CCA Advice -NO Reply from MBNA?

[user2006]

Hi all,

New to the forum but was wondering if people can clarify where i stand ATM.

 

12+2days have passed since requesting the CCA from MBNA (virgin CC) i have had no reponce at all. I can see from others that MBNA seem to take a long time in replying, usually just over their given time frame.

In my initial letter i requested the CCA under S.78.

 

is it worth waiting another week or should i send them a reminder letter on Monday?

is there a template for this?

Also i have a payment with them due on wednesday. Should i pay it?

 

Thanks in advance guys...

Have a good weekend .....

[clemma]

You can send them this letter and make no further payments to them:

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT

 

ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE

 

Thank you for your letter of xx/xx/xx, the contents of which have been noted.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

 

On **DATE** I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. A copy of which is enclosed for your perusal and ease of reference.

 

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account is now in default as of **DATE**.(12+2 days after you sent the CCA request)

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document.In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

Furthermore;

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation. This limit has expired

 

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As you have Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested. Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS. Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect. This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data. It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends. Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit. You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint. I therefore request a copy of your official complaints procedure which you are obliged to supply.

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

[user2006]

Tanks for the template \Clemma,

i have gone over it a few times and i'm a little warry of sending such a forward letter. I doubt that they will acnowledge any of the requests made, especially the removal of all data etc.

 

iam going to send a edited version of the letter you posted. taking out the following 3 sections.

 

1) "I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT"

 

2) "Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect. This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

3) Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data. It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends. Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data."

 

I don't think anyone has had any success on thier second letters with this. please correct me if im wrong. I feel it's more appropriet to request all the above in the next letter, should they still not comply. this way if it goes to court, it will look alot more favourable for me as i'v been 'reasonable' in my actions.

anyway this is just my gut feeling. please do give me your opinion on this anyone..

 

cheers guys:)

#

[clemma]

Leave in the I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT - otherwise they can take your letter as proof you owe the money.......

 

The DPA part IS important. If they have no agreement, then they have NO right to access your credit file and put marks against you/default you etc. The final part is giving them plenty of time to remove such data.

 

Do not be scared of sending these letters. You are being extremely reasonable by giving them the chance to stop processing your data WITHOUT taking them to court. No signed agreement by you means they do not have your permission to use your information in anyway!!

[blueda]

If you are intent in sending a follow up letter, then send the letter clemma has posted to you in full, with nothing taken out of the letter.

[user2006]

Thank you for the quick reply Clemma,

this may be a very stupid question but i was just wondering, i have used this card in recent months but have stopped using it since sending the initial letter. does this affect anything?

 

I will send the original template letter as you stuggested tomorrow....

 

cheers.

[clemma]

Thank you for the quick reply Clemma,

this may be a very stupid question but i was just wondering, i have used this card in recent months but have stopped using it since sending the initial letter. does this affect anything?

 

I will send the original template letter as you stuggested tomorrow....

 

cheers.

 

Not at all

[Signature]

I've been informed by a solicitor that you should continue to pay the monthly payments.

[clemma]

I've been informed by a solicitor that you should continue to pay the monthly payments.

 

:rolleyes:

 

Once the OC or DCA has passed the 12+2 days to respond to the CCA request they go into default. Whilst they are in default and the account is in dispute, you do not have to make payments, nor can they take any action against you to make you do so.

 

Regardless of what this "solicitor" says, the advice given so far is correct. Why dispute an alleged debt only to continue making payments? If there was no problem with the account, then the CCA request would not have been made in the first place......

[user2006]

Don't think they are going to respond to second letter either... Thanks again Clemma for clearing up the last 2 posts. Just to clarify If no response is recieved should i stop correspondence and payments until CCA produced?

[clemma]

I'm afraid you just have to sit tight with this one. Don't send them anymore letters and YES you can with hold payments

[user2006]

Evening all...

Found out on friday that Natwest are charging me 29% interest on my NW CC. Are they allowed to do this>? The APR was 15.9% when i signed up 4 years ago....apparently they would have sent a notice of change through the post.

Any advice/info appriciated....cheers.

[citizenB]

Thank you for the quick reply Clemma,

this may be a very stupid question but i was just wondering, i have used this card in recent months but have stopped using it since sending the initial letter. does this affect anything?

 

I will send the original template letter as you stuggested tomorrow....

 

cheers.

 

If you are going to stop payments and push forward with the CCA request then I would suggest you forget about using the card again:)

 

Don't think they are going to respond to second letter either... Thanks again Clemma for clearing up the last 2 posts. Just to clarify If no response is recieved should i stop correspondence and payments until CCA produced?

 

Only you can decide whether to stop payments or not. Please remember however, that the company will report to the CRA on missed payments regardless of whether there is a legitimate dispute or not.

 

Evening all...

Found out on friday that Natwest are charging me 29% interest on my NW CC. Are they allowed to do this>? The APR was 15.9% when i signed up 4 years ago....apparently they would have sent a notice of change through the post.

Any advice/info appriciated....cheers.

 

They will continue with their normal account activity until such times as the account has been terminated, this will almost certainly include increasing the interest rate.

[user2006]

Many thanks for the advie CitizenB,

Also thank you for clarifying the previous posts. All opinions are very helpful to me.

[Signature]

Hi All

 

I have had my CCA from MBNA (Virgin CC) within the allotted time. Not sure whether it is unenforcable. To my, it looks like something that they have just drafted up. If I post it on here can someone take a look at it and tell me what they reckon, or failing that can someone post me to a thread relating to a copy of an MBNA CCA.

 

Many Thanks

 

http://i725.photobucket.com/albums/ww254/Signature96/RLJ2630004.jpg

Edited March 26, 2009 by Signature

[clemma]

If you can post it up, then people will give you their opinions

[citizenB]

Hi All

 

I have had my CCA from MBNA (Virgin CC) within the allotted time. Not sure whether it is unenforcable. To my, it looks like something that they have just drafted up. If I post it on here can someone take a look at it and tell me what they reckon, or failing that can someone post me to a thread relating to a copy of an MBNA CCA.

 

Many Thanks

 

Signature, do you have your own MBNA thread ?

[Signature]

Hi

 

Here is what my CCA from MBNA looks like:

 

Have a look and see what you think! Any feed back would be much appreciated!

 

http://i725.photobucket.com/albums/w...J2630005-1.jpg

 

http://i725.photobucket.com/albums/w...RLJ2630004.jpg

 

http://i725.photobucket.com/albums/w...RLJ2630003.jpg

 

http://i725.photobucket.com/albums/w...RLJ2630002.jpg

 

http://i725.photobucket.com/albums/w...RLJ2630001.jpg

Edited March 26, 2009 by Signature
Photobucket

[clemma]

They are just links to photobucket.........

[citizenB]

They are just links to photobucket.........

 

 

Signature has started his/her own thread here

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/getting-out-debt/191394-mbna-virgin-cca-view.html

 

The links are working properly in the thread.

[user2006]

Hi got a reply from Natwest. They just sent me a copy of my original application. nothing else. my address was hand written onto the envelope. looks like a school kid wrote it? weird.

anyway what on earth do i do with it...obviously this does no comply with the S/78, what next ...any thoughts?

[clemma]

Send them this letter:

 

I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

RE: Agreement/Account number

 

Thank you for your response to my letter dated xxxxxx 2009, making a formal request for a true copy of the original credit agreement for the above account under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Sections 77-79).

 

The documents you supplied me appear to be no more than an application form, and as such are not a satisfactory response to my request. Nowhere on the front of the document is there any reference to the prescribed terms and conditions that such an agreement must contain. I must assume that these are unconnected documents and once again inadequate to satisfy your obligations.

 

As you are aware you are obliged to provide me with a true copy of my agreement as defined under Section 189 of the CCA 1974. and I consider that you have failed to comply with my request for these documents

 

 

Under the terms of the above Act, a creditor has 12 working days to provide the requested documents. This deadline has now passed and I have not received the requested documents from you.

 

As I am sure you are aware, an agreement that does not contain all of the prescribed terms, and/or is not signed by the debtor, is completely unenforceable & I therefore consider that this account is in dispute with immediate effect & it follows that all payments to this account are suspended forthwith.

 

I draw your attention to the legal requirement that a creditor is not permitted to take any action against an account whilst it remains in dispute. The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and therefore the following applies:

You must not demand any payment on this account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

You must not add any further interest or charges to this account.

You must not pass this account to any third party.

You must not register any information in respect of this account with any of the credit reference agencies.

You must not issue a default notice on this account

I hereby give you notice that if you proceed with any of the above actions, I will file reports with the appropriate authorities, including, but not limited to, Trading Standards, Office of Fair Trading, Information Commissioners Office, Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

Yours faithfully

[user2006]

Send them this letter:

thank you once again Clemma!

[user2006]

well after many days and many weeks ..finally a reply...but,

what does it all mean>!/!?

 

it basicly states the following.

"in accordnce with s 78 of the consumer credit act 1974, we enc a copy of the credit card agreement (original and current) inc T&Cs.

I can confirm that a copy of the original credit agreement has been requested for you and should we be able to provide you with a copy, we fill post it to you.

 

it then goes on to say...

 

"It may be helpful to explain that we are not required to serve a copy of the credit agreement which includes signatures, as the law expressly permits lenders to omit signatures from copies of all credit agreements.”

 

all that was enclosed current t&cs

[clemma]

"Should we be able to provide a copy" - doubtful that they will . Just let them carry on searching for it

 

They are right about being able to send a copy that omits your signature - but why would they if they had the real thing

 

Ignore the T&C's as they have no connection to you