Arrow Global / MBNA Credit Card

[blueboy987]

I have an outstanding MBNA credit card which has been passed to Arrow Global, not sure if it is just for collection or if it has been sold on. I haven't heard anything from them since October 2007 (so no pending action) but they have defaulted me and I'd like to get it removed.

 

The last correspondence from MBNA was in August 2007, chasing the debt. First correspondence from Arrow Global was in September 2007 saying the debt had been assigned to them and included a default notice (which appears totally invalid, it doesn't have my name or address and there isn't a date of issue just a before date).

 

Interestingly, Arrow Global said the debt was assigned to them in August 2006 (which I'm guessing is a typo) but there was no assignment notice or confirmation from MBNA and the dates on the default don't tie up with the dates on my credit report. The default on my credit report is in Arrow Global's name but is dated from before the account was assigned to them.

 

I'm guessing I need to establish who exactly owns the debt and then get a copy of the default notice from them. So what should I do first? Send a SAR to Arrow Global and / or MBNA? Or a CCA request? Or something else?

 

My sole aim is to get the default notice off my credit report.

[Docman]

It is almost certain that Arrow Global have bought the debt from MBNA. Arrow do seem to take ages to take any recovery action after the debt has bee 'assigned'. In my case, it was nearly 20 months.

 

If you want to clear your credit report, I suggest you start with the CRAs and claim that Arrow do not have any authority from you to disclose any personal information to a CRA.

[mandyjayne]

Hi Blueboy

 

arrow global are based in the usa and they will have bought the debt....they bought my MBNA debt and they got a ccj and charging order against me...they were using mortimer clarke solicitors in this country.. so make sure you defend should you happen to get court papers!

 

I started the fight against them in Nov last year and im happy to say i beat them in March this year..ccj removed along with the charging order for nearly £7,000.

 

I SAR and CCA the solicitors...was sent a load of rubbish no default notice, no notice of assignment, credit card application form, (not a consumer credit agreement).

 

Not sure in your case who would be best to send them to?? if in doubt send to arrow as they now own it let them prove it!

 

My thread is in Legal issues section (i dont know how to add the link to it:mad:!! sorry)

 

Hope this helps

 

MJ

Edited April 28, 2009 by mandyjayne
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[blueboy987]

I'm going to start by sending SAR requests to both Arrow Global and MBNA, then seeing what comes back. Most likely it will be nothing or a pile of rubbish but its a start.

[blueboy987]

Game on....I received a reply from MBNA and (surprise, surprise) they require me to provide proof of identification before they will comply with the Subject Access Request which apparently means a copy of my driving license or passport.

 

Can anyone point me in the direction of a thread to help me with my reply?

[blueboy987]

Arrow Global and MBNA have both failed to comply with the SAR request and their time is now up. Can anyone help me with what I need to do next?

 

Is it a complaint to the Information Commissioner?

 

Do I need to send further letters to Arrow Global and MBNA?

[supasnooper]

Yes report them to ICO, you can do it online -

 

Complaints - Privacy & electronic communication - ICO and click on the Data Protection link

 

Also, send this letter to MBNA -

 

Your Name

 

Your Address

Your Town

Your County

Your Postcode

Date 2009

The Company Secretary

The Creditor

Creditors address

Creditors Town

Creditors county

Creditors postcode

LETTER BEFORE ACTION

Section 7(1) – Data Protection Act 1998

Account: XXXXXXXXXXXX

 

 

Dear Sir / Madam,

 

 

You have failed to comply with my Data Protection Act Subject Access Request dated xxth xxxxxxxxxx 2009.

 

I will remind you as to what documents I expect.

The following is by no means an exhaustive list but in the main this is what I require.

 

Please supply me with a complete list of transactions and charges relating to ALL accounting history with your organisation. Alternatively, a complete set of statements for that period will be acceptable.

 

Additionally, all records you hold on me relevant to this account, including but not limited to:

 

1. A transcript of all transactions, including charges, fees, interest, repayments and payments and both the original amount of the loan and any repayments made to the account.

 

2. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company

 

3. Where there has been any event in my accounts history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account. If you are unable to supply this data because there has been no such manual intervention, then please be so kind as to confirm this in your response

 

4. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notices that you may have sent to me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

 

5. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted.

 

6. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

7. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

 

8. A genuine copy of any deed of assignment, or proof that you have a legal right to this money.

 

9. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

 

10. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

 

11. A copy of all account statements for the duration of the agreement.

 

12. Please would you also advise me of the logic involved in any automated decisions taken by you about me pursuant to section 7(1) (d) of the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

13. A True copy of the consumer credit agreement section 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act of 1974 for the account.

14. Any Other information relating to this account.

 

If you do not comply within the next 14 days I shall seek a Court order obliging you to do so together with damages at the discretion of the Court and without any further notice.

 

 

Yours Faithfully,

Print your name here

Do NOT sign, Send by recorded delivery

[blueboy987]

Many thanks, I've now sent the LBA to both Arrow Global and MBNA as well as making complaints to the Information Commissioner. This is the first reminder I've sent them, so I'll make sure I send a few more before actually going down the court route.

 

I'm assuming that once they fail to comply with the LBA letter, I can continue to send them reminders and then start court action at any point in the future (without further warning)?

 

As my aim is to get the default removed, is there any point in writing to the CRA's at this point? I was thinking of requesting they remove the default notice as the lender has failed to provide any supporting evidence (by failing to comply with the SAR).

[blueboy987]

MBNA have caught me off guard by complying with the SAR request. I've attached copies of what I presume they are saying is the credit agreement and would appreciate advice as to whether it is valid or not.

 

Provided the second page is part of the same document then it looks like they have included all the terms that they need to, but I'm not sure it qualifies as an agreement - it looks more like an application. It doesn't state who the agreement is between and there is no space for a signature on behalf of MBNA, surely both are basic requirements of an agreement? There is also numerous uses of the word "application".

 

The other interesting thing is the date I put when I signed it. Either I got the year wrong by 1 (it was in January and I'm always doing that) or its from a previous application that was turned down. Either way, the date of my signature is a year (and a few weeks) earlier than when the account was opened. Would this help to invalidate it?

 

The only information pre-filled on the form was my name address in section 1 - I had filled everything else in (it was my hand writing). I'm guessing that this was probably one of those pre-approved applications they used to send out.

MBNA SAR.pdf

[goonerhenry]

what about the default notice have you not got a copy of this? also if it has been passed arrow why are MBNA dealing with you, surely its not their problem now? the letter arrow sent to you was this a default notice as when i rec'd one they tried to combine the default notice with the notice of assignment, also you may want to check that the account number used by arrow on any paperwork relates to the original MBNA account number, as this was another cock i found in my paperwork

[trooper68]

MBNA have caught me off guard by complying with the SAR request. I've attached copies of what I presume they are saying is the credit agreement and would appreciate advice as to whether it is valid or not.

 

Provided the second page is part of the same document then it looks like they have included all the terms that they need to, but I'm not sure it qualifies as an agreement - it looks more like an application. It doesn't state who the agreement is between and there is no space for a signature on behalf of MBNA, surely both are basic requirements of an agreement? There is also numerous uses of the word "application".

 

The other interesting thing is the date I put when I signed it. Either I got the year wrong by 1 (it was in January and I'm always doing that) or its from a previous application that was turned down. Either way, the date of my signature is a year (and a few weeks) earlier than when the account was opened. Would this help to invalidate it?

 

The only information pre-filled on the form was my name address in section 1 - I had filled everything else in (it was my hand writing). I'm guessing that this was probably one of those pre-approved applications they used to send out.

 

Hi BlueBoy

 

Just had a look at the pdf, is that a photocopy, did they send it like that? how many pages? Cos to me it looks like its put together, just my view, anyone else?

You could always request to view it...

Trooper68

[blueboy987]

Hi BlueBoy

 

Just had a look at the pdf, is that a photocopy, did they send it like that? how many pages? Cos to me it looks like its put together, just my view, anyone else?

You could always request to view it...

Trooper68

 

They sent a copy which I scanned for the pdf. It was sent as two separate sheets, so I don't know if they have the original or if the conditions are on the reverse of it. I couldn't see anything to suggest they'd faked it, it was definitely my hand writing and signature on it.

[blueboy987]

what about the default notice have you not got a copy of this? also if it has been passed arrow why are MBNA dealing with you, surely its not their problem now? the letter arrow sent to you was this a default notice as when i rec'd one they tried to combine the default notice with the notice of assignment, also you may want to check that the account number used by arrow on any paperwork relates to the original MBNA account number, as this was another cock i found in my paperwork

 

When I started on this I was missing a lot of the paperwork, some of which I've now found. This includes two default notices, one from MBNA and another from Arrow Global (which was combined with the assignment notice) - both of which appear faulty to me. I'll post them up later to see what people think.

 

Whilst the account is with Arrow Global now, I wanted to see what information MBNA had on the account. To see if there was anything interesting and so that I can compare it with what Arrow Global come up with.

[trooper68]

They sent a copy which I scanned for the pdf. It was sent as two separate sheets, so I don't know if they have the original or if the conditions are on the reverse of it. I couldn't see anything to suggest they'd faked it, it was definitely my hand writing and signature on it.

 

 

Regardless of the signature, I thought it must be a athentic copy, not a photocopy, it could be tampered with.... you could doubt it athenticity.

 

look here, about 6 paras down.Personal information access rights | Business Link

 

"You must provide the information requested in a permanent format - such as a computer printout, letter or form - unless the individual agrees otherwise, it is not possible to supply such a copy or you can show that it will involve 'disproportionate effort'. If this is the case you must still provide access to the information in another way."

 

so a photocopy could deem a grey area, so to speak.

 

Ask to look at the original....you have that right.

 

Hope this is helpful.

 

Trooper68

[blueboy987]

Just received a response from Arrow Global to my SAR, interesting reading - the covering letter rather than the info supplied;

 

- they refused to supply the CCA, saying this must be requested under the Consumer Credit Act and a £1 fee paid.

- they refused to supply the following; assignment / default / termination / enforcement notices, details of collection charges and fees. They stated they are not processing such data and that anyway, they don't have to supply that data as part of a SAR.

- they refused to supply a fair processing notice, stating they'd already sent one and that they are not obliged to send duplicates.

- as regards who they disclose my personal data to, they stated it was only to parties to assist in the recovery of the debt and to ensure the accuracy of my personal data. Importantly there is no mention of credit reference agencies (and no way they could be included in the agencies they do refer to), despite the fact they are disclosing data to them.

 

Best of all, they managed to send me two letters addressed to someone else concerning a debt.

 

So have they complied with the SAR or not?

Should they have supplied the CCA and fair processing notice?

What about them stating they do not disclose information to credit reference agencies?

What should I do about the other letters?

 

I want to get all the information I can from them and if I can make life difficult for them in the process (whilst staying legal and within the rules), all the better.

[trooper68]

Just received a response from Arrow Global to my SAR, interesting reading - the covering letter rather than the info supplied;

 

- they refused to supply the CCA, saying this must be requested under the Consumer Credit Act and a £1 fee paid.

- they refused to supply the following; assignment / default / termination / enforcement notices, details of collection charges and fees. They stated they are not processing such data and that anyway, they don't have to supply that data as part of a SAR.

- they refused to supply a fair processing notice, stating they'd already sent one and that they are not obliged to send duplicates.

- as regards who they disclose my personal data to, they stated it was only to parties to assist in the recovery of the debt and to ensure the accuracy of my personal data. Importantly there is no mention of credit reference agencies (and no way they could be included in the agencies they do refer to), despite the fact they are disclosing data to them.

 

Best of all, they managed to send me two letters addressed to someone else concerning a debt.

 

So have they complied with the SAR or not?

Should they have supplied the CCA and fair processing notice?

What about them stating they do not disclose information to credit reference agencies?

What should I do about the other letters?

 

I want to get all the information I can from them and if I can make life difficult for them in the process (whilst staying legal and within the rules), all the better.

 

Have they complied? they have to supply all data relating to you, so i would say no.

Did you SAR the OC? you could compare the two, they may slip up.

I had another look at the Credit agreement, I thought it had to be contained on 1 page, anyone?

 

I still think they have breached the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

Anyone?

 

Trooper68