MBNA/Arden/Britannica recoveries SARL/Mortlake - court paper received.

[the_shadow]

Thanks shadow, will try again. `its only took me 2 hours so far!!!!!

 

Dont hurry it

 

Better to be cautious than sorry later.

 

S.

[leopard lady]

CC agreement.pdf

CC agreement.pdf

 

 

this is the application form/agreement hopefully with everything deleted!!!! fingers crossed. (dont know why its in twice?)

Edited January 26, 2011 by leopard lady

[leopard lady]

blank CC agreement.pdf

 

 

This is the blank application form they sent me, with my details removed. Why would they send me this?

 

what a pigs ear I've made of this!!! Hope it doesn't put everyone off giving me their views.

 

ps. could you delete the previous one shadow, or tell me how to delete it? thanks.

Edited January 26, 2011 by leopard lady

[leopard lady]

not sure whats viewable now, or what is relevant, but i recieved (and tried to post!!!)

 

cover letter

application form (which they say is the agreement)

blank app form with my name and address on???

cca request faq (laughable)

7 page terms of agreement

signed statement with what I originally thought was default notice

[the_shadow]

Ok, it looks to me like they've sent you a set of terms & conditions, a blank agreement with your details in it... + the original agreement...

 

Does the original agreement have your signature on it, I ask because it looks to have the prescribed terms in the left hand column although they are very small so I suspect MBNA have copied it from a microfiche copy. Hence the blank agreement which will be clearer and should contain exactly the same terms as the original.

 

I think its fair to say they have complied with s78 and will possibly be enforceable in court subject to a judge.

 

All just my opinion tho....

 

S.

[leopard lady]

Unfortunately yes it does have my signature. Thanks for looking.

[gh2008]

It's an interesting one actually.

 

Being very pedantic the T&C's on the side could be deemed a separate document, they are outside of the main agreement and are in fact headed up as a separate item.

The are you sign does not refer to those terms, nor do you agree to them

 

The agreement is improperly executed though as it is not laid out correctly

 

Would I want to take either of those issues to trial - No way!! but if there are other issues as to how MBNA have dealt with you in hardship etc etc you MAY add those items to building up a case for an unfair relationship

 

The penalty for an unfair relationship, could be as simple as an order for them to remove certain charges and interest (if there is any) and for you to repay the remaining debt by affordable repayments.

 

The Court's powers are extensive in this area and so far little has been tried AFAIK

 

(I have not read the thread and do not know any other details of the account or claim if there is one - I am only commenting on the agreement - as requested)

[leopard lady]

Thanks gh2008.

 

I have only put in a request for repaymant terms as in financial hardship in Nov, as they put the interest up to 34.9%,

they have told me twice by phone that I have an arrangement to pay with interest and charges frozen,

to get a payment out of me when they were blatantly lying, as interest and charges are being added.

 

They refuse to answer my letters.

 

I have put in a formal complaint, but requested the cca as if it wasn't enforceable I had a little leverage re:the payment arrangement.

 

If they had frozen the interest and charges as ccca advised me to request, and set up the payment schedule THEY initially suggested to me, it would be paid in 5 yrs.

 

As it is they are now adding over £300 a month. How do I go about stating a case for unfair relationship, please?

[minmoo]

As seems to be their way, they are squeezing the last bit of life out of the cash cow before they pass it on. I honestly dont think they want to help LL, the wording in letters is only there to comply with the various guidelines in my opinion.

[gh2008]

complain VERY LOUDLY

 

MBNA have recently been given a very severe knuckle rapping for exactly this.

 

It is also against their Code of Practice (which I will try and dig out)

[the_shadow]

I think Minimoo has got it spot on unfortunately...... when I made my complaint through FOS about MBNA, the adjudicator told me over the phone that it was and I quote "Difficult for MBNA as they have two sets of laws to work with" Frankly I didnt have much sympathy for them

 

S.

 

Will look for something...back in a mo

 

Here:- http://www.oft.gov.uk/news-and-updates/press/2010/136-10

[gh2008]

"We will not increase interest rates in the following circumstances. Where a customer has failed to make the minimum contractual payment requested on the last two or more consecutive monthly statements; or Where an agreed repayment plan is in place in respect of the account; or Where we have been formally notified by a not-for-profit debt advice agency that the customer is in serious discussion with it."

 

http://www.theukcardsassociation.org.uk/best_practices/-/page/681/

http://www.lendingstandardsboard.org.uk/docs/addendumjan2011.pdf

 

EDIT MBNA are a board member of the UKCA !!!

[gh2008]

Oooops did see Shadow beat me to this one

Edited January 27, 2011 by gh2008
removed link

[leopard lady]

Thanks all for your help. I have a formal complaint in at the mo, refering to the fsa directions to mbna which came into force 1 jan 2011, as shadow kindly linked, specifically to make it clearer in letters sent to customers in financial difficulty that it will accept the repayment amount they have demonstrated they can afford to pay, (lol), and they have replied saying they will respond in 28 days, although I believe they have double that and usually take it.

 

I presume I need to wait for the out come of that before I complain to any of the other agencies suggested above?

[gh2008]

If they have breached the UKCA guidelines then complain to them anyway

I would complain everywhere - what's the worst you can be told - 'wait for their process to end first' ok, so what ....

 

It might not get you anywhere but it makes you feel better

It also builds up a history and for any future litigation (should it come to that) that history could be useful ....

[leopard lady]

Think I'm going to leave this until after AQ for other case is sent in on monday or I'll be suffering from acute mbnaitis!!!

 

OK, so they increased the credit limit first, which caused the inability to meet the payments. Don't know if that makes a difference?

 

On tuesday I will go through all the guidelines and see whats appropriate. I'll draft a letter briefly explaining my dealings with mbna and how its breached guidelines. Is it guidelines specific to that particular organisation of all regulatory bodies?

 

Thanks again, all.

Edited January 27, 2011 by leopard lady

[PriorityOne]

Hi Leopard Lady..... thank you for your PM....

 

That's a tricky one..... on the face of it, it does look like one of those rare forms that doubles up as an application and an agreement. You could query it but in doing so, you need to be aware that they might try and push it through the courts at some point.... If they've sent you a microfiche copy, as has been suggested on this thread, it may be worth asking for confirmation as to whether they hold a true copy, or a microfiche copy..... as what they've sent you is not easily legible..... see what they send back. and then post on here again.

 

You could word it to them in a very polite (rec. delivery) letter..... thanking them for their correspondence but the doc. they've sent is not legible. Please can they send you a legible copy of any agreement pertaining to yourself if this is available. If it is not avalible, then please confirm so in writing. If they've sent you a microfiche copy (a copy of a copy), please confirm so in writing under CPUTR 2008.

 

That way, you should know where you stand with this....

[leopard lady]

They have sent me also a seperate blank application form with the t&c on. Do they need to send a legible copy of MY actual agreement?

[PriorityOne]

They have sent me also a seperate blank application form with the t&c on.

 

That doesn't mean anything.... and could well indicate that what they have is from microfiche records. I have challenged microfiche records before now.... but you need to establish if what they've sent is indeed from microfiche before you do anything else. This is not a straightforward enforceable/unenforceable doc. in my opinion, which is why you'll need to do a bit more digging to know more about it.

[leopard lady]

Thank you. If you think its worth asking I'll draft a polite letter as you suggest, and send it off and see what happens.

[PriorityOne]

Thank you. If you think its worth asking I'll draft a polite letter as you suggest, and send it off and see what happens.

 

You have nothing to lose by doing it.....

[leopard lady]

Yes, you're right. Whats the difference between them having the original or only a microfiche copy?

[PriorityOne]

Yes, you're right. Whats the difference between them having the original or only a microfiche copy?

 

A microfiche is not a copy; it's a copy of a copy..... pedantic I know but if your argument is strong enough and you're sure of your footing with this, they may drop it. Very hard to say at the moment though....

[leopard lady]

tbh all I wanted was their original offer to pay £150 for 6 mths then the balance in 4.5 yrs and freeze interest and charges.

 

They have agreed that verbally twice and it been false.

 

This is why I sent the cca request, hoping for a bit of leverage.

 

I am petrified they'll go for a charging order if they take me to court and anything that gives me a fighting chance I'll try!!!!!

 

If they keep adding £300+ a month interest it'll end up more than the house is worth lol.

[PriorityOne]

tbh all I wanted was their original offer to pay £150 for 6 mths then the balance in 4.5 yrs and freeze interest and charges. They have agreed that verbally twice and it been false. This is why I sent the cca request, hoping for a bit of leverage. I am petrified they'll go for a charging order if they take me to court and anything that gives me a fighting chance I'll try!!!!! If they keep adding £300+ a month interest it'll end up more than the house is worth lol.

 

Are they even allowed to add that much in interest?.... ask for a full breakdown and explanation of all charges and interest added to the account, in accordance with the documentation they've sent you.

 

As for the Charging Order, they can't get one without a CCJ and you would need to default on that CCJ first anyway.... so stop worrying. The way it's going at the moment though, you may be better off going to court. At least that way, a Judge could see how reasonable you've tried to be.