Problems at work involving... everything you can think of!!!

[Gazza01]

Good Evening All

 

I would like to ask people advice on a few issues I and others are experiencing.

 

I and my boss are victims of lying, bullying, harrasment, victimsation, collusion, abuse of power, ... need I go on? [try this for size - job evaluated at higher level on temp - following team merger, temp position taken away, but still doing the same job that was evaluated at higher level! is that legal in what I evaluate as being a imposed demotion?]

 

Can a bunch of people submit a a joint Greivance at ommissions from a important meeting notes? I know I can but can find no literature saying a bunch of us cannot do it jointly.

 

No, not a member of union - I know or can find out more about the law than the union does!!! [i am a great believer in knowing your rights].

 

A Little list of the other stuff is below:

 

-Manager confronted me with spurious claims about email content - I challenged her to name what it was - was told three time "concerned by the tone of my email", concerned by the fact I was not getting a clear answer I asked for exactly what was meant by Tone of email and she simply repeated the same phrase. I thereupon terminated the conversation and requested written explanation - I still await it even now - I was told it would not be supplied so I said I was going to do so in writing from her.

-I have still yet to receive in any shape or form a clear answer to the questions I asked when I made my initial complaint three months ago.

-after not getting a response after just under two weeks I escalated the complaint to being a Grievance which after speaking to The Employment Tribunal I have been informed is my right under the law-certain persons assert that EmTribunal is wrong!!!

-Manager out of hand dismissed everything that I had said. In fact he fully supports other manager's claim that there was something wrong with the emails

-claims my terminating the conversation stopped the matter from being resolved informally which clearly my request for a written explanation shows that I was in fact attempting resolve the matter but in a way I felt confortable with. I stopped the meeting as it was clear that I was getting nowhere in getting a clear answer from the other manager.

-I asked what he meant by "acceptable in our culture" - I have yet to receive a reply [i'm Black].

-Manager accuses me of not listening-this despite my attempt in resolving the Matter in the way that I did after I was told "Tone of Email" 3 times in a row with no clear explanation behind that.

-Other Manager has issues with the tone and manner of my communication. No Indication as to what that is - then or now - still waiting!!!

-Manager says that I am not'perceived' as being honest, polite and professional - requested clarification and proof - still waiting... This was all news to my line manager I can tell you.

-a attempt was made to appoint a junior officer to investigate a senior officer in this matter. Clearly shows inappropriate behaviour / misuse of power/position, bullying, unfair treatment,also attempting to create inaccurate and malicious information about myself.

-In a related incident concerning a forced merger of teams --- asked a question three times [red flag time] "can you work in the new team", all inside of three minutes. I was told "it was not my place" when I asked why it was being asked morethan once. I have yet to receive a answer as to what exactly was meant by that remark which I deem offensive.

-claim made have not acted in a appropriate way - no proof offered.

-no one made a attempt to take action to resolve this matter in a satisfactorily manner - up to them even following their own internal procedures!

-expressed my concerns with the behaviour of both managers to senior manager

- they displayed behaviours encompassing harassment in trying to force me down the informal route, senior manager insiting I take that route which is suspicious.

- using their rank to stifle this matter and stopping it going any further, and victimisation in the way my concerns have been inadequately addressed.

-despite emails detailing grevience only moved to instigate greviance proceeding after further followup email from myself.

- person in colluson with other manager making claims with no proof - questioned I have received no answer.

- I am currently going through the greviance procedure but the senior manager seems to have worked everywhere and something I saw today leads me to believe the person handling my case is acting in concert with that manager.

 

Any advice for the above matters from anyone?

 

Are there any execeptions to a SAR request being put in to request specific electronic data like documents, emails etc which can be ignored by anyone [for instance Companies, Goverment Departments, Councils, clubs etc] this also includes infor held by HR and email communicatons between individuals other than myelf where my name crops up. Systems in place for Managers to investigate lower ranking people but nothingplace to investigate the other way round - up to and including no clear place where to send official SAR request, only an internal form - no doubt that will get lost in the system.....

[honeybee13]

Hello. Phew, I don't really know where to start with this one. Btw, I don't know if you copied and pasted your post, but the paragraphs have gone. You're likely to get more answers if you could bear to edit the post and put some spacing in it.

 

You're going through the grievance process about all of the above, am I right? Is the company following its own procedures?

 

Regarding a joint grievance, I think it my be possible. I would ask ACAS's confidential helpline for their view, the number's on their website.

 

You seem to be implying that they may be racist. The people who would advise on this are the EHRC [equality and human rights people] and they also have a helpline and website.

 

Would you say that you are being treated in the same way as other members of staff and if not, can you prove it?

 

As you say, if you are not happy at the end of the grievance procedure and any appeal, your next step would be an ET.

 

My best, HB

[Gazza01]

Good Evening All

 

I would like to ask people advice on a few issues I and others are experiencing.

 

I and my boss are victims of lying, bullying, harrasment, victimsation, collusion, abuse of power, ... need I go on?

 

Concerning a subsidory matter try this one for size - a job was evaluated at higher level using current and past couple of years annual reports, evaluation took place externally, was put on temp promotion - important note: nothing was signed! - following team merger, temp promotion withdrawn, but still doing the same job that was evaluated at higher level! Is this legal as I evaluate this as being a imposed demotion?

 

Can a bunch of people submit a a joint Greivance at ommissions from a important meeting notes? I know I can but can find no literature saying a bunch of us cannot do it jointly.

 

No, not a member of union - I know or can find out more about the law than the union does!!! [i am a great believer in knowing your rights].

 

A Little list of the other stuff is below:

 

Manager confronted me with spurious claims about email content - I challenged her to name what it was - was told three time "concerned by the tone of my email", concerned by the fact I was not getting a clear answer I asked for exactly what was meant by Tone of email and she simply repeated the same phrase. I thereupon terminated the conversation and requested written explanation - I still await it even now - I was told it would not be supplied so I said I was going to do so in writing from her.

 

I have still yet to receive in any shape or form a clear answer to the questions I asked when I made my initial complaint three months ago.

 

After not getting a response after just under two weeks I escalated the complaint to being a Grievance which after speaking to The Employment Tribunal I have been informed is my right under the law-certain persons assert that EmTribunal is wrong!!!

 

Manager out of hand dismissed everything that I had said. In fact he fully supports other manager's claim that there was something wrong with the emails

 

Managers claims my terminating the conversation stopped the matter from being resolved informally which clearly my request for a written explanation shows that I was in fact attempting resolve the matter but in a way I felt confortable with. I stopped the meeting as it was clear that I was getting nowhere in getting a clear answer from the other manager.

 

I asked what was meant by "acceptable in our culture" - I have yet to receive a reply [i'm Black].

 

Manager accuses me of not listening-this despite my attempt in resolving the Matter in the way that I did after I was told "Tone of Email" 3 times in a row with no clear explanation behind that.

 

Other Manager has issues with the tone and manner of my communication. No Indication as to what that is - then or now - still waiting!!!

 

Manager says that I am not'perceived' as being honest, polite and professional - requested clarification and proof - still waiting... This was all news to my line manager I can tell you.

 

A attempt was made to appoint a junior officer to investigate a senior officer in this matter. Clearly shows inappropriate behaviour / misuse of power/position, bullying, unfair treatment,also attempting to create inaccurate and malicious information about myself.

 

In a related incident concerning a forced merger of teams --- asked a question three times [red flag time] "can you work in the new team", all inside of three minutes. I was told "it was not my place" when I asked why it was being asked morethan once. I have yet to receive a answer as to what exactly was meant by that remark which I deem offensive.

 

Claim made have not acted in a appropriate way - no proof offered.

 

No one made a attempt to take action to resolve this matter in a satisfactorily manner - up to them even following their own internal procedures!

 

Expressed my concerns with the behaviour of both managers to senior manager

 

They have displayed behaviours encompassing harassment in trying to force me down the informal route, senior manager insiting I take that route which is suspicious.

 

They are using their rank to stifle this matter and stopping it going any further, and victimisation in the way my concerns have been inadequately addressed.

 

Despite emails detailing grevience only moved to instigate greviance proceeding after further followup email from myself.

 

1st manger in colluson with other manager making claims with no proof - I have received no requested proof as ofyet.

 

I am currently going through the greviance procedure but the senior manager seems to have worked everywhere and something I saw today leads me to believe the person handling my case is acting in concert with that manager.

 

Any advice for the above matters from anyone?

 

Are there any execeptions to a SAR request being put in to request specific electronic data like documents, emails etc which can be ignored by anyone [for instance Companies, Goverment Departments, Councils, clubs etc] this also includes information held by HR and email communicatons between individuals other than myelf where my name crops up. Systems in place for Managers to investigate lower ranking people but nothingplace to investigate the other way round - up to and including no clear place where to send official SAR request, only an internal form - no doubt that will get lost in the system.....

 

[changed to adjust formating as suggested by honeybee13]

[papasmurf1cx]

HI Gazza... I agree with what HB has said. As far as the SAR is concerned in this case you should send it to the Registered Data Controller. The DPA requires a named individual to be the controller. You can search for the company here.. http://www.ico.gov.uk/tools_and_resources/register_of_datacontrollers.aspx

 

You have taken a lot of your time in this post to write about the email that has an acceptable "tone." Have you got this email or is the problem that they are not divulging it and only stating it is unacceptable?

 

In line 2 you give a list of the behaviours your and your boss are being made to suffer but it is difficult to decipher the actual overt acts that make these allegations up as much of what you write is 'subjective' both on management's part and yours.

 

As far as grievances are concerned there is nothing stopping a group of people putting in a joint grievance but if you do you need to focus in on the issues that affect the group. It may be that you have a better chance of getting management to listen than individually complaining, however it may be that management have an agenda that you don't know about as there seems to be some sort of agenda in the merging of teams. That suggests they are planning redundancies. Is that what you suspect?

 

The most serious allegation you seem to be making is of racism. Is this the "tone" allegation over the email? You use the term victimisation, that may be the case but you need to examine the RRA 1976 http://www.opsi.gov.uk/RevisedStatutes/Acts/ukpga/1976/cukpga_19760074_en_1 I am sure you will be aware of it as you like "knowing your rights." Note victimisation takes place because a complaint (grievance) or proceedings (ET) and other factors have also been made. So it could be a matter of timing but you have to have complained about it. Have you made an allegation against anyone?

 

Have look at section 3A for the definition of harassment under the RRA.

 

You should be wary of making allegations of collusion with no proof. You may have substantial grounds to believe it but if you allege it without proof you could be in trouble.

 

Can you also tell us if you are male or female and what kind of industry we are talking about, it helps in building a picture.

[Gazza01]

HI Gazza... I agree with what HB has said. As far as the SAR is concerned in this case you should send it to the Registered Data Controller. The DPA requires a named individual to be the controller. You can search for the company here.. http://www.ico.gov.uk/tools_and_resources/register_of_datacontrollers.aspx

 

You have taken a lot of your time in this post to write about the email that has an acceptable "tone." Have you got this email or is the problem that they are not divulging it and only stating it is unacceptable?

 

In line 2 you give a list of the behaviours your and your boss are being made to suffer but it is difficult to decipher the actual overt acts that make these allegations up as much of what you write is 'subjective' both on management's part and yours.

 

As far as grievances are concerned there is nothing stopping a group of people putting in a joint grievance but if you do you need to focus in on the issues that affect the group. It may be that you have a better chance of getting management to listen than individually complaining, however it may be that management have an agenda that you don't know about as there seems to be some sort of agenda in the merging of teams. That suggests they are planning redundancies. Is that what you suspect?

 

The most serious allegation you seem to be making is of racism. Is this the "tone" allegation over the email? You use the term victimisation, that may be the case but you need to examine the RRA 1976 http://www.opsi.gov.uk/RevisedStatutes/Acts/ukpga/1976/cukpga_19760074_en_1 I am sure you will be aware of it as you like "knowing your rights." Note victimisation takes place because a complaint (grievance) or proceedings (ET) and other factors have also been made. So it could be a matter of timing but you have to have complained about it. Have you made an allegation against anyone?

 

Have look at section 3A for the definition of harassment under the RRA.

 

You should be wary of making allegations of collusion with no proof. You may have substantial grounds to believe it but if you allege it without proof you could be in trouble.

 

Can you also tell us if you are male or female and what kind of industry we are talking about, it helps in building a picture.

 

Evening All

 

papasmurf1cx, I have all the emails. Just to make things more intesting I did a search for my place's ICO on our website. Nothing. Did it another way and it pops up. Strange.

 

Well I go into work saying there is no way that what has happened before can be topped... It seems I am wrong. Or as some would like it, Dead Wrong.

 

Todays happenings is interesting. I rang ACAS about a group Greviance after getting a slap down from management, where I was told unless specifically in Greviance Procedures I could continue. I requested in writing for specifics where in documentation or anywhere else where my approach was excluded, I asked this of the kind independant person from external HR. Less than ten minutes later I get a phone call whereupon said Kind Indi instruct me in no uncertain terms I was wrong [by implication, so is ACAS] & they must all be sent in seperatly, also pressed for what I wanted out of G-Procedure, I indicated that only one option as far as I was concerned - kicked out as so much evidence - was promptly told "highly unlikely".

 

I have so much written evidence it is a laughing matter that someone even suggests that. Just to add insult to injury I was told I could not pull up manager in future when caught he/they are caught lying, plus this will drag on for upto 6 months!!!

 

I know of someone who was out in three weeks - not a senior manager though. I get the feeling the fix is in.

 

I am seriously concerned about the above, no reply in writing, just phone call, badgering for what I thought was appropiate resolution only to be told no despite evidence, [asked if I had sent said evidence which I had weeks ago!!!] told that I had to go via mediation process, only to learn that will stretch it out to 6 months...

 

papasmurf1cx, I work in the GOV.

[Gazza01]

Hello. Phew, I don't really know where to start with this one. Btw, I don't know if you copied and pasted your post, but the paragraphs have gone. You're likely to get more answers if you could bear to edit the post and put some spacing in it.

 

You're going through the grievance process about all of the above, am I right? Is the company following its own procedures?

 

Regarding a joint grievance, I think it my be possible. I would ask ACAS's confidential helpline for their view, the number's on their website.

 

You seem to be implying that they may be racist. The people who would advise on this are the EHRC [equality and human rights people] and they also have a helpline and website.

 

Would you say that you are being treated in the same way as other members of staff and if not, can you prove it?

 

As you say, if you are not happy at the end of the grievance procedure and any appeal, your next step would be an ET.

 

My best, HB

 

Evening HB,

 

Thanks for the advice. Is this lot going through their own procedures? Yes, finally months down the line.

 

HB, you'll have a laugh when you read my previous reply above.

 

EHRC, out of time - but have proof.

 

Not treated in the same way as other members of staff ? Am aware of proof of that. That is why I want to do a SAR but

figuring out who to send to has proved to be a problem.

 

I have plenty of proof, getting to a point where I can use it seems to be the current problem.