Unknown 1st credit CCJ/CO welcome finance debt

[jdene]

bump

[jdene]

bump

[jdene]

bump

[brassed-off-2]

Jdene

 

MIG- ON A £6K LOAN !!!!

 

Mortgage indemnity fee....am looking into this with the FOS, at the moment...check over my thread..some info about it on there, When and IF i get any response ...will let you know...Post cant wait for this one!! think he has a little something up that sleeve of his.

[jdene]

Thanks brassed off

that was the comment i have been waiting for they are realy the lowest of the low but we are nearing the end of them now i think, just hope the letter above that i sent is ok

jdene

[postggj]

Holy Frac

 

Kiss This Agreement Goodby

 

Well Spotted The Mif

 

Also Same Con Again For Which Ime Going To Post A Letter I Did For Another Cagger

 

Just Ammend To Suit Yourself

 

Interest At 1.85 A Month Gives An Apr Of 22.2 %

Why Has Welcome Got The Apr As 30.8%

 

I Have Just The Letter For You To End This Once And For All

 

Check Back Tomorow Afternoon

 

This Is Now Finished

 

The Apr Is A Prescribed Term And The Tolerence Is Only 1 % Out

 

Game Over Welcome

[jdene]

Thank you postggj you are a gem

[postggj]

WELCOME FINANCIAL SERVICES LTD

COMPLIANCE

RUDDINGTON FIELDS BUSINESS PARK

RUDDINGTON

NOTTINGHAM

NG11 6NZ

 

DATE

 

ACCOUNT NUMBER XXXXXXX

 

 

Dear sir/madam

 

After having an audit done on my secured loan agreement with your company, some seriouse questions need to be answered.

 

mortage indemnity fee/insurance has been included in the agreement. As you are aware mortage indemnity fee is included on loan to value of 75 %. may i ask why i have been charged this fee.

 

I have a secured loan with your company, not a mortage, so again, why the fee. The definition of a secured loan is a loan up to twenty five thousend pounds. Anything over that becomes a mortage, or second mortage.

 

As this fee is an insurance policy for the lender, can you send by return who this premium is paid to and who underwrites this policy.

 

I now move on to the interest rate which as you are aware is a prescribed term on the enforceability of an agreement.

 

The agreement states a monthly interest rate of 1.85 % per month which gives an apr of 22.2 %

 

would you kindly explain why on my agreement the apr is stated at 30.8 %.

 

 

These are seriouse questions that needs answers so i have now put my account into official dispute until i receive a final response to my dispute.

 

I Await your response

 

 

send by recorded delievery to the address suplied

[Et Contra Pacem Regis]

Post, the APR is not a prescribed term. It is a required term - under Schedule 1 Paragraph 15 of the Agreements regulations. Only Schedule 6 terms are prescribed.

 

The difference is that if a required term is absent or wrong, then the agreement is enforceable at the discretion of the court, under section 127(3) while if a prescribed term is absent, or wrong, then the agreement (if made before 6th April 2007) cannot be enforced under section 127(3), and the Court can make a declaration to that effect.

 

I disagree that the APR should be 22.2%. It should be 34.9%. Welcome have stated it as 30.8% because (bizzarely) for APR calculations they have treated the fees as though they are spread over the term without interest charged making the regular payments £242.99, and taking everything else as credit. On those assumptions the APR would be 30.8.

 

It seems that Welcome's APR calculator is cleverer than whichever monkey with a typewriter drafted that agreement.

 

The best unenforceability arguement is still the Wilson arguement, which is that the Amount of credit is wrong, because contrary to section 9(4) of the Act, the two Charges for Credit (MIF and Acceptance Fee) have been included in it. AoC is prescribed by Schedule 6 Paragraph 2.

[postggj]

the varience on the apr stated is 1%

 

ref the wilson judgement

 

i take it thats wilson v fct

 

but what about this

 

BUT, please read the court of appeals judgement in Walker Vs SPPL which sheds more light on what is classed as Cost of Credit.

 

They held that the arrangement fee CAN be interest bearing.

[postggj]

IS MY AGREEMENT ENFORCEABLE( Via section 127(3) CCA1974)

PRESCRIBED TERMS FOR THE PURPOSES OF SECTIONS 61(1)(0) AND 127(3) OF THE

CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974 Taken from sced.6(1983/1553) regulations

(If you just want to find out, skip the bits in between the stars it’s just some extra information)

 

**What do we mean by unenforceable?

In the Consumer Credit Act section 127 there is a provision for making an agreement unenforceable if it does not contain certain pieces of information.

Subsections 1,2,3,4 state which pieces of information these are, and everything mentioned there must be included within the body of the agreement, if one is missing the agreement is unenforceable.

 

How does unenforceable differ from enforceable with a court order only?

When an agreement is unenforceable it means that the court or the judge cannot make a ruling on it. The court cannot make it enforceable.

When an agreement is enforceable only by ruling of the court it means that the agreement can be stopped by the debtor but the court has the power to re-instate it and allow the credit to continue to enforce.**

 

The Pescribed Terms are these

 

A Amount of credit

A term stating the amount of credit

 

B Repayments

A term stating how the debtor is to discharge his obligations under the agreement to make the repayments, which may be expressed by reference to a combination of any of the following-

(a) Number of repayments;

(b) Amount of repayments;

© Frequency and timing of repayments;

(d) Dates of repayments;

(e) The manner in which any of the above may be determined; or in any other way, and any power of the creditor to vary what is payable.

 

C Rate of interest

A term stating the rate of interest to be applied to the credit issued under the agreement

D Credit limit

This may be a term or the manner in which it will be determined or that there is no credit limit.

--------------------------

 

Which of these applies to you depends on the type of agreement you have?

 

For a Running Account (credit card) agreement

 

BC and D Apply

 

 

For a Restricted Use Debtor Creditor Supplier

• Where the dealer is the supplier and the creditor is the one providing the finance.
  
• The money can only be used for the purpose it is given.
  
• There is no interest on the purchase (the cash price is the same as the total price)
  
• And there is no advance payment
  

A is applicable

 

For a fixed Sum Credit Agreement

A conventional credit agreement with none of the above restrictions

 

A and B apply

 

For a Hire Agreement

 

B is Applicable

 

This paper only covers section 127(3) of the Act agreements can also be unenforceable by contravention of sections 1 and4 this will be the subject of the next paper.

Please note that these Prescribed terms where not changed in any way by the 2004/1482 Ammendments although the form in which they appear on the agreement was. Subsection127(3) was repealed on the 6th of April 2007 so that unenforceability due to 127(3) will only apply to agreemens executed before that date.

 

 

 

dawnytrish

 

not forgot about you

[dawnytrish]

Cheers Poste.

 

XX

[Et Contra Pacem Regis]

Walker v SPPL does not overturn Wilson. It does indeed say that a fee can be interest bearing, but that is irrelevant to the Wilson point.

 

It doesn't matter whether interest is charged on a fee or not for the Wilson point to work - all that matters is whether it is included in the Amount of Credit. On this agreement the nearest that is given to an "amount of credit" is the Total Loan Amount, which includes the fees.

 

Walker was about whether or not interest can be charged on fees (whether included in the Amount of Credit or not) - a distinct situation from the Wilson case.

[postggj]

i dont think this has been tried in court so i cant comment

 

i agree the wilson case sets an apex

 

the point of this is to get welcome to reply why they consider your argument is irelevent.

once they have done that , you hit them

 

a creditor is prohibited from hiding the true cost of credit

its then in black and white so welcome end up hanging themself.

 

i dont allways explain my post for obviouse reasons

in my case

 

smoke screen and mirrors

[jdene]

Thats Magic Postggj it will be in the post first thing Monday.

cheers jdene

[jdene]

hello Post you about

[everlast111]

Hello folks and sorry to hijack this thread but ive been reading through these forums for the last couple of days and wonder if anyone can offer me some advice.

 

I have a 20k secured loan from Welcome Finance of which i have gone into arrears. They have been calling me all month offering me a settlement deal of 20% off my outstanding amount.

 

They havent called me in the last 2 days which is not the norm.

 

Considering the news that Cattles have given up on Welcome Finance and are now winding it up over then next 3 years, should I phone them and offer to settle for a lower amount? or is there a chance that my loan will not be passed over to any 'toxic buyer' and be completely wiped out?

 

Cheers

[postggj]

Sorry I Missed You Again

 

Did The Fos Say When They Would Be In Touch As This Is Urgent

 

You Have 14 Days To Acknowledge So Plenty Of Time

 

I Take It Cowards Started This Claim

 

Can You Post Up The Poc

 

Pertic Of Claim

[postggj]

EVERLAST

 

CLICK ON THIS LINK

 

Welcome Finance - The Consumer Forums

 

SCROLL DOWN TO START NEW THREAD, CLICK AND YOUR AWAY

[jdene]

Hi post sorry I disappeared computer crashed, I will post up my agreement as well, as it is a car loan and they ticked the insurance boxes after I had signed and it was sent to me by fax to sign it so signed in my own homw with no one else there, but they have addmited to the FOS that the insurances were miss sold and that they will refund plus the 8% I have quite a bit of amunition but never been to court so need as much help as possible,

[jdene]

forgot to say as well it is Cowards who have started this, can I counterclaim for all payments made due to thier actions.

[postggj]

Step By Step Jdene

 

I Can See No Problems With This Claim

 

Coward Will Withdraw Then He Will Pay You Ref A Wasted Costs Order

[jdene]

Hi post good to see you here

[jdene]

just scaned my agreement will take off the personal and upload

[jdene]