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    • Speaking of the reformatory boys, here they are with all of their supporters, some of whom traveled with them from miles away, all carefully crammed together and photographed to look like there were more than about 80 .. rather like Farages last rally with even fewer people crammed around what looked like an ice cream van or mobile tea bar ... Although a number in the crowd apparently thought they were at a vintage car rally as they appeared to be chanting 'crank-her'. A vintage Bentley must be out of view.   Is this all there is? Its less than the Tory candidate. - shut up and smile while they get a camera angle that looks better
    • in order for us to help you we require the following information:- Which Court have you received the claim from ? Canterbury If possible please scan redact and upload a full page copy of page 1 of the claim form. ( Name of the Claimant ? Moneybarn No 1   How many defendant's  joint or self ? One Date of issue – top right hand corner of the claim form – this in order to establish the time line you need to adhere to. 29/05/24 Acknowledged by 14/06/24  Defence by 29/06/24  Particulars of Claim PARTICULARS OF CLAIM   1.  By a Conditional Sale Agreement in writing made on 25th August 2022. Between the Claimant and Defendant, the Claimant let to the Defendant on Conditional Sale. A Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi (200 P S) 4x4 Wildtrack  Double Cab Pickup 3200cc (Sep.2015) Registration No, ******* Chassis number ***************** (“The Vehicle”).  A copy of the agreement is attached   2.  The price of the goods was £15,995.00.  The Initial Rental was £8500.00.  The total charge for credit was £3575.;17 And the balance of £11,070.17 was payable by 59 equal consecutive monthly instalments of £187 63. payable on the 25th of each month.   3.  The following were expressed conditions of the set agreement,   Clause 8: Our Right to End this Agreement  8.1   Subject to sending you the notice as required by law, any of the following events will entitle us to end this Agreement: 8.1.2  You fail to pay the advance payment (if any) or any of the payments as specified on the front page of this agreement or any other sum payable under this Agreement. 8.1.3 If any of the information you have given us before entering into this Agreement or during the term of this Agreement was false 8.1.4 We consider, acting reasonably, that the goods may be in jeopardy or that our rights in the goods may otherwise be prejudiced. 8.1.5 If you die 8.1.6 If a bankruptcy petition is presented against you; if you petition for your own bankruptcy, or make a live arrangement with your creditors or call a meeting of them. 8. 1.7 If in Scotland, you become insolvent or sequestration or a receiver, judicial factor or trustee to be appointed over any of your estate, or effects or suffer an arrestment, charge attachment or other diligence to be issued or levied on any of your estate or effects or suffer any exercise, or threatened exercise of landlords hype hypothec 8.1.8 If you are a partnership, you are dissolved 8.1.9 If the goods are destroyed, lost, stolen and/or treated by the insurer as a total loss in response to an insurance claim. 8.1.10 If we reasonably believe any payment made to us in respect of this Agreement is a proceed of crime. 8.1.11 If steps are taken by us to terminate any other agreement which you have entered into with us.   Clause 9.  Effect of Us Terminating Agreement   9.1 If this Agreement terminates under clause 8 the following will apply 9.1.1 Subject to the rights given to you by law, you will no longer be entitled to possession of the goods and must return them to us to an address as we may reasonably specify, (removing or commencing the removal of any cherished plates) together with a V5 registration certificate, both sets of keys and a service record book. If you are unable or unwilling to return the goods to us then we shall collect the goods and we'll charge you in accordance with clause 10.3 9.1.2 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you for all payments and all other sums do under this agreement at the date of termination 9.1.3 We will sell the goods or public sale at the earliest opportunity once the goods are in a reasonable condition which includes a return of the items listed in clause 7.1.4 9.1.4 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you of the rest of the Total Amount Payable under this agreement less: ( a) A rebate for early settlement ias required by law which will be calculated and notified to you at the time of payment (b) The proceeds of sale of the goods (if any) after deduction of all costs associated with finding you and/or the goods, recovery, refurbishment and repair. Insurance, storage, sale, agents fees, cherished plate removal, replacement keys, costs associated with obtaining service history for the goods and in relation to obtaining a duplicate V5 registration certificate   4, The following are particulars required by Civil Procedure Rules. Rule 7.9 as set out in 7.1 and 7.2 of the associated Practice Direction entitled Hire Purchase Claims:-   a)     The agreement is dated 25 August 2022. And is between Moneybarn No1 Limited  and xxxxxxxxx under agreement number 756050. b)    The claimant was one of the original parties to the agreement. c)    The agreement is regulated under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. d)    The goods claimed Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi ( 200 PS) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200 cc (Sep2015} Registration No ^^^^^^^ Chassis number ***************** e)     Thw total price of the goods £19570 f)     The paid up sum £1206 5 g)    The unpaid balance of the total price £7505 (to include charges) h)    A default notice was sent to the defendant on 20th February 2024 by Firrst class post i)      The date when the right to demand delivery of the goods accrued 14 March 2024 j)      The amount if any claimed as an alternative to delivery of the goods 7505 22 include charges ]= 5.  A the date of service of the notice the instalments were £562.89 in arrears. 6. By reason of the Termination of the Agreement by the notice, defendant became liable to pay the sum of £7502 7. The date of maturity the agreement is 24th August 2027. 8. Further or  alternative by reasons of  the Defendant breaches of the agreement by failing to pay the said instalments, the Defendant evinced an intention no longer to be bound by the Agreement and repudiated it by the said Notice the claimant accepted that repudiation 9. By reason of such repudiation the claimant has suffered loss and damage.   Total amount payable £19570 Less sum paid or in arrears by the date of repudiation £12064 97 Balance £7505 (to include charges.) ( The claimant will give credit if necessary for the value of the vehicle if recovered.)  The claimant therefore claims 1.    An order for delivery up of the vehicle 2.    The MoneyClaim to be adjourned generally with liberty to restore,  Upon restoration of the MoneyClaim following return or loss of the vehicle. the Claimant will ensure the pre action protocol for debt claims is followed. 3.    Pursuant to s 90 (1)  of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. An order that the Claimant and/or its agents may enter any premises in which the vehicle is situated in order to recover the vehicle should it not be returned by the Defendant 4.    further or alternatively damages 5.    costs.   Statement of truth The Claimant believes that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true. The Claimant understands that the proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes or causes to be made a false statement in the document for verified by statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. I am duly Authorised by the Claimant to sign these Particulars of Claim signed Dated 17th of April 2024   What is the total value of the claim? 7502   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? No   Never heard of this   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? n/a Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? No   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After  Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? In a garage  Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes  Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Original Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? n/a   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? They said sent but nor received   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? None seen   Why did you cease payments? Still Paying,   What was the date of your last payment? Yesterday  31st May 2024   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? Yes on 12 Feb 2024   What you need to do now.   Can't scan, will do via another means as you cant have jpg
    • Now that is an interesting article which adds afew perspective that I hadn't thought significant - but on reflection of the perspectives offered ... Now Starmer is no Blair, however 'blairite he may be perceived, but the Tories aren't tories and aren't even remotely liberal   The fast 'unannounced and unexpected election call from sunack may well be explained by the opinion linked that he hoped reform would be unprepared and effectively call a chunk of Farages largely empty bluster - making him look even more of a prat, leave scope for attacks on shabby reform candidates and mimimise core vote losses to reform - while throwing the 'middle ground' (relative) tories TO THE DOGS - and with the added bonus of likely pacifying his missu' desire to jogg off to sunny cal tout suite somewhat   thumb in the air - I expect about 140ish tory seats, but can hope for under a hundred Reform - got to admit the outside possibility of 1, maybe 2 seats with about 8% of the vote - but unlikely. I think projections of over 10% of the vote for reform is nudged and paid for speculation - but possible with the expected massive drives from Russian, Chinese and far right social media bot and troll prods targeting the gullible.
    • Commentary June 2024 WWW.ELECTORALCALCULUS.CO.UK Interesting article about just how bad it could be for the Tories.  Also Tories could be hoping on Reform not having candidates in many seats, as they were not ready.  
    • Even a Piers Morgan is an improvement and a gutless Farage Piers Morgan calls for second Brexit referendum WWW.THELONDONECONOMIC.COM Piers Morgan and Nigel Farage have faced off over Brexit and a second referendum in a heated reunion on BBC Question Time.   “Why don’t we have another referendum about Brexit?” he questioned. “I seem to remember when 2016 came around we were told there was going to be control of our borders and it was going to be economically beneficial to this country. And eight years later we have lost complete control of our borders… and economically it seems to have been a wilful act of self-harm.”   ... Piers missed off : after all somebody said a 48/52 decision would be "unfinished business" by a long way - was that person just bul lying (again)  
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Reasonable Expenses for my DMP


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I am in the process of dealing with all my creditors, and slowly getting there.

 

I am not sure what I can put down as reasonable expenses for Food, Clothing, Socialising and Smoking.

 

Are there any guidelines?

 

FX

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this should help you:

 

National Debtline England & Wales | Personal Budget Sheet

 

 

ida x

Please contact a member of the site team if you are offered help off the forum for a a paid or no win no fee service.

 

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I understand that I do have to provide creditors with this information; it may be unreasonable for them to ask for documentary proof of every last detail. As I understand it, the Court would not ask for full proof of every last penny, and therefore my creditors cannot either. Am I mistaken in this belief????? :???:

 

Thanks for the link, Ida, but is there any actualy guidelines as to what is reasonable spending?

 

Given my way, I would regard a couple of hundred quid a week down the pub as reasonable, but clearly my creditors could dispute this... easily!

 

I just want to end up in a situation that I can live with and will resolve my problems, without having to live like a monk for two years.

 

Cheers

 

FX

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For my DMP, I needed to stick within the BBA guidelines.

For housekeeping it is usually £180-£200 for a single person, clothing £20, socialising £20, and I am unsure about smoking, but you are allowed contingency x

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There is an excellent sticky by Sequenci on this subject - link here

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/getting-out-debt/120603-how-get-out-debt.html

I suggest you read the whole thing but in the meantime the bit relevent to your question is:

STEP TWO: YOUR OUTGOINGS

 

When it comes to outgoings it is vitally important to ensure you consider all the essentials that you will need to pay each month. These include the obvious payments such as housing costs, housekeeping and utility bills. You should also factor in the less obvious outgoings such as TV licence, health costs and emergencies. The key to an accurate budget is to ensure that your figures give a fair snapshot of how things really are, one thing to bear in mind is that a month is NOT 4 weeks, if you pay for items on a weekly basis you will need to multiply that figure by 52 and divide it by 12 to get the correct monthly figure.

 

One of the key stalling blocks for many is the figure for Housekeeping. This is the figure which includes food, toiletries, cleaning materials, newspapers etc. It should also include a small figure for entertainment. Your creditors will have general guideline figures that they will expect you to adhere to, if you have any reason as to why your figure might be higher than normal you will need to quantify it, perhaps you have a special dietary requirement for example. To get you started a typical housekeeping figure for a single person is £140/month, for a couple it is £230/month, for each dependant you’re looking at an additional £85/month. Please bear in mind these are very rough guideline figures and you may actually spend a bit more or possibly less. I really wish to stress that creditors will refuse a budget if you have a ridiculously excessive housekeeping figure. If you’re savvy you can shop around to find bargains, don’t be afraid to visit Aldi or Lidl and also your local food market.

 

When calculating your travelling expenses please remember to factor in monthly amounts for items such as road tax, maintenance, MOT, insurance, Roadside assistance as well as petrol. If you have purchased your vehicle via a lease, HP or Bill of Sale arrangement you MUST record this figure in your essential outgoings too, the reason being is that the creditor may be able to use repossession if you fall behind on payments.

 

It is perfectly fine to have a Sky or Virgin Media package so long as you are only paying a reasonable price, invariably this means that you may need to consider cancelling the premium channels such as movies and sports. If you’ve been with your supplier for over a year you might be able to renegotiate a cheaper package and keep these channels for a much cheaper price. You may also be able to do this with telephone and broadband packages.

 

You might have an entitlement to free prescriptions, dental treatment and glasses. Contact the health costs advice line on 0800 917 7711. If you cannot claim free prescriptions you might be able to reduce the cost by buying a prepayment certificate.

 

It is important to also factor in amounts for clothing, birthdays, Christmas, emergencies and other miscellaneous expenses, remember you might need to quantify your figures.

 

Bank of Scotland account 1 - £2,666 WON

Bank of Scotland account 2 - £2,500 on hold

GE Capital charges -£30 won (hey, every little helps!)

Barclays Partner Finance £425 charges - £225 offer accepted.

 

Finally debt free after 4.5 years, thanks to my Debt Management Plan through Payplan. There is no better feeling :D

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I did one with CCCS a few years ago.The figures I came up with allowed me fifty quid to pay creditors. But when I gave these to CCCS on the phone , they whittled them down even more, that I was just down to paying token payment of 1 pound each to 5 creditors. They told me to put down more in the emergency fund, more for clothing and to have something left to spend how I wanted to. You have to have a life as well, I was told. Was quite happy with that.

And that is all I am paying.

If in doubt just massage the figures.:)

At the end of the day it's your business not the creditors and you do not have to supply this information only a court can demand it.

Edited by mustang67
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  • 3 years later...

TBH, it all depends on what the debts are. And whether they are still adding interest and charges. The I&E sheet is for your own personal use, not to be sent to unqualified debt collectors.

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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TBH, it all depends on what the debts are. And whether they are still adding interest and charges. The I&E sheet is for your own personal use, not to be sent to unqualified debt collectors.

 

Could you elaborate please? When you say 'what the debts are', do you mean how large they are or what type of debt, e.g. credit card, overdraft, loans, finance agreesents etc...?

 

Mustang67 said that in his case, he was able to pay £1 per creditor. Realistically, would a creditor who is owed £5000 really accept anything less than £10 / month? Assume that the debtor is genuinely being honest and realistic about expenses (with none of them near the thresholds accepted according to insolvency.gov.uk). Income is just abysmal plus some unfortunate expenses like medical (non private healthcare insurance).

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Yes sorry, Loans credit cards, overdrafts?

 

And even if a debt is 5k and all you can afford is £1 a month, then that is all they will get.

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Yes however they might choose the reject my offer? Basically I've tried to be honest with mine, however I've seen stories of the OR (whoever that is) rejecting anything >£450 housekeeping expenses for a married couple with 3 children.

 

How can any creditor realistically put me on a debt management plan where I repay a £6000 debt with just £1 per month? I can actually afford £7 per month for my largest creditor according to my I&E which amounts to needing 71 years to clear a £6000 credit card! I don't see any company accepting that proposal?! :(

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Your all looking at this with a pessimistic view.

 

It matters not one jot what you owe, as long as it is unsecured debts, and they are NOT priorities, ie, rent mortgage, council tax, utility bills (less clean water) then it is YOU who tells THEM what YOU will pay, you DO NOT need to send them any I&E form/sheet, especially if this is a debt collection agency, granted it may be beneficial to your case IF your agreement/account is still with the Original Creditor (OC), but if it has been farmed out or flogged off to a third party debt collector, who have no legal powers, then they have absolutely NO legal rights to ask for, let alone view such private confidential information.

 

It is YOU who is in control, whether they accept your offer of payment or not, it doesn't matter, if all you can afford to pay is £1 a month then that is all you need pay, no judge in the land would force you to pay more than you can afford.

 

Stop believing that they somehow have all the rights and powers, they don't. They cannot refuse your offers of payment, hence why you keep everything in writing, and if they do refuse then they can commit it in writing, then you pay what you offered regardless, then if they are so foolish as to put this before a Judge they will be laughed out of the court and told to shut up.

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Thanks for the encouraging and dare I say, empowering message :) I feel better.

 

I best explain, at the moment I'm still only dealing with creditors, no DCAs. No defaults and no minimum payments. However up till now I've been needing to borrow from family to meet about 1/4 of my minimum payments and/or letting them use joint credit cards in my name in exchange for money for the minimum payments.

 

However since they've had to re-mortgage and have run into their own problems, this is no longer tenable and if anything, I need to contribute more to ensure that we keep a roof over our heads.

 

To get things started:

 

 

  • I've setup a parachute a/c rather than using my usually maxed out OD to make payments. It was REALLY refreshing to see a positive balance for the first time in years (i.e. since creditors first kindly offered me an overdraft at 16).
  • I am currently waiting for CCCS to 'make it' to one of my phone appointments to discuss options. I'm hoping that they will be able to negotiate freezing interest and using realistic figures for repayment.
  • I've opened a credit rebuilding a/c with a modest limit to be used for purchases with the balance cleared each month to help recover from the default entry on my file if/when I get onto a DMP.

 

Until then, I'm working 16 hours/week (+part time education). I'm also selling various things round the house which were collecting dust to continue to meet the current minimum amounts until CCCS can get me on a DMP.

 

I know I should try to negotiate myself, however with 3 hours of physio and other rehab daily, studying, work and lastly (should be higher in my priorities I know!) family and other household obligations, I just don't want to deal with direct negotiation. Besides which, I'm hoping that the creditors will take me more seriously if CCCS act as a proxy.

 

Wow, it was quite cathartic getting all that into writing :)

 

If anyone has any other suggestions, please let me know. Perhaps I should have done the CCA, SAR requests and claiming back charges steps first. However at the moment I think that monthly interest probably outweighs any charges (even with compound interest on them over the years). Therefore moving to get interest frozen with realistic monthly payments towards debt and to stop using credit to pay for essential costs like food, utilities etc ASAP seems like the higher priority.

 

Lastly, all debts are on my Experian file so I don't think I have any grounds for claiming that the debt is not enforceable. As mentioned, I'm not dealing with any DCAs, just original creditors aside from Barclaycard who took over my Egg Credit Card a/c.

Edited by fresh-start
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http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?590-Creditors-and-DCAs-Letter-Templates-Budget-Planner

 

Have a look through the above link, I was trying to find the 'Hardship' letter, however there are plenty of letters in their which you can start the ball rolling to advise your creditors that you cannot maintain the current repayments, and ask for their help. They 'should' either freeze interest and stop charges altogether, or ignore you all together and you will need to take a more aggressive approach.

 

Communication with your creditors is the key, keep everything in writing, get everything committed in writing for your own evidence, never discuss financial matters over the phone, unless you can record your calls.

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Thanks for your continued help and advice. If CCCS/StepChange don't make it to the next phone appointment, I think I will have to get things started on my own and send the letters. I'm still a bit confused about a few things.

 

If I do send the relevant letter from the link (Letter B) with a signed I&E sheet (either from My Moneysteps, CCCS or National debtline) showing that I only have a small amount of money left for each creditor's monthly bill I assume that I will be shown as being in default from the 1st day I miss the usual large payment.

 

Is the following link right:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?347162-DMP-questions&p=3805212&viewfull=1#post3805212

 

i.e. that even if I am still on a DMP/making reduced payments 6 years from now, the entry will be automatically removed from my CR file?

 

Thanks

Edited by fresh-start
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