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    • If anybody has any advice here, it would be greatly appreciated, I already suffer with pre-existing disabilities & have struggled with this so far. 
    • so return of goods order etc etc read upload  scan pages to jpg, redact in mspaint. the convert to and merge to one mass PDF  read upload and use the online listed sites for all 3 stages. do you want to keep the car? i will guess this was a manual paper claimform direct from the co.court or was it org sent from salford bulk processing and has just got reaq ssigned?      
    • Speaking of the reformatory boys, here they are with all of their supporters, some of whom traveled with them from miles away, all carefully crammed together and photographed to look like there were more than about 80 .. rather like Farages last rally with even fewer people crammed around what looked like an ice cream van or mobile tea bar ... Although a number in the crowd apparently thought they were at a vintage car rally as they appeared to be chanting 'crank-her'. A vintage Bentley must be out of view.   Is this all there is? Its less than the Tory candidate. - shut up and smile while they get a camera angle that looks better
    • in order for us to help you we require the following information:- Which Court have you received the claim from ? Canterbury Name of the Claimant ? Moneybarn No 1   How many defendant's  joint or self ? One Date of issue –  29/05/24 Acknowledged by 14/06/24  Defence by 29/06/24  Particulars of Claim PARTICULARS OF CLAIM 1.  By a Conditional Sale Agreement in writing made on 25th August 2022. Between the Claimant and Defendant, the Claimant let to the Defendant on Conditional Sale. A Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi (200 P S) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200cc (Sep.2015) Registration No, ******* Chassis number ***************** (“The Vehicle”).  A copy of the agreement is attached  2.  The price of the goods was £15,995.00. The Initial Rental was £8500.00.  The total charge for credit was £3575.;17 And the balance of £11,070.17 was payable by 59 equal consecutive monthly instalments of £187 63. payable on the 25th of each month. 3.  The following were expressed conditions of the set agreement, Clause 8: Our Right to End this Agreement  8.1   Subject to sending you the notice as required by law, any of the following events will entitle us to end this Agreement: 8.1.2  You fail to pay the advance payment (if any) or any of the payments as specified on the front page of this agreement or any other sum payable under this Agreement. 8.1.3 If any of the information you have given us before entering into this Agreement or during the term of this Agreement was false 8.1.4 We consider, acting reasonably, that the goods may be in jeopardy or that our rights in the goods may otherwise be prejudiced. 8.1.5 If you die 8.1.6 If a bankruptcy petition is presented against you; if you petition for your own bankruptcy, or make a live arrangement with your creditors or call a meeting of them. 8. 1.7 If in Scotland, you become insolvent or sequestration or a receiver, judicial factor or trustee to be appointed over any of your estate, or effects or suffer an arrestment, charge attachment or other diligence to be issued or levied on any of your estate or effects or suffer any exercise, or threatened exercise of landlords hype hypothec 8.1.8 If you are a partnership, you are dissolved 8.1.9 If the goods are destroyed, lost, stolen and/or treated by the insurer as a total loss in response to an insurance claim. 8.1.10 If we reasonably believe any payment made to us in respect of this Agreement is a proceed of crime. 8.1.11 If steps are taken by us to terminate any other agreement which you have entered into with us. Clause 9.  Effect of Us Terminating Agreement 9.1 If this Agreement terminates under clause 8 the following will apply 9.1.1 Subject to the rights given to you by law, you will no longer be entitled to possession of the goods and must return them to us to an address as we may reasonably specify, (removing or commencing the removal of any cherished plates) together with a V5 registration certificate, both sets of keys and a service record book. If you are unable or unwilling to return the goods to us then we shall collect the goods and we'll charge you in accordance with clause 10.3 9.1.2 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you for all payments and all other sums do under this agreement at the date of termination 9.1.3 We will sell the goods or public sale at the earliest opportunity once the goods are in a reasonable condition which includes a return of the items listed in clause 7.1.4 9.1.4 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you of the rest of the Total Amount Payable under this agreement less: ( a) A rebate for early settlement ias required by law which will be calculated and notified to you at the time of payment (b) The proceeds of sale of the goods (if any) after deduction of all costs associated with finding you and/or the goods, recovery, refurbishment and repair. Insurance, storage, sale, agents fees, cherished plate removal, replacement keys, costs associated with obtaining service history for the goods and in relation to obtaining a duplicate V5 registration certificate 4, The following are particulars required by Civil Procedure Rules. Rule 7.9 as set out in 7.1 and 7.2 of the associated Practice Direction entitled Hire Purchase Claims:- a)     The agreement is dated 25 August 2022. And is between Moneybarn No1 Limited  and xxxxxxxxx under agreement  number xxxxxx. b)    The claimant was one of the original parties to the agreement. c)    The agreement is regulated under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. d)    The goods claimed Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi ( 200 PS) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200 cc (Sep2015} Registration No ^^^^^^^ Chassis number ***************** e)     The total price of the goods £19570 f)     The paid up sum £1206 5 g)    The unpaid balance of the total price £7505 (to include charges) h)    A default notice was sent to the defendant on 20th February 2024 by First class post i)      The date when the right to demand delivery of the goods accrued 14 March 2024 j)      The amount if any claimed as an alternative to delivery of the goods 7505 22 include charges 5.  At the date of service of the notice the instalments were £562.89 in arrears. 6. By reason of the Termination of the Agreement by the notice, defendant became liable to pay the sum of £7502 7. The date of maturity the agreement is 24th August 2027. 8. Further or alternative by reasons of  the Defendant breaches of the agreement by failing to pay the said instalments, the Defendant evinced an intention no longer to be bound by the Agreement and repudiated it by the said Notice the claimant accepted that repudiation 9. By reason of such repudiation the claimant has suffered loss and damage. Total amount payable £19570 Less sum paid or in arrears by the date of repudiation £12064 97 Balance £7505 (to include charges.) ( The claimant will give credit if necessary for the value of the vehicle if recovered.)  The claimant therefore claims 1.    An order for delivery up of the vehicle 2.    The MoneyClaim to be adjourned generally with liberty to restore,  Upon restoration of the MoneyClaim following return or loss of the vehicle. the Claimant will ensure the pre action protocol for debt claims is followed. 3.    Pursuant to s 90 (1)  of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. An order that the Claimant and/or its agents may enter any premises in which the vehicle is situated in order to recover the vehicle should it not be returned by the Defendant 4.    further or alternatively damages 5.    costs Statement of truth The Claimant believes that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true. The Claimant understands that the proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes or causes to be made a false statement in the document for verified by statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. I am duly Authorised by the Claimant to sign these Particulars of Claim signed Dated 17th of April 2024  What is the total value of the claim? 7502   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? No   Never heard of this   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? n/a Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? No   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After  Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? In a garage  Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes  Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Original Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? n/a   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? They said sent but nor received   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? None seen   Why did you cease payments? Still Paying,   What was the date of your last payment? Yesterday  31st May 2024   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? Yes on 12 Feb 2024   What you need to do now.   Can't scan, will do via another means as you cant have jpg  
    • Now that is an interesting article which adds afew perspective that I hadn't thought significant - but on reflection of the perspectives offered ... Now Starmer is no Blair, however 'blairite he may be perceived, but the Tories aren't tories and aren't even remotely liberal   The fast 'unannounced and unexpected election call from sunack may well be explained by the opinion linked that he hoped reform would be unprepared and effectively call a chunk of Farages largely empty bluster - making him look even more of a prat, leave scope for attacks on shabby reform candidates and mimimise core vote losses to reform - while throwing the 'middle ground' (relative) tories TO THE DOGS - and with the added bonus of likely pacifying his missu' desire to jogg off to sunny cal tout suite somewhat   thumb in the air - I expect about 140ish tory seats, but can hope for under a hundred Reform - got to admit the outside possibility of 1, maybe 2 seats with about 8% of the vote - but unlikely. I think projections of over 10% of the vote for reform is nudged and paid for speculation - but possible with the expected massive drives from Russian, Chinese and far right social media bot and troll prods targeting the gullible.
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      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Yet another welcome thread.


Darwin
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Thanks

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Like the others?

 

What's your question?

 

What's your problem?

 

Details please if you want help.

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:!: All the information I impart is my advice based on my experience. It does not constitute professional advice. If in doubt, always consult with a professional. :!:

 

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Like the others?

 

What's your question?

 

What's your problem?

 

Details please if you want help.

 

 

 

Basically I am looking to find out if the agreement is enforceable because I cant make the figures add up , however that may be me as I fix computers not shuffle figures.

 

I did phone welcome and ask if I brough it down could someone explain how they arrived at those figures and they said there was no one available to do that at this time.

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Chances are something is dodgy alright, so I would get it checked a.s.a.p

Although my comments are my opinion only ! First of all, I would submit a S.A.R ( Subject Access Request ) along with a S77 ( Section 77 Request ) by special delivery. This information will give , or should give you, everything you need to know. Keep copies of all letters you send, and keep the special delivery slips, or proof of signature on delivery.

 

For a Section 77 request, they legally have 12 working days to respond, whereas the Subject Access Request, they have 40 days to respond. Make sure you note your timescales, and stick to them to send chaser letters, or whatever course of action is necessary at that point :p

Forsure

 

** One woman crusade against the rip off lenders ! **

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Chances are something is dodgy alright, so I would get it checked a.s.a.p

Although my comments are my opinion only ! First of all, I would submit a S.A.R ( Subject Access Request ) along with a S77 ( Section 77 Request ) by special delivery. This information will give , or should give you, everything you need to know. Keep copies of all letters you send, and keep the special delivery slips, or proof of signature on delivery.

 

For a Section 77 request, they legally have 12 working days to respond, whereas the Subject Access Request, they have 40 days to respond. Make sure you note your timescales, and stick to them to send chaser letters, or whatever course of action is necessary at that point :p

PLEASE read the thread! The OP has already attached a copy of the agreement, so why exactly would a s77 request be made?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

:!: All the information I impart is my advice based on my experience. It does not constitute professional advice. If in doubt, always consult with a professional. :!:

 

:-) If you feel my post has been helpful, please click my scales. :-)

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Erm.........I have read the thread.........and the point I was trying to make is that sometimes unscrupulous lenders will maybe have different terms on THEIR copy of the agreement rather than the customers copy. If you had read my message then you would have seen that I said ' in my opinion ' . I dont see why being somewhat rude will help anyone. I, like many others, am only trying to offer some help !! :eek:

Forsure

 

** One woman crusade against the rip off lenders ! **

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Erm.........I have read the thread.........and the point I was trying to make is that sometimes unscrupulous lenders will maybe have different terms on THEIR copy of the agreement rather than the customers copy. If you had read my message then you would have seen that I said ' in my opinion ' . I dont see why being somewhat rude will help anyone. I, like many others, am only trying to offer some help !! :eek:

I was not being rude and had no intention of offence. It would help if you were clear on your recommendations because your post did imply you hadn't read the thread.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

:!: All the information I impart is my advice based on my experience. It does not constitute professional advice. If in doubt, always consult with a professional. :!:

 

:-) If you feel my post has been helpful, please click my scales. :-)

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I thought the whole point of this site was for different people to offer their opinions and opinions alone. What I dont like is the fact that you seem to be saying that others who give their opinions are ' wrong ', or ' 'incorrect ' and you dont seem to be giving any leeway there at all.

 

Now back to the real problem......Make sure you get everything in writing, and keep copies / records of all calls and people you speak to....very handly if the case ever comes to court :)

Forsure

 

** One woman crusade against the rip off lenders ! **

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I thought the whole point of this site was for different people to offer their opinions and opinions alone. What I dont like is the fact that you seem to be saying that others who give their opinions are ' wrong ', or ' 'incorrect ' and you dont seem to be giving any leeway there at all.

I seriously recommend you re-read my posts. Nowhere did I say or reasonably seem to say that others who give their opinions are "wrong" or "incorrect". Nor did I not give any leeway at all.

 

Indeed on many occasions I have agreed that others opinions are correct and even gone back on my opinions when reading their opinions.

 

All I was saying was that if you are not clear on your opinion it will be misunderstood.

 

Now back to the real problem......Make sure you get everything in writing, and keep copies / records of all calls and people you speak to....very handly if the case ever comes to court :)

I agree with making sure all is in writing. Try your utmost not to conduct any calls with them, especially Welcome or any debt collection agencies. If they call you insist on a response in writing, but refuse to speak on the phone. If you have to speak on the phone get a recording device - which is entirely legal if used for personal reasons, such as this one - and record all calls. If you are unsure at any stage as to what to say, hang up rather than letting them manipulate you, which is likely to occur.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

:!: All the information I impart is my advice based on my experience. It does not constitute professional advice. If in doubt, always consult with a professional. :!:

 

:-) If you feel my post has been helpful, please click my scales. :-)

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We are talking about Welcome Finance here, and it is hard to say to people to try and not engage in calls with them, when they consistently harass you, call you at home, at work etc etc. At some point you simply must speak to them. It doesnt seems to matter how many times you tell them to leave you alone, that they are harassing you, they do not listen ! :)

Forsure

 

** One woman crusade against the rip off lenders ! **

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We are talking about Welcome Finance here, and it is hard to say to people to try and not engage in calls with them, when they consistently harass you, call you at home, at work etc etc. At some point you simply must speak to them. It doesnt seems to matter how many times you tell them to leave you alone, that they are harassing you, they do not listen ! :)

I understand, but I know from other Welcome threads that people have been able to just hang up on them, and as I said, worst case scenario get a telephone recorder which costs about £30 - visit:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/component/content/article/36-forum-chatback/90-can-i-legally-record-telpehone-calls.html

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/reviews/read-a-review/71-Telephone%20Recorders%20reviews./524-truecall-digital-telephone-recorder-.html

There was also another post about cheaper recording devices which are very good but I can't find it now. Search for UltraDisk - made by a Manchester based company in association with an Australian company. Can't link to their site because it's a commercial link, but it is easy to find in Google.

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:!: All the information I impart is my advice based on my experience. It does not constitute professional advice. If in doubt, always consult with a professional. :!:

 

:-) If you feel my post has been helpful, please click my scales. :-)

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  • 1 month later...

Just a small update.

 

The first contract I had with Welcome was re written and resigned by me to remove the PPI , I have requested a copy of the signed agreement from them on the grounds I am sure I have never had a copy of the 2nd signed agreement.

 

I did a propper CCA letter and enlcosed a PO for £1

Edited by Darwin

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Ok they have acknowledged the CCA but have now gone over the 12+2 days

send account in dispute letter and cancel DD ?

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If it was me in your situation, i'd send the account in dispute letter.....as for paying you are within your rights to do this but they will probably default you....have you thought about doing this ? - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/173201-why-you-shouldnt-use.html with this being the desired result - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/165349-smt37-morgan-stanley-goldfish-3.html#post2119750

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What would putting the account in dispute achieve ?

 

I would like to point out this is not to avoid paying the bill , it mainly to actually get a look at the new(er) credit agreement to see if they did as they said they would.

 

I am trying to see exactly how many payments I made with the PPI on and to see if when they refunded the PPI , they refunded enough.

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Well if you stop the DD's then you have to have a good reason obviously....once you put it in dispute then they can't start to harrass you (although they will)...

 

This is what the OFT say

 

h. ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment

k. not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonably queried or disputed debt.

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Ok the CCA arrived , opened it and it says ''in respose to your subject access request'' which made me smile , they have included a statement which seems to be a complete fabrication , none of the figures add up.

 

I need to talk to one of the experts I think but the things I have noticed so far

 

they asked me to sign a new agreement after I cancelled the PPI and ..

 

1. The APR went up on the new agreement.

2. The new agreement was for the same term as the original thus extending the loan by 5 months.

3. The new loan amount is the same as the original loan amount minus ppi and then they took of the payments on I had made on the first agreement so basically I am being charged interest on money I had already paid.

4. the starting balance on the account statement doesnt match the loan agreement.

 

 

so basically they took the loan ammount added the interest then took of the six payments I had already made. , so I am paying interest on money I didnt borrow

 

what do I do ?

 

 

The first scans in this thread are from the first agreement , I will be posting the second shortly.

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another thing I have found is that payment of an option fee applies to clause 4 , non of the paperwork I have seems to include a clause 4 ?

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Hi Darwin - sorry took a while to get back to you - if they took the PPI off the back and therefore you are paying interest on it still you can refer this to the FOS for them to ajudicate and they may award you extra money back.

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Just a bit of an update

 

they still cant quite see that

 

2995

+interest

-minus payments I have made

=Balance

 

is NOT the same as

 

2995

-Payments I have made

+interest

=Balance

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