What to do now? AIC

[CorrieK]

Hi there

 

I have spent several days reading through posts on this forum and everything is swirling around in my head and I'm still not clear on exactly what I should do.

 

I was made redundant last year from a well paid job and despite my best efforts, I was unable to get such well paid employment again. I ended up taking a job on less than half the salary I was originally on and visited Citizens Advice about my debts (which are quite high but I was managing them well when earning good money). The lady who dealt with my case was extremely rude and difficult to deal with and was really having a go at me for getting in to debt (without acknowledging the fact I was earning well and paying my bills every month for 3 years before the redundancy). Anyway, she arranged with my creditors for me to pay a reduced payment each money and to freeze interest etc and I set up standing orders to pay each creditor. I never missed one of these payments but after around 6months I started getting calls from DCA's saying they had taken over the debts and I had to pay them.

 

Having had no experience with DCAs it all was very scary and upsetting for me and I found it difficult to deal with . I was calling them back when asked to and trying to sort things out. I ended up transferring payments to them instead of my original creditors and they all seemed to accept the amounts that the CAB office had sorted out without dispute. Only 1 creditor hadn't switched to a DCA at that time.

 

I've since moved house and am on even less money and have started studying again to improve my situation. Then in August I got a letter from a DCA saying they had taken over from my creditor (MBNA) and I should call them (which i stupidly did). Afew days later I got a letter confirming this from MBNA. When I called the DCA they said that my account had been passed BACK to MBNA until the end of the month and then it would pass to them so I called MBNA and they said yes they still had the account but if I could pay a lump sum it woudln't get passed over.

 

Of course I didn't have the lump sum to pay so then I get a yellow card from AIC stating I must pay and they have taken over my account on behalf of MBNA. I started getting lots of phonecalls from them too (before the card even arrived!). I hadn't recieved anything from MBNA to say AIC were taking over (it had been a different DCA that the original letter was about). AIC told me to do a new list of incoming/outgoing and send it to them to arrange a new payment (wouldn't accept the one the CAB office set up for me). That is when I looked online and found this forum.

 

I have had a few calls from AIC since but not many after I told them I would send them a letter. I'm now just not sure what I should be doing. I haven't stopped my payments to MBNA and I'm not trying to get out of paying back my debts. I'm just earning less than a quarter of what I was on when I accumulated the debts and can't afford the same levels of payment.

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I just need to know where to go from here and what letters I need to send to who.

 

Thanks and keep up the good work all

[huggy41]

Hi corriek and welcome to CAG firstly DO NOT SUBMIT AN INCOME EXPEDITURE FORM only a judge or madgistrate can order you to do so.

you should of been send a letter of assignment which gives the said DCA the right to act on this.

 

some one with more experties than me should be along soon to give more helpful advice

Edited October 1, 2010 by huggy41
a. ggggg got in the way

[babybear39]

Can you list all the alleged debts, amount and the original creditors and DCAs that are dealing with them now?

[CorrieK]

thanks for your help guys.

 

My original loans were for £16,000 (Lloyds) and £6,000 (Lloyds) but I had been paying them for some time prior to the redundancy but I don't know what the exact figures are now. I also have credit cards of around £4k (Lloyds), £7.5k (Barclaycard) and £2.5k (MBNA). These were lower but charges and interest increased them abit before the interest got frozen by the cab office agreement. Like I said, alot of debt through bad choices and bad relationships over the years but once I found good employment I was working hard at paying them off and hadn't missed any payments. In the time between redundancy and the Cab office sorting out arrangements I only missed 1 or 2 payments and made token payments of £5 to show I was making an effort (as I was told to do by cab office). I have then not missed any of the arranged payments.

 

The Lloyds loans are being dealt with by BLS (part of lloyds apparently) and Moorecroft. The Lloyds card is by BLS also. Now MBNA have AIC on my case about that card (even though i'd not missed payments). Barclaycard is still with them but not for long (their original agreement was for 10months which is coming up so i'm assuming it'll get passed over to a DCA soon too).

[CorrieK]

In moving house I have misplaced some of the paperwork I had but I will look for them this weekend. I have the card from AIC but can't find the original letter from MBNA. I will try and get everything together in one place so I can explain better. thanks for your help

[coledog]

Hi and welcome

 

The CAB have been helpful in that they have helped you work out what you can afford and it is commendable that you are trying to pay money back. CAG is not here to help people avoid making payments but to help you to understand your rights - is the sum of money you are being asked to pay the legitimate amount owed and does the DCA have a right to be collecting it. Also, how can you avoid harassment by these companies and deal with it.

 

I am not a great fan of CAB debt management as CAB do not query the legitimacy of the debt or help you stop DCAs harassing you.

 

Golden rules are:

 

NEVER phone a creditor or speak to them on the phone - tell them everything in writing. Tell them this if they phone and there are letters on here that you can send to ask them to stop.

 

You can only pay what you can afford and you must tell them this - you tell them. They have no right to ask you for income or expenditure details or anything like that. You must write and say you have reviewed your I/E and can only afford a £1 - if this is all you can afford. Your priority outgoings are of most importance not these people. DCAs will push and push for bigger payments and the best plan is to get them to stop the harassment.

 

If you can give us some more information about the age and type of the debts, it should be possible to ask them for more information about it which will show them that you are prepared to stand up and fight back.

[babybear39]

BLS are indeed the collections department of LTSB. Moorcr@p are idiots inc. allegedly and quite easy to get rid of.

 

You need to chalenge these accounts by requesting your CCAs and SARs would be very useful to see what charges you can reclaim. Also if you have any PPI with any of your accounts we need to see if it was mis sold in order to make a possible claim for refund of premiums paid.

[CorrieK]

Thanks Coledog.

 

I have listed the debts above. I don't know the dates of all the debts but I will try and find out. I used to do the 0% thing and shuffle the debts from different creditors (before the redundancy that is) so I think most of them are around 2007/2008 but I will check. I know one of them removed the 0% interest rate after a mistake THEY made, not me. I had paid on direct debit but for some reason it didn't get credited to my account on time which was their fault but they never reinstalled the 0% (they did remove the charge they'd put on admitting it was their fault). That was a long time ago though so I dont' remember which it was or if I changed cards afterwards or not.

 

The CAB office helped me set up the arrangement for which I'm grateful but the woman dealing with my account made me feel 10 times worse than I already did. She was very rude and very unhelpful. She wouldn't take my calls and she didn't even send me the paperwork to let me know what I should be paying to who and when. I had to call the creditors back then and find out before eventually getting a copy of the letters she sent to them some weeks later after a million calls to her (which she never took, her colleague sent me the copies!).

 

Thanks for the advice about not phoning. I have always phoned before as I've always wanted to deal with it quickly and not have to stress about it and I usually try to write things down that are said (and the name of who speaking to) but it's usally on scrap paper and life gets so hectic that I end up misplacing it alot of the time. I need to get more organised!

[CorrieK]

I've read alot about SARs on here but I'm not entirely sure what it means or what should be said in a letter. Is there a template somewhere? I remember last year sometime I sent a letter asking about any charges on my account etc and I got back a ton of paper from barclays but I don't think i got anything from anyone else.

 

I only had PPI on my MBNA card. I tried to claim on it when I was made redundant but it never went anywhere and I was so stressed at the time with everything and trying to find work etc that I ended up just cancelling it so it wouldn't increase my total on my card. I was using redundancy money to pay my bills for a few months before I went to the CAB office (I wasn't expecting to be out of work 8 months). I do know I never asked for the PPI. I never take it when got credit before and always refuse it. I vaguely remember someone calling from MBNA asking if I wanted to add it to my replacement card (I'd had fraud on my account in 2008 and had to get all new cards/bank accounts as someone got all my info after hacking m computer) and I told them no and it was some time before I noticed they had been taking payments for PPI but by then I had been made redundant (which is when i tried to claim).

[babybear39]

There are templates in the library which you can use and edit to suit.

 

Golden rule: NEVER speak to them on the phone, IN WRITING ONLY! (just politely refuse to give any financial and personal details with someone who calls you. That is your right because you have no way of knowing exactly who they are). This creates a paper trail, even email is fine because courts (should it get that far) do accept that as proper means of communication.

 

Remember everything recorded mail and get a couple of cheap ringbinders to keep everything in with an index. Staple postal reciepts and postal order numbers to a copy of each letter you send. Clearly note every letter recieved with the date and postal method etc...

 

Good luck and hope you have a working printer! My two have had a strop and will not print!

Edited October 1, 2010 by babybear39
spelling oops!

[CorrieK]

thanks Babybear... yes I have a printer so will get on it..

[CorrieK]

Hello again

 

So I posted off a CCA to AIC along with a £1.00 postal order. I got a letter in the post today (within the time frame) stating that as they are only acting on behalf of MBNA they are unable to fulfil my request and I need to write to MBNA directly. They have provided me with the address and told me to send the postal order to MBNA too.

 

They then go on to 'remind' me that the full outstanding balance is still due and owing and I need to telephone them to prevent further recovery action being taken.

 

I am not going to call them as advised but does this mean I also do not need to make any payments to them as they don't own the debt? I am still paying the amount arranged by the cab office directly to MBNA and i've not received anything from them to say to stop. Also, do I need to send a new letter addressed to MBNA or just forward the original AIC one I sent?

 

Thanks for your help people.

[CorrieK]

forgot to say they sent it second class again!

[babybear39]

AIC are making up new bits to the CCA lol...

 

Send a short letter back with a copy of your original CCA request strongly reminding them that it is THEIR duty as they are the company chasing the alleged debt to pass the CCA request to the OC

 

Complain to TS and the OFT copying in AIC

[Stigman]

Include the following in your letter from the 1974 CCA...

 

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

I would personally send the account in-dispute letter and with-hold any payment.

 

Best Wishes

Stigman

[CorrieK]

I had that paragrah in my letter. I used a template from this forum and it had that paragraph in it but at the end if also said the following:

 

'If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee'.

 

That was in the template letter too so it's giving them permission to send the payment back so should I just send the letter to MBNA and ignore everything from AIC as they have not been assigned the debt? I'm not really sure what to do next.

[babybear39]

You can copy MBNA in if you wish but the letter must be sent to the chasing DCA as this is the correct order of things

[Stigman]

Send the account in-dispute letter to AIC so that AIC know where they stand.

You may get a few more threatograms from AIC and then it'll most likely die down and be passed onto some other pondlife.

When you do send, print your name only, do not sign and send by registerred post.

Account in-dispute letter.... http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?436-Failiure-to-provide-a-copy-of-the-agreement-within-the-prescribed-timescale.

 

Best Wishes

Stigman

[CorrieK]

ok thanks. So I will reply to AIC to tell them it's their job to pass it on to MBNA and wait to see what happens... does the time period they have to reply in start from the date of my new letter or my original one?

[harrassed senior]

After 12 + 2 days, then despite what they have written to you the account is in dispute until such time as they comply.

 

Send the Account in dispute letter as it is not automatically in dispute until you advise them. Follow the above advice in regard to making complaints.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...-is-in-dispute

[CorrieK]

thanks guys... I really appreciate your help.. will keep you updated on what happens

[CorrieK]

just read the in dispute template.... the 12+2 days isn't up yet as I sent my letter Oct 4th (so working days it would be Oct 22nd). They have sent a reply to my orginal letter and given my postal order back saying I have to send to MBNA for the CCA. I will reply to AIC telling them it is up to them to pass on my request to MBNA as they are the ones chasing the debt. I want to find out though if they have to do this by the 22nd Oct or by 12+2 days from my new letter to them? thanks guys

[coledog]

Hi

 

It is there responsibility to sort out the CCA request even if they have to contact the original creditor. The account in dispute letter will still go to them if they do not send an agreement in the time scale

[babybear39]

Hi

 

It is there responsibility to sort out the CCA request even if they have to contact the original creditor. The account in dispute letter will still go to them if they do not send an agreement in the time scale

 

YES. They have the responsibility, not you Send what I suggested and leave the account in dispute letter for now

[Rocky Roadster]

Hi CorrieK,

Keep it together and follow the CAG advice.

Just wanted to say that I am in a very similar position to you and AIC are real bullies if you speak to them on the phone.

They wouldn't / couldn't supply a CCA and tried to get me to CCA MBNA as well. MBNA were very reluctant and deceptive about having sold the account to AIC, until I cornered them.

I followed the CAG advice and sent the dispute letter in June to AIC who gave up and sold the account to Aegis, who in turn, contacted me in September. I notified Aegis of the dispute and haven't heard anything so far.

I also sent AIC and a few others the telephone harassment letter and the phones went quiet almost immediately; a great relief.

 

This is a very good place for advice; I felt lost and made a lot of costly mistakes before I found the CAG site. Creditors were making me ill with stress at a time when I have no money due to no fault of my own. I am shocked at the banks, credit card companies and DCAs apparent lack of principles.

 

Best Wishes,

 

RR