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    • Few tweaks as the run order was completely messed up and the main point of your defence (reconstituted agreement) pushed to the bottom of the statement.   I, XXXXXX, being the Defendant in this case will state as follows; I make this Witness Statement in support of my defence in this claim and further to my set aside application dated 1 November 2022. 1.The claimants witness statement confirms that it mostly relies on hearsay evidence as confirmed by the drafts in person in the opening paragraph. It is my understanding they must serve notice to any hearsay evidence pursuant to CPR 33.2(1)(B) (notice of intention to rely on hearsay evidence) and Section 2 (1) (A) of the Civil Evidence Act. 2.  I understand that the claimant is an Assignee, a buyer of defunct or bad debts, which are bought on mass portfolios at a much reduced cost to the amount claimed and which the original creditors have already wrote off as a capital loss and claimed against taxable income as confirmed in the claimants witness statement exhibit by way of the Deed of Assignment. 3. As an assignee or creditor as defined in section 189 of the CCA this applies to this new requirement on assignment of rights.  This means that when an assignee purchases debts (or otherwise acquires rights under a credit agreement) it also acquires certain obligations to the borrower including the duty to comply with CCA requirements (such as the rules on statements and notices and other post-contractual information).  The assignee becomes the creditor under the agreement. This ensures that essential consumer protections under the CCA cannot be circumvented by assigning the debt to a third party. 4.  I became aware of original Judgement following a routine credit check on or around 14th September 2020. 5. The alleged letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 was served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018, no effort was made to ascertain my correct address.  I have attached a copy of my tenancy agreement which is marked ‘Appendix 1’ and shows I was residing at a difference address as of 11 December 2018 and was therefore not at the service address at the time the proceedings were served.  I have also attached an email from my solicitors to the Claimants solicitors dated 14 July 2022 which was sent to them requesting that they disclose the trace of evidence they utilised prior to issuing the proceedings against me.  This is marked ‘Appendix 2’. The claimants solicitors did not provide me with these documents. 6. Under The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims 2017 a Debt Buyer must undertake all reasonable enquiries to ensure the correct address of a debtor, this can be as simple as a credit file search. The Claimant failed to carry out such basic checks. Subsequently all letters prior to and including ,The Pre action Protocol letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 and the claim form dated 14th February 2020 were all served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018. 7. Upon the discovery of the Judgement debt, I made immediate contact with the Court and the Claimant Solicitors, putting them on notice that I was making investigations in relation to the Judgement debt as it was not familiar to me.  I asked them to provide me with a copy of the original loan agreement but this was not provided to me.   The correspondence to the Claimant Solicitor's is attached and marked ‘Appendix 3’ 8. On (insert date) I successfully made application to set a side the judgment. The claim proceeded to allocation, 9. The claimant failed to comply with the additional directions ordered by District Judge Davis on the 2 February 2024 'The Claim shall be automatically struck out at 4pm on 3 April 2024 unless the Claimant delivers to the Court and to the Defendant the following documents.' None of these documents were received by the court nor the defendant by that date. (insert date you did receive the documents) I then sent a Data Subject Access Request to Barclays but no agreement was provided. Details the timeline of communication between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 4’and the copies of correspondence between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 5’. Remove irrelevant 10.The claimant relies upon and has exhibited a reconstituted version of the alleged agreement. It is again denied that I have ever entered into an agreement with Barclaycard on or around 2000.  It is admitted that I did hold other credit agreements with other creditors and as such should this be a debt that was assigned to Barclaycard from another brand therefore the reconstituted agreement disclosed is invalid being pre April 2007 and not legally enforceable pursuant to HHJ Judge Waksman in Carey v HSBC 2009 EWHC3417.  Details of this are attached and marked ‘Appendix 6’. The original credit agreement must be provided along with any reconstituted version on a modified credit agreement and must contain the names and address of debtor and creditor, agreement number and cancelation clause. 11. Therefore the claimant is put to strict proof to disclose a true executed legible agreement on which its claim relies upon and not mislead the court. 12. It is denied I have ever received a default Notice pursuant to sec 87(1) CCA1974.The claimant is put to strict proof to evidence from the original creditors internal document software the trigger of said notice.  13.   As per CPR 1.4(2)(a) the court encourages parties to cooperate with each other in the conduct of proceedings in order to try and save time and costs for the parties and to also save the time and resources of the court however, despite vast attempts at mediation the claimants have been most unreasonable and have remained unwilling to mediate. 14. Until such time the claimant can comply and disclose a true executed copy of the original assigned agreement they refer to within the particulars of this claim they are not entitled while the default continues, to enforce the agreement pursuant to section 78.6 (a) of the Credit Consumer Act 1974. I believe that the facts stated in this Witness Statement are true.  I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. Signed                 ………………………………………………….. Name                  XXXX Date                     30 April 2024   Run 3 copies Court /Claimants Sol/File
    • As one of you mentioned above I've been in a mess for nearly 20 years now and I'm ready to sort my credit report out now - the main reason I got into second round of debt is my kids being unwell and the state considering them not unwell enough for extra help so despite my son being in hospital for 3 months in one year we got extra zero help and I eventually lost my job and got into debt to just so I can be تا my sons hospital bed at his time of need - my life basically fell apart and all these debts got me again 
    • Gosh mate I've woke up this morning with half the worry I had last night when going to sleep!.  I can't believe how much this forum has helped me over the years and I don't  have the words to explain the gratitude I feel towards you guys -  Now that I've slept on it I feel ready to reject this company and my plan is to make them an offer to accept payments to date as full and final settlement - I will I think write them a letter once my review is completed or maybe just send it now whilst they are reviewing explaining my kids are unwell for which reason I'm struggling to survive and if I can politely request for them to accept payment to date as a full and final - I'll mention I don't have any cash or anyone to borrow from to offer a full or even part amount of the remaining balance of the iva and therfore am unable to make a offer of payment.   If they agree to at least even put my offer to the creditors then I feel it's better I hang in there and that way I won't have to deal with any possibilities of more defaults and ccjs    Right now the only adverse effects on my credit report are the iva that is now 3 years old and 2 Ccj one coming of this July and one thus October.    But I am worried new action will begin and new defaults and Ccj may start to appear because I've paying into an agreement im under the impression the 6 year rules starts again so yes I have lost of mixed feelings about this but I'm not going to lie you guys have put some life back into my breath this week as for the last 3 years I've felt caged like an animal and this morning I feel freer I can't explain how much but certainly my soul feel lighter today thanks to yin because I'm now viewing this review totally different to I do yesterday thanks to you guys 
    • Court name UNKNOWN Case number ********** Amount N/A Confirmed by Insolvency Service Date issued May 2021 Type Voluntary Arrangement Notes If you have questions about voluntary arrangements you should speak to the Insolvency Service.     I started this in 2021. So it's been about 3 years I've been paying. 
    • Thanks @lookinforinfo@Nicky Boyi sent across the agreement earlier in this thread. No mention of financial reward to the MA. But, I wouldn't be surprised if it was done on the sly. As I said earlier, the owner of OPS is a convicted criminal, with a very shady reputation around these parts.
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RLP Claim Debenhams **Case closed**


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Hi All,

 

Just wondered if the planet size brains here could help pass an opinion

 

A couple of weeks ago my wife was caught shoplifting in Debenham's. She has Bi-Polar and is also an alcoholic (Called a dual disorder in medical circles, medicates with alcohol to stop her being manic). She was in the grip of a manic episode, one symptom of this is making impulsive and reckless decisions and was quite drunk.

 

She never left the shop and she was arrested taken to the police station then released on police bail and due to her mental issues the CPS have decided to take No further action, which is good but now I have to deal with RLP.

 

We have a letter from my wifes GP saying that she has these conditions and that it was more than likely her behaviour was due to both conditions. What I am not sure of is how to phrase the letter to RLP as while its very big mittigation they dont seem to be fond of mitigating circumstances.

 

They are after £380 of which £130 is for the goods (Never left the shop and were undamaged according to the PC who arrested my wife)

£150 for there time, £45 for Administration and £55 for Security and surveillance.

 

Should I offer them anything? What are your thoughts?

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Didnt RLP claim that they did not persue individuals with mental health problems? I think it was on the Tesco thread but the document appears to have been deleted. Maybe someone else can confirm, but if this is the case then point out to them they are going against their own company practices.

 

Yorky.

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It might be quicker to contact Debenhams Head Office to ask why they are trying to pursue someone with mental health issues,as stated above.They should have established this fact at the time,but then it may have been difficult if she was drunk.

 

Edit-obviously it would help everyone else if you also took the official line,though I suspect Debs may bounce you backto RLP,who may in turn ignore you.

Edited by shanty
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Will they speak to us as they seem to devolve that issue to RLP? I am happy to give them a call but just wonder if they are set up to deal with that?

 

But Hey I will give them a bell tomorrow cant hurt

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Write & tell them you won't be paying anything - Also point out that as everyone including the Police & the CPS have decide on no further action because of your wife's illness your at a loss to understand why they continue to pursue her - Furthermore isn't the pursuit of such a person with mental health problems contrary to their own guidelines as well as those set out in their contracts with their own clients

 

Remember it's absolutely essential that you refer to your Wifes illness & try to produce evidence such as a doctors note confirming her condition

 

That should get them off your backs & if not there are plenty here who'll help

Edited by JonCris
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Yes agreed.

The fact that the CPS have closed the file is one good line of defence,but equally the moral obligations and duties top it off.

Its interesting how much more this has deviated from the usual £137.50.

Perhaps an attempt to penalise you for the lack of money they have been able to recover from Caggers.

Its a shocking story-but there seems no end to them.

Advice as always-ignore RLPs demands-and a strongly worded letter to Debs.

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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Hi all, Just a quick update phoned Debenhams Head Office who didn't have a contact name for anyone involved in working with RLP. The Best they could do was put me through to the store, I spoke to someone in the security office who while was helpful was unable to do anything. Strikes me as quite weird that no-one seems to know who owns the relationship with RLP.

 

I'll be trying the store manager next.

 

Also to be fair to RLP they had no knowledge that my wife has mental health issues. Hopefully once they get the letter and the GP's letter they will do the right and sensible thing.

Edited by intheding
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The Site Team also feel that no crime was actually committed here, regardless of YW's illness and condition at the time.

 

You say YW, "....was caught shop-lifting..." "She never left the shop....."

 

Unless she LEFT the shop intending NOT to pay for goods, no crime was committed.

 

As Martin has said, ignore RLP and deal with Debenhams only.

 

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I have just spoken to my wife. The issue is she has no recollection of the event She can remember getting on the bus into town and that's it. Its all blurry in her mind up to the point where she was asked to come with a plain clothed security guard (He had a Man U top on and my son is a Man U fan So she remembers that).

 

So I cant be sure if she was still in the shop I think its going to be hard to find out the truth.

 

The Debenhams security people said they have handed it off to RLP and there is nothing they can do. Should I write to the manager of the branch explaining?

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You should focus on keeping things in writing-this gives you evidence in any replies.

I think you will find that responses in writing will be much more guarded and contrived than anything you will get by phone.

For Debs send it recorded and keep a copy,asking for a response within 14 days.

Passing the buck is a favourite by phone-and you have no recourse unless the calls are recorded.

keep us posted on anything further.

You can expect the legendary letter 2 from RLP after 21 days to say any discounts are now withdrawn bla bla bla.

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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Also DO NOT let Debenhams off the hook - RLP are their agents & they are responsible for RLP's actions at ALL times - also if Debenhams ARE already aware of your wifes condition then it should be they telling RLP to back off not you

 

I will prepare you a letter to send to Debenhams reminding them of their liability in this matter & that any civil action by you will be directed at them with RLP 2nd In other words should you choose you will sue both of them for the stress & upset they have caused to not only you but also your unwell wife

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The Site Team also feel that no crime was actually committed here, regardless of YW's illness and condition at the time.

 

You say YW, "....was caught shop-lifting..." "She never left the shop....."

 

Unless she LEFT the shop intending NOT to pay for goods, no crime was committed.

 

As Martin has said, ignore RLP and deal with Debenhams only.

 

:)

 

It's not true that you have to leave the shop,although it's widely believed.There are several circumstances where it is not neccesary.In this case it may have been felt the OPs wife might have caused a scene if stopped outside,or injured someone,so they decided to stop her in a more contained area. Saying that,I wouldn't recommend the layperson to stop anyone inside the shop.

 

The Manager probably wont be familiar with the fact that RLP claim not to pursue people who have mental illnesses,even though it's obviously wrong in anyones eyes.He could be asked is the aware this is the case.

Edited by shanty
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It's not just widely believed it's a fact in law - Until the person leaves the store without paying there is no mens rea proven - perhaps again it's this lack of understanding of the law which is bringing the security industry into disrepute

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Police have upheld several cases where the defendant has passed the last point of payment, when they have concealed the goods,I know of these personally-the person has been found guilty.

I have also known of cases where (where for example there was a gang of accomplies waiting outside,where the descision to stop them inside has been upheld) many other cases too.

 

My personal experience-not just from lawbooks.

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Theres been lots of discussion on this in the past.

I remember specifically something about concealment-its a sketchy area.

Concealing something say-under your coat is not classed as shoplifting until the person goes through the checkout without attempting to pay for it.

But what if a security guard stopped a person on seeing the concealment ?

Since it cannot be proven that the person intended to avoid payment since they were not given opportunity to pay at the checkout ?

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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Theres other scenarios that raise questions-in some cases.

 

I heard about one guy who went in ASDA for a couple of items.On seeing that there were big queues at the checkouts-he went through them and headed for the cigarette kiosk to try to pay there-he was stopped by security before he reached there and frogmarched into the office.

Both Tesco and Asda will happily serve customers with one or two items from the main aisles at the cigarette kiosk when they are not busy.

Morrisons however,will NOT do this and send you back to the main checkouts.

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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Thanks guys for all the support and advice. I suppose I am a little hesitant to go totally bananas at them in the first instance as while she was of diminished responsibility she still did put them out while she was having her manic episode.

 

Saying that though I do believe in corporate responsibility and continuing to pursue us via the courts isn't going to help my wife's recovery.

 

Saying that she is due to go into rehab next month is that something else to mention? Will it help speed things up?

 

I suppose RLP prey on the fact people just want these things to go away and for the most part quite ashamed

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RLP prey on the fact that people are ignorant to their rights,and that many simply pay up without question,faced with their threats.

As has been said,any written evidence that you can summon will benefit your communications with Debenhams.

In regard to you needing this to counter any Court action from RLP-then thats extremely remote.

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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They let me at the one in Birmingham

 

Maybe the decisions vary from store to store-but mine wouldnt even serve me with a packet of tomatoes.

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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Maybe the cashier was allergic to Spanish class 2 tomatoes ?

Talking about boycotts Ken Morrison was a director of the RLF and a sponsor of Bradford Bulls Rugby club-When a planning application went in for St.Helens Rugby Clubs new stadium Ken objected and tried to thwart plans because part of the deal involves a Tesco store.

.Furious at this-many people in the town Boycotted Morrisons two stores here-and there was a climbdown.

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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