Bit of an unusual one.... desperate!

[Northern_Lass]

Hi,

 

Not quite sure how to put this as its a bit delicate so I'll go from the top....

 

My sister lost her job, and then her partner died leaving her to raise their daughter. Debts mounted up she struggled on but ended up having a breakdown and was caught shoplifting. The first, last and only time in her life. The store recovered the goods off her and she ended up in court. She really was in a state and the judge plainly saw this and although issued a heavy fine, he could see she was genuinly a good person having a very bad time. She was so ashamed and cant even bring herself to tell her parents - im the only one that knows.

 

That said I'm not condoning what she did, just trying to explain the extenuating circumstances.

 

She paid the fine at the court and we thought that was the end of it.

 

She found out yesterday that a debt recovery firm have been sending letters to an old address saying that she owes them £250 for damages and are taking out a civil suit against her to get the money. She hasne replied due to them sending the letters to her old address.

 

On 12th Novemeber they gave her 14 days or they would start court proceedings. There have been no further letters but as she only got the letters passed on yesterday, she is now beside herself again and very upset and stressed. I readlly cant see her go through all this again in court she is so distressed.

 

I have said I think it seems to be excessive at best that they are claiming for 'costs'. She was held at the store for 1 hour before the police arrived and I dont know how much a security guard earns an hour but I'm guessing its not £250.

 

She has paid a heavy fine for the offence, and has expressed her shame and apologies to the judge. Is this right that she has to pay again?

 

Any advice is greatfully received.

[Hardupnotfedup]

She pays damages or costs if the judge orders it, that is it plain and simple tell them to show proof from the court, as they won't be able to report them to the proper bodies. Can you post up the demand letter removing all personal details I think it would make interesting reading, you only need to pay damages if the court ordered it.

[Hardupnotfedup]

oops.... they are trying it on with the court threats it will NEVER HAPPEN report them now OFT TS. Tell your sister that CAG said stop worrying they are pond life out for a quick buck just ignore them.

[vjohn82]

Disgraceful behaviour... I would countersue for harassment. The law has dealt with this case appropriately. The shop retained the benefit of the goods. Therefore there is no further costs issue.

 

Any defence would be to put the Claimant to strict proof of the damages/losses in question.

 

I would tell her not to worry until a Claim Form arrives. Then post it up here and we can deal with it then...

 

OR

 

I would be happy, if I had all of the facts should you wish to reveal them, to draft a letter.

 

Good luck to her

[mandyjayne]

Hi...

 

I heard about this on radio two jeremy vine was disscussing it...let me go find it and will post up for you

 

MJ

 

Here you go...

 

 

CITIZENS Advice has criticised a Nottingham company in a report about businesses which pursue shoplifters for compensation – often without crimes being reported to police.

Retail Loss Prevention, a centre for retail research, features in a report out today entitled 'Civil Recovery: Unreasonable Demands?'

The CAB says it has been dealing with increasing cases of clients accused of shoplifting or employee theft who are then pursued for "substantial sums of money" as compensation.

It says: "Criminal charges are rarely brought and often the police aren't even called.

"In some cases the intent to shoplift is questionable. Clients are then surprised to receive a letter demanding a large sum of money, weeks after the event, when they had thought the issue was resolved.

 

"We believe the manner in which these requests for payment are made, and the threat of escalating costs and court action may constitute 'deceitful', 'unfair' and 'improper' business practice, as defined by the OFT.

"Whilst Citizens Advice doesn't condone crime of any kind and does not underestimate the cost to retailers, we believe that if retailers are dissatisfied with the level of governmental action against retail crime, and seek civil redress, they must do so using means that are transparently fair and proper."

The report says Retail Loss Prevention was founded in 1998 and its registered office is at Nottingham-based law firm Actons Solicitors.

RLP managing director Jackie Lambert said: "Civil law is there for us to take action.

"Shoplifting is the one area of crime that has increased where all other areas are decreasing.

"Sadly in Britain today people in their homes are having to take more security measures because of things happening.

"It is a claim for compensation. If somebody commits a wrongful act you have the right to take out a civil claim to recover the cost that has been incurred."

Edited January 6, 2010 by mandyjayne

[Northern_Lass]

Thank you all so much for the advice and support. I've spoken to my sister and she is coming round tonight to have a look at the forum and your messages. She is bringing her letters and will post up the last one she had as requested.

 

I can understand them wanting to try to prevent it happening but i dont see what they are wanting compensation for - they recovered the goods and my sister mentioned that part of the fine she had was detailed out to cover costs and compensation to the store. Again, will post details later.

 

Thanks for that MJ, what a cheek they have! I know the crime shouldnt happen in the first place but they are the pot calling the kettle black!! At least she isnt the only one, and also I noticed them trying to get people who haven't actually done anything... insanity.

 

Anyway, once again a massive thank you for all the advice so far

[Jasper1965]

Retail Loss Prevention have been so active they've been awarded their very own section on this forum. I think you'll find a lot of help in there for your sister.

 

Retail Loss Prevention subforum

[mandyjayne]

Blimey Jasper...just peeked in on that thread:eek:

 

didnt realise that was on here...i heard that jackie lambert (think her name is) on the radio bigging up her so called compensation company, they are the real crooks in all this ! what a joke.

 

Good luck northern lass hope sis sorts it out

 

MJ:)

[DonkeyB]

The really annoying thing with this is that, while I cannot condone shoplifting, retailers build in to their costs and prices the likelihood of shoplifting. We all pay for it. It is regarded as something you cannot prevent 100%, therefore its cost is factored in. Any retailer not factoring it in is a liar or a poor business model.

 

So, the retailer budgets for the costs of shoplifting AND wants compensation?

 

This is a case of the boot on the other foot - while claims management companies go after the banks to remove credit card debts in a [problem] industry, we now have the retailers going after joe public through a third partythrough a third party like Retail Loss Prevention (which takes a fee/cut) in a [problem] industry.

 

If it were the public going after the retailers through a fee-taking agency, the retailers would be calling 'foul'. Hypocritical turdbrains.

[postggj]

please correct me if i am wrong as i do not know

 

if someone has been arrested for shoplifting, it goes to court, judge does a 100 quid fine

 

that the end of the matter

sentanced has been passed

 

surley the rlp has no claim as case has been closed by the court

[DonkeyB]

Think you're right. The ambulance chasers (RLP) tend to go after cases where no court action followed.

[postggj]

if the rlp want to claim costs, it goes to the judge before passing sentance

 

this smells of fraud

[DonkeyB]

As it's technically a civil case following a criminal case, I'm wondering if they may be able to try it on. But try it on is certainly what these [problematic] are doing. RLP acts as an agent for the shop; so the £250 claimed includes their 'costs' - wonder what portion the shop gets for no risk?

[postggj]

lets put it this way

 

double jeopardy

 

first a criminal court

second a civil

 

still a court though

[babybear39]

As mentioned on another thread I'm very worried about this as my daughter and I have tested products in store. some admittedly without testers

[ScarletPimpernel]

The CAB report is worth a read. One of the highlights is that it shows that in fact RLP don't take anyone to court, and that other firms who are also involved in this murky business lie about their legal 'successes'.

[cashins]

The CAB report is worth a read. One of the highlights is that it shows that in fact RLP don't take anyone to court, and that other firms who are also involved in this murky business lie about their legal 'successes'.

 

That it is.

 

What is disturbing is the fact that 'legal scams' appear to be a major growth industry and that the SRA is taking no action whatever, despite having a clear duty to do so.

 

David

[DonkeyB]

This is the first 'legal [problem]' I know of where a solicitor helps a 'big fish' go after the small man. Usually they mug Joe Bloggs with lies and deceit about their 'successes'.

 

I have an acquaintance who won't let me help me with their credit card debts because they think it's better to pay an up-front fee to a [EDIT] who is 'authorised by the Ministry of Justice - just have a look at our web site', they were told. Must be ok, then...

[Northern_Lass]

Many, many thanks people - my sister was all ready to pay to get the slimes off her back but now she has read through she is a converted CAGGER!!

 

She will igniore the letters *IF* any more come through but she had a final, final, final one 2months ago and nothing since. Fingers crossed.

 

VJohn82 - Should we need your expertise I'll get in touch - thank you for the offer

 

Once again, thanks for all your support and help.

[sillygirl1]

Reading this thread makes me wonder why we don't all shop online and then RLP would be stuffed.... seriously though their antics are rather worrying and maybe you could get your local MP involved in getting them told off from on high.

 

I hope your sister manages to get her problems resolved, don't forget we can help with most issues relating to debt now and offer constructive support.

 

Give your sister (and yourself) a virtual hug from me for finding out she does have rights.

[DonkeyB]

Another 'victim' empowered by CAG fights back ... great news.

[Huff&Puff]

From what I can make out it is in effect a [problem] run along the same lines as private parking tickets, which also have no basis in law. If you ignore them, they will send a few threatograms and then go away. Having said that, a lot more worrying is this database that thy claim to have set up. I sincerely hope that the Information Commissioner can do something about that.

[DonkeyB]

Good point. Wonder what their registration with the Data Protection Registrar says?

 

Parking ticket [problem]...? Aah... why did I suddenly think of Roxburghe?