Notice of Intended Bailiff Action - 10 days before bankruptcy

[carfool]

Hello

 

I would appreciate any advice that could clarify things for me.

 

I have seen that Local Authorities have to send a Notice of Bailiff action at least 14 days before they send a bailiff. Is this a particular notice sent - or do the many letters from the reminder stage count?

 

We have had reminders, letters stating that the Council may use Attachment of Earnings, Bailiffs etc - general letter but no specific letter just to warn us that the Bailiffs have now been instructed and will be attending.

 

Am I right in assuming that the statment/letters saying they may send Bailiffs, Attach Earnings etc counts as the Intended Action notice - or should I have had a specific letter?

 

We go to court for bankruptcy on Thursday 8th April. The bailiff's first visit (I did not open the door - he wrote down details of the car in the drive - my father-in-law's and then posted a blank letter through saying this was first visit) was last Monday.

 

I am unsure whether if I contact him and say bankruptcy is on Thursday he may rush in to take goods - so I have left it - the letter said one day and he would return but have heard nothing.

 

What if he returns before Thursday - do they always leave letters if they visit, or could he have been round again when I am out?

 

When is one Bankrupt? Is it after all the processing or as soon as Judge stamps it Thursday morning?

 

Should I speak to the Council, solicitor employing bailiff or bailiff?

 

Also, I see Bailiff's have to be certified for CT Arrears, are they individually employed and certificated - the letter left is from the Solicitors Firm giving a name and number for Bailiff and a letter from them - does that mean he may just be employed by Solicitors? Where would that leave me?

 

Currently we are simply keeping doors locked and laying low. We use my father-in-law's car since ours was scrapped a few months ago - would this mean they can take it?

 

appreciate any feedback

[fork-it]

contact your official receiver and have the debt included to your bankruptcy and they will send notice to the council and they, in turn should inform bailiffs. They cant levy someone else car, but if its yours then make a bill of sale.

[carfool]

It is listed in our debts on statment of affairs, we will add the bailiffs bit. However, I am worried about the time between now and Thursday - also, at point bankruptcy is official?

 

Not sure what you mean about bill of sale point, to whom? It is my father-in-law's car - registered to him, but we are using it and so am not sure whether they would say it is therefore counted as ours?

[ploddertom]

My understanding that for Council Tax if the Liability Order is granted before Bankruptcy then it can still be enforced against by a Bailiff.

 

I find one part of what you say a little confusing:

"the letter left is from the Solicitors Firm" can you clarify a little more on this.

 

PT

[westgarth]

maybe put a notice in the car widow when you park it on your drive saying that this car belongs to mr xxxxxxxx then the baliff is on notice that it isnt yours. If the baliff clamps it and levies on it, it is then the owners responsibility to prove it is theirs and not yours which is hassel that you dont want... if you put a notice in the car window, or better still a copy of the vehicle registration document so its plain to see, then you might have a case against the baliff because he would have levied knowingly incorrect

 

I would have thought that only when a levy has been made by the baliff will the levied against goods transfer into their custody, while there is no levy they are still yours to do with what you want and will be part of your bankruptcy so therefore belong to the official receiver etc...

 

The liability order might over rule this as has been pointed out, speak to the receiver about it for clarification then come back on here and let everyone know what the ruling is

 

I think on the walking possession order that a baliff will want you to sign it says that you have to inform anyone else who wants to take possession of the goods that they are already in the possession of the baliff. So if nothing is signed nothing belongs to the baliff

 

dont speak to the baliff or the council etc or inform them of what is happening because they will act quickly to secure their debt, and dont let them into your home or sign anything, if the baliff comes tell him that you are fully aware of your rights and that you dont have to let him in.

 

A friend of mine declared himself bankrupt, his debts were gone and he started to live his life again, its not ideal but probably loads better than being pestered by baliffs etc, that was about 2 years ago, he has his own business, bank accounts etc

 

good luck with everything

Edited April 3, 2010 by westgarth

[RaeUK]

As advised earlier, the car is not yours so cannot take. You will be made bankrupt from the time the judge records it on the court date.

MAKE SURE that you have included every single debt you can think of. iirc those will be covered - ones you may have missed will not be. This INCLUDES council tax irrespective of liability order. [speaking from experience here ]. Any old parking fines lying around? Old utility bills etc etc

Don't let the bailiff in...

Good luck, mine was a very pleasant affair!

Best wishes

Rae

Edited April 3, 2010 by RaeUK

[Dodgy Geezer]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but, council tax can be included as a debt, but its up to the individual council whether they wipe it out or not.

 

9.11B Local authorities – timing of distress in bankruptcy proceedings

(November 2008

The right of local authorities to distrain for unpaid council tax and non-domestic rates (pre and post bankruptcy order) is exercisable at any time, including after the bankruptcy order and even against property comprised in the bankrupt's estate, in accordance with section 347(8 and (9) of the Insolvency Act 1986. The only exceptions being where an application for an interim order, under section 253 of the Insolvency Act 1986 is pending, whereby the court may forbid the levying of distress under section 254(1)(b) of the Insolvency Act 1986. Additionally, where an interim order has been made under section 252 of the Insolvency Act 1986, leave of court must be obtained before distress is levied (see paragraph 9.37).

Any liability for council tax or rates arising after the bankruptcy order, is not provable in the bankruptcy proceedings and the local authority can use all of the collection methods available to it in the recovery of such a debt, Where the local authority has distrained upon the bankrupt’s assets in the period of three months ending with the date of the bankruptcy order, the goods or their proceeds of sale are charged for the benefit of preferential creditors (see paragraph 9.33).

[RaeUK]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but, council tax can be included as a debt, but its up to the individual council whether they wipe it out or not.

 

Rather we had clarification Dodgy. I also had some very old business rates written off. Clearly I had a very good council! Hope the OPs is as good

 

Thanks

Rae

Edited April 3, 2010 by RaeUK
Councils need to remember that only Mums go to Iceland...

[High Court Enforcer]

but if its yours then make a bill of sale.

 

It's this act of trying to cheat the system that causes so many issues. I would advise that if the sale if made purely to defeat distress then I as a certificated bailiff would remove the asset anyway and argue it in court.

 

Make your representations using the correct procedure and lawfully.

[Dodgy Geezer]

I would advise that if the sale if made purely to defeat distress then I as a certificated bailiff would remove the asset anyway and argue it in court.

 

So even though presented with a legally binding document that states the sale before levy, you would ignore this.???????????

 

No wonder your kind are hated so much.

[Dodgy Geezer]

Rather we had clarification Dodgy. I also had some very old business rates written off. Clearly I had a very good council! Hope the OPs is as good

 

Thanks

Rae

 

Yes. £1.2k also. But the facts are HERE in their own handbook.

[carfool]

I am getting confused. I thought that you were not allowed to sell anything before bankruptcy to avoid it been part of the assets - for up to five years before?

 

We are using my father-in-laws car - we have full use of it until we buy another which is not going to be anytime soon as we have no money. I am wondering what will happen if the bailiff takes it? Although his, we have use of it so would that be used as an argument for not returning it?

 

I have never had a bailiff visit before. There is a lot of conflicting advice.

 

I go bankrupt Thursday - will my Council Tax arrears be written-off - both the Council and CAB advised me the CT arrears would. What happens between now and Thursday - if I tell the bailiff will he go away or try harder?

 

Once I am bankrupt and I tell the council and bailiff what will they do? I assumed that would be it but was not sure at what point - is it when the judge stamps it or after receiver notifies everyone?

 

I am now thinking that even if I am bankrupt the bailiff will still try and visit.

 

I should also stress I have no assets, rented house with rent arrears, borrowed car, no items of value in the home - all old tvs - no flat screens etc,

[carfool]

RThe car is registered to my father-in-law and not us btw if it matters

[RaeUK]

Carfool, please don't stress about this. If the car is your fathers then, at the least, he can take out a statutory declaration to that effect. About £5/£10 is the going rate. With regard to your council tax debt, I had no problem. Maybe call either your local council to query this or the Office of Official Receiver. This is an area you need good help on. Don't rely on online discussions. Clearly it depends on individual circumstance...

Best wishes

Rae.

[carfool]

Thanks Rae

 

I had thought after talking to CAB and reading that once you file for bankruptcy the debts would be written off, however, I am now thinking that actually - they can still send the bailiffs in after the bankruptcy order is made - not that we have anything really - still stressful to know having gone through bankruptcy every stranger at your door is more likely to be a bailiff not less.....

 

You are right though, one has to just go through it and see what happens - there is so much conflicting advice on-line. Need a bailiff friend ...

[carfool]

what is the statutory declaration - where does he do that - I am embarrassed to have to ask him to, we have not told them bankruptcy is imminent - they just worry even more.

[hallowitch]

you don't need a stat dec all you have to do is write a letter (recorded deliver ) informing the bailiff company that the bailiff did not leave a notice of seizure of goods and inventory on(date) but was seen taking notes regarding car make reg number however this car does not belong to you and you are aware that they can do a DVLA check to confirm this

Edited April 5, 2010 by hallowitch

[marcaz]

Cartool, stop worrying its quite painless, i was made bankrupt in 2006, business rates were writen off, and personel council tax, my half was taken off, but wife still had to pay hers as it was a joint bill.

As for the car its not yours so they cant have it, simple as that.