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    • It's better to keep advice on the open forum for everyone's benefit. Maybe you could post up the correspondence in a single pdf document and cover up your personal details, reference numbers and so on? HB
    • Hi on the notice of disqualification it lists the 2 speed offences and marks offence withdrawn? This is for both offences and then the other 2 is the MS90s which I’m fined for and the additional costs. R
    • Hi,    It has taken a while, but I have received an email from Auxillis -  hello, we are not dealing with this claim all we do is log accident for you isnurance - the claim has been passed to your underwriter markerstudy 0344 873 8183 as they are deal with fault cliams ion behalf of adrian flux. thankyou auxillis   I have made repeated attempts to phone Markerstudy in between working from home, struggling for energy and trying to find a cheap car so that I can keep my job (community support worker). Thankfully I have a supportive team and I am being given phone calls to make but it cant last too long. I had a severe migraine over the weekend and also have quite bad whiplash in my neck and back.    I found this in my insurance policy booklet -    Protection and Recovery If the insured vehicle cannot be driven following an incident leading to a valid claim under this section, we will pay: • the cost of its protection and removal to the nearest approved repairer, competent repairer or nearest place of safety; and • the cost of re-delivery after repairs to your home address; and • the cost of storage of the insured vehicle incurred with our written consent. If the insured vehicle is damaged beyond economical repair we will arrange for it to be stored safely at premises of our choosing. You should remove your personal belongings from the insured vehicle before it is collected from you. In the event of a claim being made under the policy we have the right to remove the insured vehicle to an alternative repairer, place of safety or make our own arrangments for re-delivery at any time in order to keep the cost of the claim to a minimum     I do about 20-25000 miles a year with the work I do, I have been getting quotes and putting that I have now have one accident and no no claims bonus and the cheap quotes from similar companies to markerstudy are more than double what i paid last year at 8-900 and aviva is offering 2600 which is simply out of my price range and more than the car i am looking at.  I am starting to wonder if it is even worth going ahead with the claim as i have no one to claim from. I have had no information from any of the enquiries I have made.  I have a full tank of vpower diesel in the car in the impound, i can strip it for parts and probably make what I will be offered by the insurance payout and get the money quicker.  As I have made contact and started the process can I back out, still keep my NCB and a claim free history? Also what happens with my injuries? I don't think there is any permanent damage but my dr refused to see me and just gave me a boat load of naproxen and codeine. What happens in the future if things don't get better and I cancelled this claim? Can you claim injuries off your own insurance because the other guy ran and you cant find him? I have tried to ask these questions off markerstudy but they keep me waiting for nearly an hour then end the call.    Thank you for your time and help.  It is really appreciated.  I am quite honestly on the floor, I have been really ill, in hospital, had nearly 6 months off work and only been back full time a few weeks and now this.  The fact the company you pay large sums of money to look after you in a time of need is also behaving criminally just makes you want to give up.    
    • Thanks for the response. Am I able to send you the documents I’ve received or can you message via instant message and I’ll send these? Reece
    • Regretfully it does. Have you actually seen any papers which show what you were charged with (rather than what you were convicted of)? It is unusual not to be “dual charged” but if you were not charged with both, you are where you are. If you had been charged with both offences and providing you were the driver at the time, you could, after performing your SD, have asked the prosecutor to drop the “Fail to Provide” (FtP) charges in exchange for a guilty plea to the speeding charges (you cannot be convicted of speeding unless you plead guilty as they have no evidence you were driving). You will have difficulty defending the FtP charges. In fact, it’s worse than that – you have no chance of successfully defending them at all because the reason you did not respond to the requests is because you did not receive them and that’s entirely your fault. No it’s not correct. Six months from 18/11/23 was 18/5/24 so, unless they were originally charged, the speeding offences are now “timed out.” There is one avenue left open to you. If you perform your SD you must serve it on the court which convicted you. You will then receive a date for a hearing to have the matters heard again. Your only chance of having the matters revert to speeding (and this is only providing you were the driver at the time of those offences) is to plead Not Guilty, attend court. When you get there you can ask the prosecutor (very nicely, explaining what a pillock you know you were for failing to update your  V5C) if (s)he is prepared to raise “out of time” speeding charges, to which you will offer to plead guilty if the FtP charges are dropped.   This is strictly speaking not lawful. Charges have to be raised within six months. Some prosecutors are willing to do it, others are not. But frankly it’s the only avenue open to you. There is a risk with this. I imagine you have been fined £660 (plus surcharge and costs) for each offence. The offence attracts a fine of 1.5 week’s net income and where the court has no information about the defendant’s means a default figure of £440pw is used.  If the prosecutor is not prepared to play ball you can revise your pleas to guilty. A sympathetic court should give you the full discount (one third) for your guilty pleas in these circumstances but they may reduce the discount somewhat. The prosecution may also ask for increased costs (£90 or thereabouts is the figure for a guilty plea). So it may cost you more if you have a decent income (I’ll let you do the sums). But MS90 is an endorsement code which gives insurers a fit of the vapours. One such endorsement will see your premiums double. Two of them will see many insurers refuse to quote you at all meaning you will have to approach "specialist" (aka extortionate) brokers. So you really want to exhaust every possibility of avoiding MS90s if you can. One warning: do not pay solicitors silly money to defend you. Making an SD before a solicitor should attract just a nominal sum (perhaps a tenner). That’s all you should pay for. You have no viable defence against the FtP charges and any solicitor suggesting you have is telling you porkies. The offer to do the deal is easily done by yourself and you can save the solicitor’s fees to put towards a few taxis and increased insurance premiums if you are unsuccessful. In the happy event you find out you were "dual charged", let me know and I'll tell you how to proceed. (Seems a bit odd hoping you were charged with four driving offences rather than two, but it's a funny old world!).    
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Letter from a debt collector on behalf of Excel, owner of vehicle mentally disabled


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Hello

 

i have followed your advice about ignoring letters from Excel but now we have received a letter from a debt collecting company saying that in the "absence of payment or any valid dispute" they will "pursue the matter".

 

The letters are all addressed to my father who is the owner of the vehicle but is not allowed to drive because he is classed as mentally disabled after a motorbike accident. Several people are therefore on his insurance policy to drive him around. Can we argue that he does not know/remember who was driving the vehicle and as a mentally disabled person he cannot be liable?

 

Many thanks

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Yes you can argue this but I would like to see you continue to ignore.

 

I'm not too sure that a mental disability absolves liability though.

 

Raises some interesting thoughts on "Owner Liability" for LA issued PCNs though which I know this is not.

********************************************

Nothing in this post constitutes "advice" which I may not, in any event, be qualified to provide.

The only interpretation permitted on this post (or any others I may have made) is that this is what I would personally consider doing in the circumstances discussed. Each and every reader of this post or any other I may have made must take responsibility for forming their own view and making their own decision.

I receive an unwieldy number of private messages. I am happy to respond to messages posted on open forum but am unable to respond to private messages, seeking advice, when the substance of that message should properly be on the open forum.

Many thanks for your assistance and understanding on this.

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argue what? You are not in anyway legally obliged to tell me or any other random 3rd party (including Excel) who is driving. IT is their responsibility to prove who is driving ... and they have no legal powers to carry out investigations or force people to tell them under oath!!!!

 

Let them chase your father all the way. If they take it to court (which they wont) the case would be dismissed as soon as you can prove your Dad was not the driver.

 

Remember, debt collectors have absolutely no powers. They are just agressive individuals who are paid comission and so bend the truth to make you think you must pay!!!!

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Wow, thanks for the really quick replies guys!! :-)

 

i remember reading somewhere amongst all the other threads that the owner of the vehicle cannot be held liable on private carparks and that when Excel write in their letters "you are liable as owner of the vehicle" that this is a lie, but i can't find that post anymore, could you possibly give me some tips on where to find the exact legal regulations on this?

 

Also, i read something in the letter templates thread about behaving reasonably. The debt collector's are saying "If we do not hear from you within 7 days we will pass the matter to our solicitors, who will review your case for potential legal action". It therefore seems a bit unreasonable not to reply... Would it not be reasonable to reply saying that my father was not the driver, is mentally incapacitated, cannot drive and does not know who was driving?

 

Thanks again!

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DO NOT respond in anyway otherwise they'll never leave you alone.

 

Please accept the advice already given here that they have no legal right whatsoever to demand from you or anyone else payment. They certainly have no legal entitlment to demand the details of the person who may have been driving on the date in question

 

& even if the owner IS mentally ill that's none of their business Also if you did you could be in breach of the law by divulging such highly confidential info without the subjects consent which it would appear they can't give as they don't have capacity

 

& last but not least it's not a good idea to let strangers know that there is a vunerable person at that address as who knows what might happen ................ the drive tarmac:rolleyes: .............. the roof repaired:rolleyes: all costing thousands of pounds........... need I go on:cool:

Edited by JonCris
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argue what? You are not in anyway legally obliged to tell me or any other random 3rd party (including Excel) who is driving. IT is their responsibility to prove who is driving ... and they have no legal powers to carry out investigations or force people to tell them under oath!!!!

 

Let them chase your father all the way. If they take it to court (which they wont) the case would be dismissed as soon as you can prove your Dad was not the driver.

 

Remember, debt collectors have absolutely no powers. They are just agressive individuals who are paid comission and so bend the truth to make you think you must pay!!!!

 

Whilst I agree whith most of your comments I would point out that the original poster doesn't have to 'prove' anything, if anything it's for Excel to 'prove' who was driving NOT the otherway round & even then they'd have to prove a valid contract existed between them & the driver

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okey dokey, will follow your advice, especially about revealing his condition, thanks for that!

If we get a solicitor's letter i suppose we'll have to reply though, so i'll just say he is the owner but cannot drive the vehicle as he has no licence and he doesn't know who was driving.

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Oh my gawd ............NO you won't have to reply to anyones letter, even a solicitor. Anyone can get a 'solicitors' letter sent for a few quid. In your case it would be meaningless as they would have no more status than Excel which amounts to now't as they still have to establish who was driving & if a contract was entered into but if you do then come back here I we'll tell you if or how you should respond

 

Perhaps because your new here you don't realize but some here on this site who give free advice are lawyers

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oh ok, didn't realise that. Was thinking about getting our solicitor to reply in the case of a letter from theirs but then i thought our solicitor would probably charge us the same for a letter as the original £40 fine. Ok, will come back to you if we get a solicitor's letter from them.

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In summary:

• it is a mail [problem]

• there is no 'fine', only a charge which is completely unenforceable

• the keeper was not the driver and has nothing to do with the charge

• Excel's paperwork is unlawful. Claiming the keeper is liable is actually fraud under the 2006 Fraud Act

ignore everything and if hell froze over and it went to court, your defence would be more solid than diamond. But it won't go to court anyway - the letters will just dry up and they'll move onto another victim.

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Whilst I agree whith most of your comments I would point out that the original poster doesn't have to 'prove' anything, if anything it's for Excel to 'prove' who was driving NOT the otherway round & even then they'd have to prove a valid contract existed between them & the driver

 

I said that! Though if it went to court you would have to reply to the defence stating why it was incorrect and then show evidence to prove why they were not the driver...

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Great thanks!

Haven't understood the difference between keeper and owner but will follow your advice and do nothing.

i really don't want my dad to have to go through the ordeal of a court appearance though....

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in your case, the difference between the keeper and owner is irrelivant. They have got your Dads details from the DVLA and are writing to him hoping he'll just believe the rubbish and think that he is responsible for all the drivers (like the police/council tickets) and pay up.

 

It will never get to court... but if it did, you can tell the courts that your father is unable to attend due to his disability... the judge would probably throw it out before it even got to that stage!!!

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For all intents and purposes, they are the same. It's just that the owner may not necessarily be the keeper.

 

This is a mail [problem] though - court is economically unviable for them. I doubt your father would have to get involved if he isn't fit anyway.

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okey dokey, will follow your advice, especially about revealing his condition, thanks for that!

If we get a solicitor's letter i suppose we'll have to reply though, so i'll just say he is the owner but cannot drive the vehicle as he has no licence and he doesn't know who was driving.

If you'd care to look you'll see several people got a letter from Roxburghe's linked to Excel this last week. And yes, i speak from experience. Some for a carpark where Excel were exposed, again on here.

 

If i sent you an official looking letter demanding money, would you pay me?? Of course not.

Now do yourself and your family a big favour and file the nonsense away and ignore.

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agreed

 

ignore totally

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I said that! Though if it went to court you would have to reply to the defence stating why it was incorrect and then show evidence to prove why they were not the driver...

 

 

No you don't THEY have to PROVE you were, prove being the operative word. Just because your the registered keeper doesn't mean your liable & even then as Excel have already found out to their cost their 'contract' both with the driver AND the land owner would have to be enforceable

Edited by JonCris
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Well I aint going to argue, but it would be a pretty poor reply to the defence if you didn't submit a reason why them saying the disabled father wasn't the driver.... the judge isn't psychic, he's going to want to see the reason why you state he wasn't!! There is no point in holding back that sort of evidence!

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I said that! Though if it went to court you would have to reply to the defence stating why it was incorrect and then show evidence to prove why they were not the driver...

In a civil claim the onus of proof is on the claimant. Both parties are assumed to be telling the truth. It is sufficient to deny their claim.

 

They can't just show up in court and say the registered keeper was the driver. The first thing a judge will ask them is How do you know? And as one PPC (of porcine persuasion) found out "We just do" will not suffice.

 

Only if they have some form of evidence they can present e.g. CCTV footage and a clear identification of a driver from a third party (otherwise the face in the picture is just a face) and/or a letter naming the driver will a claimant be entitled to conclude the RK and the driver are one and the same.

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This does not constitute legal advice and is not represented as a substitute for legal advice from an appropriately qualified person or firm.

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Yes but to claim the keeper doesn't remember may also be stretching credibility to an extreme & statements if proven false, may land the keeper in more trouble namely perjury. In addition as pin & I say it's upto them to prove who the driver was. Failure to do so would be enough to have the case thrown out at the outset

Edited by JonCris
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IMO the 'not the driver defence' is weak if the keeper was the driver (otherwise it's sound). The judge could perfectly reasonably decide that on the balance of probabilities the keeper was the driver if there is no evidence otherwise.

Post by me are intended as a discussion of the issues involved, as these are of general interest to me and others on the forum. Although it is hoped such discussion will be of use to readers, before exposing yourself to risk of loss you should not rely on any principles discussed without confirming the situation with a qualified person.

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