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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Hoogie32 v Clydesdale Bank (Yorkshire) ***WON***


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Congratulations Hoogie. I'll update your thread when you have a cheque.

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Hello, sorry not updated.

 

So yes, full offer + interest + costs received.

 

So is the best option now just to accept, ie - sign the letter and send it back to them, then send the notice of discontinuance when I have the funds?

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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Hello, sorry not updated.

 

So yes, full offer + interest + costs received.

 

So is the best option now just to accept, ie - sign the letter and send it back to them, then send the notice of discontinuance when I have the funds?

 

That was a coinidence! That is exactly what I'd do Hoogie.

 

Well done again!

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cool, thats good enough for me

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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  • 2 weeks later...

well still not got my money from them, and due to some very bad personal news I didnt send the court bundle.

 

I have copies of the letter of offer etc and did not sign the letter of discont. this is enough proof isnt it as i wouldnt put it past these to turn it on its head?

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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I would be inclined to phone the court to be on the safe side Hoogie. Tell them that the bank wrote and made you an acceptable offer, but that it has not yet materialised. Also owing to your personal circumstances (hope it's not as bad as it sounds), your bundle is late and you are trying to get the payment offered. See how they respond.

 

I suggest that you also fax a letter to the bank and remind them that at the moment the court case has not been settled, and won't be until you get paid. I have no doubt they will not have submitted a bundle either, but you should get your money quite quickly then. I suggest you remind them that interest is still accruing at the daily rate of xxp (assuming you are claiming that). It's Tuesday now, so I suggest you give them a deadline of Friday to receive the cheque or you will be submitting your bundle.

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Caro

 

Many thanks once again, i shall follow your advice first thing tomorrow.

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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Well Peeps - Its been emotional.

 

CHQ NOW IN MY HANDS FOR FULL AMOUNT PLUS INTEREST PLUS COSTS.

 

Can A Mod please change the title of this thread to WON.

 

Many thanks to the followuing people, without them I would have more than likely bottled it. It just shows what a fantastic community there is on here. Donation will be made in the next couple of days also.

 

Caro, Thailand, Trundlecat, JulesTools, Davg, Ladykenco, Zebby, Robertxc, Isiris, jonny2bad, ozzywizard, judi24.

 

Also anyone else that helped out - thanks very much

  • Haha 1

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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thanks peeps - im just going to the bank now and hand it over to the manager, im really tempted to take a camera as well!!!

 

:)

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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Another sterling performance.

Well done

:D

Prelim letter sent - 29/12/06

'Go away' letter recieved 05/01/07

LBA (7 day to sort it) letter sent - 05/01/07

'Will look in to' received - 10/01/07

Claim submitted - 16/01/07

Date of hearing set for 21/05/07

Offer of charges plus costs rejected - 17/04/07

Offer of charges,interest,costs accepted - 25/04/07

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In summary, this is how my case panned out.

 

£3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06

LBA sent 22/9/06,

MCOL Sent 10/10/06

MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06,

MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06,

02/11/06 - £929.00 Offer Rcvd,

03/11/06 - Rejected,

09/11/06 YB Defended,

10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;)

30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd,

09/01/07 - Rejected,

11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07,

15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd,

15/11/07 - Rejected,

07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL),

12/02/07 - Accepted,

21/02/07 Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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Well Peeps - Its been emotional.

 

CHQ NOW IN MY HANDS FOR FULL AMOUNT PLUS INTEREST PLUS COSTS.

 

Can A Mod please change the title of this thread to WON.

 

Many thanks to the followuing people, without them I would have more than likely bottled it. It just shows what a fantastic community there is on here. Donation will be made in the next couple of days also.

 

Caro, Thailand, Trundlecat, JulesTools, Davg, Ladykenco, Zebby, Robertxc, Isiris, jonny2bad, ozzywizard, judi24.

 

Also anyone else that helped out - thanks very much

 

Blimey Hoog, are you practising for the oscars. Congratulations.:p

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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lol - it felt like that to be honest.

 

Anyway - ill still be around as im now going for a three pronged attack on :

 

Capital One (Credit Card)

IGroup (Mortgage)

RBOS (Credit Card)

 

:rolleyes:

 

All prelim letters typed up and ready to go.

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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Hope the mortgage one isn't for ERCs. Otherwise good luck. I should think they'll be a breeze compared to YB, although I have to say from joining in September to settling in February is much better than it was.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Moderators - Can you now move to the Successes forum.

 

Thanks

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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The pleasure is mine Hoogie.:D

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Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi Hoogie32,

 

I am claiming 680 pounds from the CB, I sent them the claim letter detailing the charges and asking for the money back. I have recieved this conditions letter sayng that they are within their rights to charge this, and if i dont reposnd in 8 weeks they close my case. What do i do next ? What is an LBA? I need help what to do next ? thanks

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