, did 12 weeks temporary work last October/December (Job Centre knew about this), yet i haven't been santioned, neither has the Job Centre asked about it.

 

Have i broken Ingeus?

 

By the way, i'm doing exactly the same thing i would've been doing at Ingeus (spending hours looking at the same jobs week in week out on the Job Pages on the Internet.)

 

I didn't want to do the pointless excercises and programs!

[Kitten213]

Hi.

If you feel bullied then you are bullied! You should complain in writing using the [personal abuse removed] complaint procedure. You should send a copy of your complaint to the manager at your local JCP office and, if you feel up to it, to your MP. I would mark the original complaint CC with the name of the MP and the local JCP manager. That way the [personal abuse removed] knows that copies have been sent to these other parties.

You ask "Can they use this as evidence to claim sustainable payments? "

The evidence that the [personal abuse removed] has to provide is set out in Chapter 5 of this document

 

You can read this for yourself but I find the following extracts of interest:

 

and

 

 

I interpret this as showing it is difficult (but not impossible) to claim if you haven't given consent.

The real way to prevent payment is not to tell them who you are employed by (as well as withholding consent).

 

Apologies for txtspk readers who will understand none of the above.

 

thanks very much. they know my employer but have not been allowed to contact them, but since they confirmed employment through me, there is a chance they can get payments. The business manager used to be a manager of a JSP office so not getting my hopes up, but will be writing letters.

Edited August 10, 2013 by honeybee13
Personal abuse removed

[jasta11]

I've been forgotton about...

 

Haven't been to Ingeus since March 2012! (I started September 2011), i stopped going because it wasn't doing me any good for my mental well being, i've had various letters and messages on my phone, but have ignored them, but the thing is i've still been signing on, did 12 weeks temporary work last October/December (Job Centre knew about this), yet i haven't been santioned, neither has the Job Centre asked about it.

 

Have i broken Ingeus?

 

By the way, i'm doing exactly the same thing i would've been doing at Ingeus (spending hours looking at the same jobs week in week out on the Job Pages on the Internet.)

 

I didn't want to do the pointless excercises and programs!

 

It's good that Ingeus are leaving you alone, but be very careful about ignoring their letters as, if they're written correctly according to DWP guidelines then Ingues can report you to the JC for not responding.

 

They can't force you to come in by sending you texts or emails, that's not allowed, but letters are a different thing altogether - all mandatory appointments have to be issued in writing and either handed to you or posted.

 

We all know Ingeus is a total waste of time, but if they ask you to attend in the correct manner - by properly-worded letter - then be careful if you refuse or ignore it as you wouldn't have a leg to stand on if they reported it to the JC. Would hate to see anyone sanctioned.

[signmaker]

Hi, off topic I know, my wife and I signed off JSA (3 months ago now) because she has become a full time carer for my mother and is claiming Income support for me, untill I can find a suitable job, I have had my phone call from my Ingeus [personal abuse removed] asking what I'm doing and I told him that I wasn't going to tell him, although he had most of the info from the JC anyway, and it was left at that. Now my wife has had a letter from her (A4E) work party [personal abuse removed], she ignored the first mandated appointment letter he sent her, then she ignored a voice mail that he also sent, now this second letter MANDATING her to a phone call review, (yes I know this BS as we are not claiming JSA, nor are we attending the WP's) he doesn't know how clued up we are on the subject thanks to the info on this site.

It's the usual threatening letter, appointment is mandatory, failure to attend, benefits could be affected etc,etc.

He also grabbed her arm as we were leaving another building as he happened to be entering, and asked if she had received his voice mail message!!! she had told him Not to send voicemails over a year ago previously.

 

Now my question is this, as he has not helped one jot, in the 18 months that she attended A4E, does she bother to speak to this WP [personal abuse removed] and tell him where to shove his mandated phone call, or should she ignore him and keep him guessing so he can't get his outcome fee?

Edited August 10, 2013 by honeybee13
Personal abuse removed

[jasta11]

If neither of you are now on JSA then the [personal abuse removed] have no claim at all on you..though they never seem to accept this and need it hammering into them with a blunt weapon. I'd tell them to get lost and threaten to report them to their head office, the DWP, your MP and the media for harrassment if it continues.

 

Did anyone witness him grabbing your wife's arm? I'd certainly pursue an assault case if you had witnesses, his actions are disgraceful. If it happened on the street then maybe there's CCTV evidence.

Edited August 10, 2013 by honeybee13
Personal abuse removed.

[Mr.P]

He also grabbed her arm as we were leaving another building as he happened to be entering, and asked if she had received his voice mail message!!! she had told him Not to send voicemails over a year ago previously.

 

Now my question is this, as he has not helped one jot, in the 18 months that she attended A4E, does she bother to speak to this WP [personal abuse removed] and tell him where to shove his mandated phone call, or should she ignore him and keep him guessing so he can't get his outcome fee?

 

Taking hold of an arm without consent is common assault - A criminal offence that can be prosecuted for and lead to fines and/or a prison sentence in the most extreme of cases. (Had that one covered as part of a recent First Aid at Work course).

 

A short letter to A4e head office demanding that no further contact is to be made in any form should be posted off Monday. Point out that as Mrs Signmaker is no longer in receipt of JSA, therefore there is no legal or contractual obligation to respond to any demands sent out by A4e. Should any staff see fit to attempt any further contact, it will be regarded as harassment and/or stalking and WILL be reported to the police and other regulatory bodies.

 

Should any A4e staff assault you or your wife, you are quite within your rights to defend yourselves with appropriate and proportional force. For example, someone grabs her arm from the side or behind, a quick knee to the groin or kick to the leg would be an instinctive and appropriate response. To follow up with a gouging of the eye may be considered excessive unless the assailant continued in his/her actions.

Edited August 10, 2013 by honeybee13
Quoting a post with an unwanted word in it.

[mr_zedlister]

What would I have to do at ingeus to be deemed as a sanction? Oh and Mr P how comes you are so knowledeable of all this stuff? You mentioned you have never been with Ingeus are you with a similar farsical programme?

[signmaker]

Hi jasta11,

Perhaps I over reacted with the arm grabbing, he actually put his hand over her arm as they passed each other causing her to turn to face him, had I known who he was would have perhaps said something to him, she brushed off his question and carried on walking out of the building, but yes he shouldn't have touched her.

I'm sure the building would have had cctv should we want to take this further.

 

Mr.P,

I think a short letter to A4E head office as advised by yourself and jasta11 is the way to go stating that he did grab her arm, and of course reminding them that they have no hold over her now that we are not claiming JSA.

And tell them that I am going to report them to the Police and DWP for harrassment if the letters do not stop, see how they like to be threatened.

 

By the way I also like your defence strategy, I'll remember this if it ever happens again.

 

Thank you both for your replies.

signmaker

[Charlotte_Henderson]

I've been forgotton about...

 

Haven't been to Ingeus since March 2012! (I started September 2011), i stopped going because it wasn't doing me any good for my mental well being, i've had various letters and messages on my phone, but have ignored them, but the thing is i've still been signing on, did 12 weeks temporary work last October/December (Job Centre knew about this), yet i haven't been santioned, neither has the Job Centre asked about it.

 

Have i broken Ingeus?

 

By the way, i'm doing exactly the same thing i would've been doing at Ingeus (spending hours looking at the same jobs week in week out on the Job Pages on the Internet.)

 

I didn't want to do the pointless excercises and programs!

 

They will catch up with you eventually they always do. a friend of mine didn't attend ingeus for 8 months, she like you ignored letters and messages left on phone and didn't get santioned. then one day when she went to sign on JCP, told she was being santioned for 6 months with no BENEFITS as she hadn't been attending ingeus! she did appeal but it made no difference she still had to go without for 6 months!

 

As much as i hate Ingeus and i do believe me, i dont want to be left without money for 6 months

[Charlotte_Henderson]

 

I have been with my WP a year , They put me with someone aggressive, to the point you felt under arrest. There was one time he was so harsh/vile towards me that i left shaking and signed off my JSA for 1- 2 weeks.

 

 

Sounds like one we had at our ingeus, she's no longer an advisor but a trainer.

 

Everyone used to complain about her and she made several people ill dreadful woman.

[Charlotte_Henderson]

I wouldn't put it past Ingeus to use key-logging software on their public computers to record people's passwords.

 

Just think how handy it would be for them to be able to log into a client's email account, UJ account, agency accounts, etc and get the names and addresses of employers the client has contacted. A veritable gold mine!

 

..hope you also told your hubby to record everything, or at least put his phone on the table and pretend he's recording everything

 

My hubby wasn't there and he isn't at ingeus well not for the next 18 wks, after i did it i deleted all internet history/passwords on the pc, no flies on me!

[atum2013]

Does anyone know whether Ingeus make any checks with the Jobcentre about whether you are still signing on? I have been signing on for a while now but signed off from Ingeus months ago as I found work. However I only did a trial day with the job before finding out more about it and it simply didn't pay enough to live on and in some cases wasn't paying people at all. I then didn't inform Ingeus that I wasn't continuing with it as I had already signed off from them and was told I didn't need to attend any more appointments. The advisor has called me at least 5 times since then and just asks whether I am still in work. I have told him yes I am self-employed, even though I am still with the Jobcentre. I am a bit concerned that they might ask the Jobcentre am I still signing on and the Jobcentre will tell them I have been signing on for months when Ingeus thought I was in work. Anyone know what to say to them if that situation comes about?

Short answer is YES. If the WP office and the JCP office has a reasonable relationship then they can call them to check signing details direct but something called provider direct has come into play where the WP provider can call up and use a log in to access info. The operators are strict tho and if the caller cannot EXACTLY match data as is held by DWP then the call will be declined. They dont tell you why but you can just guess and call again tomorrow. These calls would occur because of a suspicion on the part of the WP provider, they may think you are lying when they talk to you or word of mouth may suggest your change , but the JCP generate a Change of Circs document that is sent to providers, it would list you resigning. but it works the other way too....if you started work and WP provider caught wind of it and they had your consent to share they would phone the employer also a change of circs document would also detail if you signed off...either as claim closed as you failed to sign or because you had secured employment. Many WP providers learn to not just rely on these Change of circs documents as given the number of times you see details on them of people not assigned to your office is very high so you can assume clients you should have seen CoC for has gone to another office maybe even a different provider!

[atum2013]

They will catch up with you, especially as you are nearing the end of your two years, if you are still signing on when you hit the end of your two years the WP provider is required to produce an exit plan for you for the JCP. Basically a document that proves they tried to work with you helping you blah de blah. If your still signing and the WP realises that your about to be a completer (what JCP calls people finishing 2 years on WP) they will be desparate to show they tried to help you. The whole completer thing is unclear...unlikely any kind of penalty to the WP provider but they dont want lots of stats showing they failed people do they.......

[atum2013]

He's only interested in getting his £100 bonus because you got a job while at Ingeus.

 

I dont blame you for going off on a rant, as that place makes you want to do that regularly.

My hubby has now been moved to the training place i was at, i am now back at ingeus. he told his new adviso,r if you think what you do here is going to help me find a job your mistaken. my wife was here for 18 weeks apart from stupid courses and weekly job search sessions you did nothing!!!

 

I will attend each week but dont think your doing me a favour cos your not! she didnt have an answer for that!!!

 

bonus is interesting. complaint has been made by client at our local JCP that a member of staff boasted that they got £250 for each placement. Think its appalling but unbelievably unprofessional to boast in front of people struggling to find work of getting such a bonus.

[Charlotte_Henderson]

bonus is interesting. complaint has been made by client at our local JCP that a member of staff boasted that they got £250 for each placement. Think its appalling but unbelievably unprofessional to boast in front of people struggling to find work of getting such a bonus.

 

Dont know what bonus the staff at JCP get but i know at Ingeus its £100 for each person they get off their books.

i