New sofa from Harveys faulty on delivery

[HellenMellon]

We took delivery of a sofa today from Harvey's. The recliner mechanism on one side jams ( the recliner mechanism looks out of shape compared to the good side ). The driver said someone would contact me within three days to arrange replacing the sofa. After contacting customer services the driver's words translates to an engineer will come out in three days and try to bang it into shape and if that fails a replacement may be ordered. On the strength of the drivers comments I signed for the sofa

So here is the question :

Under the SOGA can I demand a replacement sofa or have I signed my life away to a repair rather than a replacement.

[HellenMellon]

Can anyone help with this ?

 

The update is their repair company ( Ecomaster ) want to replace ALL the working parts of the sofa. I've sent Harveys a rejection letter, but Consumer Direct seem to disagree with some ( if not all ) of the general points I see written on these forums regarding replacement and refunds.

[rebel11]

Hi Hellen

 

From Consumer Directs website :- http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/after_you_buy/know-your-rights/furniture/

 

SOGA :- http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/after_you_buy/know-your-rights/SGAknowyourrights/

 

Templates :- http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/after_you_buy/making-complaint/template-letters/

 

or depending on how you paid, you can do a Chargeback :- http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/sale-of-goods/your-rights-when-paying-by-credit-card/chargeback-on-credit-and-debit-cards/ There is a time limit, contact the C/C tell them whats happened.

[HellenMellon]

Whats the time limit for a Credit Card ( mastercard ) chargeback ? Item ordered and paid for in early Jan 2011 , but didn't arrive until 2nd Feb 2011.

 

I've given Harveys 14 days to reply, so I'm not sure if that would affect and chargeback .

[rebel11]

Whats the time limit for a Credit Card ( mastercard ) chargeback ? Item ordered and paid for in early Jan 2011 , but didn't arrive until 2nd Feb 2011.

 

I've given Harveys 14 days to reply, so I'm not sure if that would affect and chargeback .

 

I believe it's 120 days. See what Harveys say the 14 days isn't an issue as long as you don't forget. If you buy something new it shouldn't need to be fixed. Why wasn't it perfect when it was delivered?

[HellenMellon]

Why wasn't it perfect when it was delivered?

 

Damaged in transit. According to the repair company Harveys use, 1 in 10 are damaged due to the way they're stacked in containers.

 

It's a problem for all the furniture retailers ( DFS etc ), they all get the same complaints. Trying to get a delivery driver to reload the sofa and take it back is impossible. There choosen comment is, someone will contact you in 2-4 days to arrange a replacement. Except the replacement is a repair.

 

Next thing you know, 3 months have gone by and your new sofa is being used, so by the time you do get them into court you dont get a full refund because you've had some use from the good ( Consumer Direct advise ).

 

So I'm trying to fast track everything through while it's only 2 1/2 weeks old.

[rebel11]

Let me put it another way, 'it should of been pristine when it was delivered, free from any defects, the same thing happened to a relative with Harveys. Just keep on top of it.

[csa-furniture]

Under SOGA you are entitled to reject goods within a reasonable amount of time, I would say within 3 days of delivery is reasonable.

 

All you need to do is contact the store where you purchased.

 

They may wish to appoint a technician such as Ecomaster to inspect (with view to repair) you can refuse any repairs.

 

Rejecting goods = replacement or refund

 

The information above only applies to delivery damage

 

------- I work in consumer law for a large furniture retailer -------------

[dx100uk]

"i have an excellent understanding of consumer laws"

 

more like 14-28 days

 

think you'ed better read up a bit more before giving such poor advice.

 

remind me not to shop a csa someone

 

dx

[cerberusalert]

Under SOGA you are entitled to reject goods within a reasonable amount of time, I would say within 3 days of delivery is reasonable.

 

 

Have you never heard of 'merchantable value'? If not you'd do well to read up on "The Law Of Contracts" particularly where the maxim caveat emptor does not apply.

 

A warranty is violated when the promise is broken; when goods are not as should be expected, at the time the sale occurs, whether or not the defect is apparent. The seller should honor the warranty by making a timely refund or a replacement. The date of delivery starts the time under the statute of limitations for starting a court complaint for breach of warranty if the seller refuses to honor the warranty. This period is often overlooked where there is an "extended warranty" in which a seller or manufacturer contracts to provide the additional service of replacing or repairing goods that fail within the extended period. However, if the goods were defective at the time of sale, and the relevant statute of limitations has not expired, then existence or duration of any "extended warranty" is secondary: there was a breach of a primary warranty for which the seller may be liable.

 

It could be an unfair and deceptive business practice (a statutory type of fraud) to attempt to avoid liability for breach of a primary warranty by claiming expiration of the irrelevant extended warranty. A statute of limitations on a contract claim may be shorter (or longer) than that of a tort claim, and some breach of warranty cases are filed late and are characterized as a fraud or other related tort.

 

For example, a consumer buys an item that was discovered to be broken or missing pieces before it was even taken out of the package. This is a defective product and can be returned to the seller for refund or replacement, regardless of what the seller's "returns policy" might state (with limited exceptions for second-hand or "as is" sales), even if the problem wasn't discovered until after the "extended warranty" expired. Similarly, if the product fails prematurely, it may have been defective when it was sold and could then be returned for a refund or replacement. If the seller dishonors the warranty, then a contract claim can be started in court.

Edited February 19, 2011 by cerberusalert

[csa-furniture]

28 days to report delivery is not acceptable, I would agree upto 14 days but being reasonable most customers report damage on delivery within 3 working days.

 

Obviously, everyones opinion is different, it would be interesting to see how many retailers accept a claim for delivery 4wks after delivery.

[cerberusalert]

Obvi, ously, everyones opinion is different, it would be interesting to see how many retailers accept a claim for delivery 4wks after delivery.

It matters not whether they'll accept a claim, see post # 10;

For example, a consumer buys an item that was discovered to be broken or missing pieces before it was even taken out of the package. This is a defective product and can be returned to the seller for refund or replacement, regardless of what the seller's "returns policy" might state (with limited exceptions for second-hand or "as is" sales), even if the problem wasn't discovered until after the "extended warranty" expired. Similarly, if the product fails prematurely, it may have been defective when it was sold and could then be returned for a refund or replacement. If the seller dishonors the warranty, then a contract claim can be started in court.

[dx100uk]

????????

 

its not a case of 'accepting' a claim

the retailer does NOT make the SOGA rules

they have to abide by them

 

but ofcourse , they hope the buyer knows no different..and can be buffed away.

 

excellent knowledge of consumer law!!

 

what a joke!

 

dx

[HellenMellon]

I've added more to this thread since my initial post.

 

 

Under SOGA you are entitled to reject goods within a reasonable amount of time, I would say within 3 days of delivery is reasonable.

 

 

There is no set period, but within 30 days is deemed to be 100% in the consumers favour, but anywhere upto 6 months is still valid under certain conditions & even upto a year has been accepted by a small claims court.

 

They may wish to appoint a technician such as Ecomaster to inspect (with view to repair) you can refuse any repairs.

 

 

They did and they've been. Once again, I allowed them a reasonable chance to fix a small repair, not to rebuild the whole sofa - the repair was rejected and the sofa was rejected.

 

 

Under

The information above only applies to delivery damage

 

 

It was all delivery damaged, pointed out within 10 seconds of being unpacked.

 

 

All you need to do is contact the store where you purchased.

 

And the stores head office : Both were notified I wish to reject and have a refund within 24 hours after Ecomaster inspected the sofa ( 14 days in total since delivery.

[rebel11]

Best to stick to Consumer Legislation, it's there to protect consumers, it's a fact it exists, so opinions are superfluous in this matter.

 

28 days to report delivery is not acceptable, I would agree upto 14 days but being reasonable most customers report damage on delivery within 3 working days.

 

Obviously, everyones opinion is different, it would be interesting to see how many retailers accept a claim for delivery 4wks after delivery.

[HellenMellon]

Ironically. I got a letter from Ecomaster today, saying the parts had been ordered for the repair !

 

I wouldn't mind if the guy who came out from ecomaster gave me a copy of his report, but all he wanted was a signature on his mobile phone to say he'd been. What is it with signing blank mobile phone screens ?

 

Or could that have been a signature saying Im accepting a repair ?

[HellenMellon]

Let me put it another way, 'it should of been pristine when it was delivered, free from any defects, the same thing happened to a relative with Harveys. Just keep on top of it.

 

Here is the update.

 

Harveys contacted me today in response to my 14 day letter and said " They will not refund me under any circumstances " and pointed me to this :

 

 

http://whatconsumer.co.uk/buying-sofa/

 

 

The trader’s obligations

If the sofa which has been delivered is damaged, of poor quality, unfit for purpose or not as described, you have the right to reject it and claim a refund. However, where a repair is feasible, you must allow the trader the opportunity to do this in the first instance.

 

 

Consumer Direct also appear to think a refund is going to be 50:50 ??? What good is the SOGA if your sofa turns up damaged and you'll led to believe a company rep needs to come out to sanction the repair, when all they're doing is stalling for time. Yet at the same time you have to accept a repair if feasible ?

 

All repairs are feasible, therefore you should never be able to claim a refund, or am I missing something ?

[dx100uk]

pers

i'd write to the CEO and do a chargeback now

 

you have 120days from the date of the transaction on your card.

 

dx

[cerberusalert]

From;http://whatconsumer.co.uk/buying-sofa/

Your consumer rights

 

Any sofa you buy should be of satisfactory quality, fit for the purposes specified and as described. Therefore, if it is described as leather, that’s exactly what it should be. If it described as a particular colour or fabric, it should not differ widely from this. If it a sofa-bed, it should function as a bed as well as a sofa. It should also remain in good condition for a reasonable length of time without sagging, coming apart, or deterioration to the fabric. Just because you have had the sofa for some time, this does not prevent you from making a complaint on the basis of premature or excessive wear and tear.

 

If you are making a complaint, the retailer will always be your first and only port of call, and not the manufacturer. Retailers may also try to tell you that there is nothing they can do because you are outside your warranty period, or because you don’t have one. A warranty is irrelevant where quality and durability are concerned, and you have the right to a remedy under Sale of Goods.

The trader’s obligations

 

If the sofa which has been delivered is damaged, of poor quality, unfit for purpose or not as described, you have the right to reject it and claim a refund. However, where a repair is feasible, you must allow the trader the opportunity to do this in the first instance. The trader must cover the costs of the repair (including collection and re-delivery) and must not take too long. If a repair cannot be carried out, or has been poorly carried out, if it has taken an unreasonable length of time, or if you have experienced significant inconvenience, you are then within your rights to request a replacement. If neither a repair or a replacement can be effected, you can then ask for a discount on the purchase price or your money back.[/QUOTE]

[HellenMellon]

From;http://whatconsumer.co.uk/buying-sofa/

However, where a repair is feasible, you must allow the trader the opportunity to do this in the first instance.

 

 

But, where does this fit in ?

[cerberusalert]

To my mind it wouldn't be feasible to be without furniture whilst it was being repaired. Besides, it was neither of satisfactory quality or fit for the purpose that alone is reason for a full refund.

[HellenMellon]

To my mind it wouldn't be feasible to be without furniture whilst it was being repaired. Besides, it was neither of satisfactory quality or fit for the purpose that alone is reason for a full refund.

 

They repair it in your home, but it's still a mystery how a repair can be deemed feasible over a refund ( the mind boogles ). It's not very well explained on that site ( a consumer site as well )

[HellenMellon]

I'm just in the process of filling out the court claim against Harveys. Can anyone clarify the following for me :

 

Can I claim storage charges for looking after there faulty sofa ?

 

Since I've had the sofa I've been forced to keep it in my living room ( only space I have ), but we've borrowed another Sofa to use in the meantime. The HArveys sofa is leaving deep marks in my carpet. Can I claim for damage to this carpet ?

 

and finally - My CC provider were also sent a sec 75 letter. Do I have choose who to take to court or can I take the pair - and if so, would it be two different cases ?

[rebel11]

Hi Helen

 

This is from the OFT, I bet the deliver diver didn't give you options:- http://www.oft.gov.uk/business-advice/treating-customers-fairly/sogahome/inpractice/?id=741531

[miss muppet]

Hi Helen,

 

I can only tell you about my own experience with Harveys some 7/8 years ago.

 

Took delivery of dining room table with chair covers not as ordered i.e. wrong colour, still awaiting some months later when top of table started peeling off, their technician visited and agreed faulty. There then followed a long saga of me trying to get a replacement. One memorable call when I asked to speak to a Manager resulted in the classic comment - "All our Managers are out on the road!"

 

Long story short, took photos of offending items, took them to the small claims court, won the case,they didn't even turn up, still wouldn't pay up but we sent the bailiffs in to one of their stores!