Council Tax not Lawful?

[gynet]

just as expected

 

you just cant see past your own views

 

I am not telling people this is how it is follow me I have always taken the stand of go find it yourself

 

all I can say is with your closed mindedness no wonder the got away with it for so long.

 

I will not force my views but I will point a direction where as you havr your say and that is it .

 

I just hope that when it does hit the fan and it will .

 

you remember how you was so self confident in you views

 

Question Everything with and open mind in your own right , you are a good example why i dont give information out you can never prove to anyone anything when the mind is made up.

 

just ask your self one thing WHAT IF I AM WRONG

[Bookworm]

Then a lot of companies have given in to me for apparently no reason. :-D

[gynet]

It always has to be conflict with you i came in here to post the links you asked me to prove as police being private companys.

 

then you start your attack may kust be my natural charm or then again you may just need some new batteries for your only friend guess we will never know

 

must be something to make you so bitter

[Bookworm]

Ok, in all seriousness now:

 

I have told you, over and over again, that my views are not formed from refusing alternatives, but from studying them and finding them nonsensical, groundless, patently absurd and bordering on the hysterical.

 

You may think that shouting "follow the gourd" will get you some people daft enough, and no doubt it will, sadly. Some of us have actually read the same stuff as you have, watched the same videos or utube clips as you have, but instead of being blinded by the long clever words, have actually analysed them and reached the general conclusion of: Complete and utter bull.

 

In all fairness, if it makes you feel better, I have applied the same reading, learning, analysing and rejection principle to other myths, namely religions(plural), and in every other legal battle I have undertaken. I find that it serves me rather well to use my brain to think for myself instead of opening wide to have it poured wholesale between my ears.

 

You can fight the system and win, playing by the rules, or you can try to make up new rules, meet a few people who agree that your rules are better, and try to defeat the rest of the world who however have no interest in what your rules are, the set of rules already established working well(ish) in most circumstances for the majority of people.

 

Check my signature for my very real, provable, documented successes. Please feel free to post up yours. Until then, please do not presume to tell me that I am the one who's deluded.

[samsmoot]

A few Links for the Attention Of BookWorm

 

MMMMMMMMMM not private companys our leaders always tell the truth

 

Just a security issue sorted

 

https://smallbusiness.dnb.com/ePlatform/servlet/IballValidationCmd?storeId=10001&catalogid=70001&searchType=BSF&productId=0&manPartNumber=&busName=Alistair%20Darling&city=&country=GB&IPAddress=81.141.245.185&encryptedSignature=2d4e27b43e958bd0eb5cf252228afc4dc351c66dac8d377e89173fdced482cf3bd39bd2637b486949d69a685c57b32cdd16c7d446e09c423b86acb5d0999aa33fee086a9165e8c8bb26e76797bfafa7b8a9410890ea7b1ba4c46e923857d2a36d86e3d92a3216a6e32688f45e92659b369b327c91d291b23325772cce9523ee6

 

https://smallbusiness.dnb.com/ePlatform/servlet/IballValidationCmd?storeId=10001&catalogid=70001&searchType=BSF&productId=0&manPartNumber=&busName=Members%20of%20Parliament&city=&country=GB&IPAddress=81.141.245.185&encryptedSignature=108b9b029ee464c26e855a79f7b3619e56b24b059089b553bc84ae1f76f0cb7fd2f09058aa4b2d60394ae78b77bb269c2f0e7ca90e3e22ab03815dbf717907a9b1b80ccd45a25fa00660ea334dd4dc2c52f94a53bbca7a2acf78eb77e50196a96ac8c90dcd1b90a302d2cd961519c258177cc60d1c92aa5ca381ce731515ff6f

 

https://smallbusiness.dnb.com/ePlatform/servlet/IballValidationCmd?storeId=10001&catalogid=70001&searchType=BSF&productId=0&manPartNumber=&busName=Metropolitan%20Police%20Authority&city=&country=GB&IPAddress=81.141.245.185&encryptedSignature=1073a3cad845c61b22bb5c4638dce1b7b11349373df76cad2e591456599ccae442f1c74a99e2afc413ab44522b82072f105a6bf9fc2650c9ba0ca4e3fc2d968cb97c78ee62b44bf72a152de15400358fbd08d0f587a43ef28b5791a232c0dc9e3016fa8d0ad07f870fbb92b05686c4b5a03d5199be66c624e43e269b8b145b9a

 

https://smallbusiness.dnb.com/ePlatform/servlet/IballValidationCmd?storeId=10001&catalogid=70001&searchType=BSF&productId=0&manPartNumber=&busName=Home%20Office&city=&country=GB&IPAddress=81.141.245.185&encryptedSignature=5ef1dc46609e65fc0c7a282961fe09458a5701af624b9fcb6168524ffa95c2719f8b827fd2789620cd5e98fc1d9524498dd3d2db90ec8e9d43530635bf4e4a0206a5d72635045df7e0e2fe8f286874c0f76a9452df3a3a0edbe3b0713f8a7d8d72e864d504a955101231c947c9b19161f40f94342e0d010967a6490be62dc11c

 

What types of company is it suggested they are? Limited, PLC or what?

 

Can someone please critique that first sentence of mine? Don't sound right to me. Ta.

[Bookworm]

See? You don't listen, I have told you before I am not bitter, why should I be? I pity you for being brainwashed, I am amused by your Pythonesque declarations (anyone who has seen Life of Brian will see the parallel, lol), but I have no reason to be bitter. :-? As for attacking you, again Life of Brian springs to mind: "I want to be a mother" "you can't be a mother, you're a MAN!" "Don't you oppress me!!!"

 

Regarding my supposed battery operated friend, I can think of a few advantages one would have over you, although I suppose you'd both be big d*cks. The battery one would be more entertaining though. And likely to be more capable of intelligent thinking, come to think of it.

[loopinlouie]

See? You don't listen, I have told you before I am not bitter, why should I be? I pity you for being brainwashed, I am amused by your Pythonesque declarations (anyone who has seen Life of Brian will see the parallel, lol), but I have no reason to be bitter. :-? As for attacking you, again Life of Brian springs to mind: "I want to be a mother" "you can't be a mother, you're a MAN!" "Don't you oppress me!!!"

 

Regarding my supposed battery operated friend, I can think of a few advantages one would have over you, although I suppose you'd both be big d*cks. The battery one would be more entertaining though. And likely to be more capable of intelligent thinking, come to think of it.

 

:-D:-D Go get them bookie. Why lately are there so many people getting nasty when their viewpoint is thought wrong. Council tax ilegal, rubbish and likely to end people in court and prison:lol: Have they got nothing better to do?

[Bookworm]

Well, that's where the "pity" element comes from, LL.

 

In times of despair, when you don't know where to turn, it is far too easy for snake-oil merchants to come across as genuine. Of course, it is very tempting to think that with a few magic words, you could make your debts and obligations disappear! Who wouldn't jump at the chance, especially when the other guys, no, not even guys, faceless corporations, are presented as the cheats, liars and dictators? We can all be Robin Hood!!! Hurray!!! Off with his head!!! :-|

 

The reality of course is altogether different: If you want to beat them at their own game, then you have to play by their rules, meet them on their turf and STILL beat the crap out of them. Works for me.

[gynet]

Well Im impressed and at last you speak to me as a human being

As for the Freeman Stuff I am not really interested in the shouting and screaming of political misconduct I have been working on the financial side for a very long time now Yes there are a lot of spouting idiot and those looking for an easy ride but if you look between the lines there are many valid points to the argument.

 

With my occupation I have access to wordwide organisations that have been feeding me information at present I have over 2000 documents that

show with out a shadow of doubt we are being held in a financial burden

one of the most shocking was a side note on a document stating taxation of the old on property and using the funds from property that they have worked all there lives for has nothing to do with inheritance tax for tax purposes but these taxations are being used to stop the next generation getting a financial stability from inheritance. this is just a bit of what i have found and can state on full commercial liability. then we hear how te bank of England has raised and dropped intrest rates the bank of England lost control of UK finance 5 yrs ago to a private credit company.

 

So as I say I have information to share ans What I have does clear debts as all I have researched I have tested so please dont treat me as a fool.

because your wins on your sig would be no where near the amount I play with every day

[loopinlouie]

No one is treating you as a fool, you are doing it all yourself xx

[gynet]

And just to put thing straight your comments of me needing sympathy

maybe you are right but I would put it closer to forgiveness i seek for what i have done to others in the past I was once one of the powers I now dislike so much.

[gynet]

If I was being a fool for trying to feed clues of help then a fool I am

I am in no position to just hand it on a plate with out reprisals

but hey that,s life.

[loopinlouie]

What difference does that make? You have left a job you now realise you disliked, doesnt make you an expert on this countries laws. I worry this whole escapade is putting people at risk, are you personally gaining anything out of this? I worry there is more to it.

[gynet]

nothing to do with laws although it has a close holding it is finance that is an issue as I have stated all along its simple there is no money there is no debts as those putting you in debt are bankrupt .

 

it show you have not liseterned to a word i have said I have never claimed to know the Law but I know finance the problem we have is finance owns the law so nothing will ever be because it is the right thing to do it will all be about profit and loss but in doing this they have left themselves open in many ways we can all argue who is right and who is wrong but it still comes down to we are being robbed blind by lenders that never gave you a penny

[gynet]

YOU CREATE YOUR OWN DEBT WITH YOUR NAME

IT IS ALL FICTION banks and credit cards never part with a penny its all made up on paper

 

now if any one dont agree with that statement then you do need to wake up

the straw man is real and has been for a very long time

[gynet]

I am gaining nothing from this some are selling there packs on "follow this to be free thing"

 

that does not interest me I have enough I sold my sole at a young age then work up

 

what i do is out of guilt only the best motivation

[loopinlouie]

Fine when a person wants to use the I do if for the guilt, but hey its got to be correct and you are living in cukoo land. Seems to me your motivation would be better used elsewhere though as you are abusive to some posters.

[samsmoot]

I'd like to see gynet apologise for the 'battery' remarks - totally uncalled for IMO.

 

gynet says, "YOU CREATE YOUR OWN DEBT WITH YOUR NAME

IT IS ALL FICTION banks and credit cards never part with a penny its all made up on paper".

 

Is it not true that most 'money' isn't backed by anything of value, such as silver or gold? And is it also not obvious that whatever amount of 'fiat' currency is printed, the interest put on that amount of currency (which is a lot, as it is lent out again and again) will always exceed the amount of currency in circulation? And doesn't this have serious implications, us all being at the mercy of the money supply and that?

 

I think gynet brings up something of relevance here, and that's why I am following this thread - to see if I can learn something. Like Bookworm, I am fond of fighting them on their own terms, but "hey, let's just make sure there's absolutely nothing worth learning before giving up on the Freeman thing" is my attitude - perhaps councils don't follow correct procedure for their summonses for unpaid CT, for example, and it's interesting that you are always the 'Registered Keeper' of a motor vehicle - why not the owner?

 

As a movement for political change the FOTL 'cult' may be misguided, but I'm not yet quite ready to throw in the towel as regards to looking into some of what they have to say.

[loopinlouie]

Misguided isnt a good start though for anything of value that is, sorry xx

[Bookworm]

I'd like to see gynet apologise for the 'battery' remarks - totally uncalled for IMO.

Thank you, but don't let it worry you for one minute, in one ear, out the other. ;-)

gynet says, "YOU CREATE YOUR OWN DEBT WITH YOUR NAME

IT IS ALL FICTION banks and credit cards never part with a penny its all made up on paper".

 

Is it not true that most 'money' isn't backed by anything of value, such as silver or gold? And is it also not obvious that whatever amount of 'fiat' currency is printed, the interest put on that amount of currency (which is a lot, as it is lent out again and again) will always exceed the amount of currency in circulation? And doesn't this have serious implications, us all being at the mercy of the money supply and that?

Yes and no. Whilst the money concept is a very relative one, (why is this printed paper more valuable than that one, is £1 coin really worth its weight in gold/silver, and who decides what that £ is worth anyway?), it is still loosely based on the age-old concept of barter. Instead of carrying heavy goods to barter all around though, instead you trade it for "money" which in turn allows you to be exchanged for other goods. For providing the service which "money" constitutes, the provider levies a fee.

 

In theory of course, the money value should always be consistent with the goods that anyone might be expected to barter at any one time. In reality, worldwide, there are so many good and so much money in circualtion that it's only when certain specific goods become too much in demand, or alternatively when too many people want money instead of keeping the bartering system going that issues (grave ones) can arise.

I could go on a lot more, but it's a bit tedious to me tbh.

 

What you should be aware of however is the FOTL theory literally means that money is created, you get given a certain "value" at birth, your birth certificate is like a cheque drawn against your value (so to speak). Your name allows the lenders to check your value and they decide to create money to your value accordingly. Or something like that, I think I nodded off at some point.

 

The great argument: "it's all made up", well, duh, hardly earth-shattering news. We all know that when you get a credit card for example, someone doesn't actually collect £1000, goes to the bank, places it on your credit card account before saying "there you go, go forth and multiply (with interest!)". It's merely the next step up in the bartering system of which I spoke earlier.

 

There is a "logic" (I even hesitate to use the word), in that for example when your bank applies charges for you going overdrawn to your account and it makes you go further into debt, it is no more than an entry on your account, you haven't actually paid it and if they remove it, it is done with a few clicks. They have lost nothing, and neither have you. On the other hand, say that you pay off your overdraft then realise the charges were unlawful and you claim them back, if you had already paid the account off, then you will be repaid in money (cheque, transfer etc...) if the account is still open and overdrawn however, they will simply adjust the balance to show a credit going against your debit. With me so far?

So in that respect, yes, the debt/money/balance is created, and yet you are expected to pay for it with "real" money... or more credit for that matter.

 

But, whether in goats or groats, dupion or dubloons, pens or pounds, it is STILL, at heart, no more than an elaborate barter system. The FOTL would have you believe that because it isn't "real" money, then somehow you are not held to or by it. Personally, I would be VERY weary of trying that argument with the bank or the judge. ;-)

 

and it's interesting that you are always the 'Registered Keeper' of a motor vehicle - why not the owner?

That's an easier one to answer: Because unless you have bought the car outright, most of the time, it will belong to a bank/leasing company/HP company, etc... Far too complicated and of irrelevance to the DVLA when they want to just collect their fines or tax the vehicle! In the same way, if you fail to pay your council tax, who will they go after? The tenant of the flat or the letting agents/landlord? the answer is of course that barring the odd exception or contract being drawn differently, the tenant is responsible. As you see, the analogy works.

 

Hope you are still awake, if not any less confused, lol.

[loopinlouie]

Makes sence to me bookie xx

[samsmoot]

Hope you are still awake, if not any less confused, lol.

 

Yep, and thanks for indulging me.

 

I have come across the Birth Certificate thingy, and it certainly sounds very far-fetched.

 

You say that, "...when too many people want money instead of keeping the bartering system going that issues (grave ones) can arise."

 

I would have thought that the same grave issues would arise if there were a deliberately caused money shortage, or if debt was recalled in bulk.

 

I know next to nothing of economics, so please excuse my ignorance, but having looked at a film explaining how money and debt work it seems we are all at the mercy of the bankers due to their ability to create 'money' out of thin air, loan it out and set interest rates etc. Bank of England, The Fed: more powerful than elected representatives or not, I wonder?

[samsmoot]

unless you have bought the car outright, most of the time, it will belong to a bank/leasing company/HP company, etc... Far too complicated and of irrelevance to the DVLA when they want to just collect their fines or tax the vehicle!

 

That does make sense...cheers!

[samsmoot]

Thank you, but don't let it worry you for one minute, in one ear, out the other. ;-)

Yes, I can see that you can take care of yourself, Bookworm - nice comeback BTW - but there's no need for that kind of thing. Kinda makes me lose respect for people when they resort to such silliness.

[Bookworm]

Yep, and thanks for indulging me.

 

I have come across the Birth Certificate thingy, and it certainly sounds very far-fetched.

 

You say that, "...when too many people want money instead of keeping the bartering system going that issues (grave ones) can arise."

 

I would have thought that the same grave issues would arise if there were a deliberately caused money shortage, or if debt was recalled in bulk.

 

I know next to nothing of economics, so please excuse my ignorance, but having looked at a film explaining how money and debt work it seems we are all at the mercy of the bankers due to their ability to create 'money' out of thin air, loan it out and set interest rates etc. Bank of England, The Fed: more powerful than elected representatives or not, I wonder?

Yes, you're absolutely right, it is a dangerous tool.

 

The FOTL, like all good scams, work by having some realistic/truthful stuff woven into it, if you find the money as money doesn't exist, then you can be sucked in deeper until the birth certificate stuff does, and so on, and so forth.

 

Historically, there is no doubt that the money system was, and still is abused. You only need to look at Zimbabwe's galloping inflation, the NINJA mortgages in the US, which in turn set off the biggest global recession ever seen, all due to the greed of a few privileged who wanted to have yet more money and didn't care who they trod on to get it. Back in time, Philippe le Bel borrowed, borrowed, borrowed from the Templars and then annihilated the Order when he was too much in hock to them. A bank today can bankrupt someone by piling up charges which don't even exist, but are solidified by property, goods etc... Economies who thought they could sort out their problems by printing more money soon found it was even more worthless against other currencies, etc etc etc...

 

So... The principle is correct, the conclusion warped. If you are part of the system, whether you like or not, then you have to carry out your part, you can't just opt out of the bits you don't like. Unless, as I have said a long time before, you can afford (but with what money?) your own private island and create a truly land of the Free men.

 

In fact, if I were a multi multi billionnaire, I think I would do it as an experiment, recruit volunteers FOTL to live there, relying solely on their principles. I'd take a bet that in a matter of weeks, it would be a cross between Animal Farm and Lord of the Flies!