Lloyds CCJ - not sure of what to do next!

[AndyOrch]

It's interesting to note that they say the default was issued on the 11th September, just days after we requested the CCA!

[Giddy Kipper]

How do I use photobucket to upload files here?

[AndyOrch]

Register with them (quick google) and then post the link here

[Giddy Kipper]

Has this worked?

 

[AndyOrch]

No they dont link, copy and paste it from PB to here.The link will be highlighted if successful

[Giddy Kipper]

This does:

 

Pictures by giddykipher - Photobucket :grin:

[AndyOrch]

Ok you need to remove that claim Number GK and remask your name you can see through it on some

[AndyOrch]

They obviously didnt respond to your Sec 78 request of Aug 2008 and is a bare face lie.They have defaulted you whilst in default of said request and then proceeded to instigate litigation whilst still in default vexatious behaviour:rolleyes:

Proceed to complete the AQ (post up for me to check) and send them a copy (dont sign it) copy to Court.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Giddy Kipper]

If you look at the dates, exactly 14 days after our letter, they have defaulted. Is this something the judge will look at?

 

I've removed the docs and will post up again later this evening when I put the little one to bed. Having read/seen all this, what do you think the judge will do?

[AndyOrch]

As Bankfodder states this is a complete defence,no need to dress it up and the DJ should act on the law.What you need to do now is complete the AQ and keep an eye on these cowboys as they have threatened to seek Summary Judgement,typical **** trick when they have a weak case.

Did you clarify if there are any unfair charges applied to the account?

 

Andy

[Giddy Kipper]

What does it mean when they've asked for a summary judgement? The total they are claiming has increased by £600 since the final cc statement from Lloyds...I assume this is court costs etc?

[AndyOrch]

What does it mean when they've asked for a summary judgement?A short cut when a defendent defends they rubbish your defence and request judgement, a sham ,but you will object and summise they wont get it on the details of your case.Its also a risk for the Claimant as if their request fails it will def go to trial The total they are claiming has increased by £600 since the final cc statement from Lloyds...I assume this is court costs etc?

prob

[Giddy Kipper]

IF this goes to trial and they are successful, are the costs added on to the judgement at the end? And would we have the option of spreading payments rather than having to pay a lump sum? (panicking again now!)

[AndyOrch]

IF this goes to trial and they are successful,I would be amazed if it did go that far are the costs added on to the judgement at the end? Yes in Fast Track And would we have the option of spreading payments rather than having to pay a lump sum?You can only pay what you can afford, if the judgement is fourthwith you pay in one bulk within the 28 days and no CCJ if you cant then you request a redetermination and submit an I&E and request mthly payments and get a CCJ to boot for 6 years (panicking again now!)

 

But stop panicking because you wont lose unless the DJ is Stevie Wonder and they have re wrote the CCA act 1974;)

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Giddy Kipper]

Just a couple of things then I promise to give you a rest until I've completed the AQ

 

Firstly, will Lloyds submit their paperwork with their AQ? Which leads me to the question of if they can provide the CCA will the judge accept it, even though they never sent it when requested last year?

 

Sorry, I'm new and naive to this whole procedure!

[AndyOrch]

Just a couple of things then I promise to give you a rest until I've completed the AQ

 

Firstly, will Lloyds submit their paperwork with their AQ? No unless they make application within thir AQ for Summary Judgement Which leads me to the question of if they can provide the CCA will the judge accept it,depends on the day and the DJ but if its unenforcable then should be no even though they never sent it when requested last year? Thats were you will bring to the attention that they were in default of your request at the time litigation was commenced

 

Sorry, I'm new and naive to this whole procedure!

 

You will make the draft directions with your AQ requesting disclosure of all docs relied upon.

 

Anything else? I and BF have asked (3 times now )is there any unfair charges involved with this account?????.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Giddy Kipper]

I don't know if there are any unfair charges involved, other than the cost has increased by £600 since the last statement was received....

[AndyOrch]

Ok well we are requesting them within your Directions,I thought you may have retained the originals,if there are unfair charges then this would also come into play the way you complete the AQ.

 

 

Andy

[Giddy Kipper]

Hi Andy

 

I'm just completing a photocopy of the AQ for you to cast your eye over. With regards to posting the documentation to the other party, I was going to wait and send them on the 19th (my deadline) after I dropped off the AQ with the court. Would you suggest this is a bad idea? Also, I assume the draft directions need to be typed up/printed out and attached at the back of the AQ?

 

Many thanks

[ScabHunter]

Hi Giddy Kipper,

 

I have looked over your AQ, and most of it seems good to go.

 

The only things I would personally change are -

 

Witnesses to which facts - All

 

(This is because the section relates to the trial, and not what is happening now. You are your only witness so you need to be witness to all facts.)

 

In Other Information, the last sentence "Therefore it stands to reason that this document must be disclosed before this case can progress any further.", needs to be changed to "Therefore it stands to reason that this documentATION must be disclosed before this case can progress any further." This is because the essential documentation consists of more than one document.

 

I'm not crazy about those directions, because they don't ask for everything you need, for example proof of postage for the DN. They don't request that the originals be brought to the hearing, and they also create an unnecessary self-imposed deadline for the amended defence. I would use these -

 

DRAFT ORDER FOR DIRECTIONS

 

1 The Claimant shall not later than 4:00pm on (date) (being a date 2 weeks from the date of the making of the case management directions) file and serve a verified true copy of each of the following documents mentioned in the Particulars of Claim

 

(a) Copies of the Credit Agreement, and any documents referred to within it, which complies with the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and all subsequent regulations, which the claimant seeks to rely upon, together with any terms and conditions that applied to it. The original document must be brought to the hearing.

 

(b) Default Notice compliant with s87 (1) Consumer Credit Act 1974 and Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1561) as amended, together with proof of service. The original document must be brought to the hearing.

 

© A full and complete statement of account, including all payments made and charges applied, covering the period beginning with the day of the making of the agreement and ending on the date of the commencement of this case, needed to establish a balance on the alleged account.

 

2 If the Claimant fails to comply with this order, the claim will be struck out without further order.

 

3 The defendant thereafter shall file and serve and amended defence sufficiently particularised in response to the documents supplied by the claimant.

 

Please note this is only my personal opinion, and I am not legally qualified.

 

SH

[Giddy Kipper]

Thanks SH

 

Do I leave 'DRAFT ORDER FOR DIRECTIONS' on the paperwork I send to the court?

 

Also, do I send a copy of my AQ as well as the draft order to the claimant?

[Giddy Kipper]

Also, being stupid, do you mean the date should be 2 weeks from the date the AQ is submitted ie: 2 weeks from tomorrow?

[ScabHunter]

Do I leave 'DRAFT ORDER FOR DIRECTIONS' on the paperwork I send to the court?

 

I would. You could centre it so it is a clear heading.

 

By the way, I've just spotted a typo in my own directions. Point 3 should of course say "an amended" and not "and amended". Time to edit my library.

 

Also, do I send a copy of my AQ as well as the draft order to the claimant?

 

Ah, now there's a question! Let's just say that opinions differ strongly here. I know two members of the Site Team who have completely opposing views.

 

It is often done out of courtesy, and as long as you are not flagging anything useful to the enemy there really is no reason not to. Don't waste money on Special Delivery, though, only use that for the copy you send to the court. Also, make the claimant's copy before you sign anything, for obvious reasons.

 

Also, being stupid, do you mean the date should be 2 weeks from the date the AQ is submitted ie: 2 weeks from tomorrow?

 

The only stupid people are the ones who don't ask when they are unsure of something. Yes, I would use a date two calendar weeks from tomorrow.

 

SH

[Giddy Kipper]

I was going to use recorded delivery just so I have a record of it actually being sent to them, otherwise they could ask for an extension beyond the 14 days couldn't they?

 

In a previous thread Andy, said that they don't keep copies of DN's on file, does this mean they cant/wont be able to produce an original, therefore, not enabling them to proceed any further? Or does all this rest on the judge agreeing with me?

 

You have been really helpful this evening, thank you so much

[ScabHunter]

I was going to use recorded delivery just so I have a record of it actually being sent to them, otherwise they could ask for an extension beyond the 14 days couldn't they?

 

It is the judge who will decide whether to order disclosure of the documents, so sending a copy of the AQ to the claimant really isn't necessary at all. It is only ever done as a courtesy.

 

Sadly, judges do tend to be incredibly lenient in allowing institutional claimants more time. All you can do is make sure you get your part right.

 

In a previous thread Andy, said that they don't keep copies of DN's on file, does this mean they cant/wont be able to produce an original, therefore, not enabling them to proceed any further? Or does all this rest on the judge agreeing with me?

 

The judge lottery is impossible to predict. All you can do is make sure your knowledge of the relevant law is better than theirs, and better than that of the institutional claimant. Then, you can argue your case as forcefully as possible.

 

You have been really helpful this evening, thank you so much

 

Only too happy to help.

 

SH