Where do I start?!

[cupcake68]

I am fairly new to this site and have been trying really hard to get my head around all the information I have learnt but today I have taken a real beating and at this moment in time I cannot see the wood for the trees!

 

We are in serious credit card debt and have a 2nd charge on our home with a sub prime lender.

 

We (being myself, my partner and my father) have several properties between us and if we could sell everything today would be able to pay everyone off with a little (not much) left.

 

We have 2 young children who after a very bad experience at local school were taken out last year and have been home educated since (therefore terrified of them getting upset by phone calls and knocks at the door).

 

Having been trying to remortgage several properties since September (no luck with any!) we have sold everything we can to keep making the minimum payments on credit cards.

 

We thought we were virtually there with Abbey. They started a remortgage application for us in January and we were told if we could prove earnings they would be happy to lend. That was 4 weeks ago and they have now, today decided they cannot!

 

So now we are stuck with sub prime lender (12.1%) whose small print is scaring me rigid. i.e as soon as we come to an agreement with a creditor they have the right to sell our home!

 

Having learnt what I have on here in the last couple of weeks we intended to CCA all our credit card co's (approx 20 between us) but didn't want to do that until the remortgage was through.

 

What should we do now? We do not want to loose our home and I just don't know what we should do first.

 

I have been trying to identify where we stand with the sub prime loan (another thread) but it appears it is unregulated therefore we have no protection from their actions.

 

Should we just start CCA ing all creditors?

 

I feel like I want to run away with my kids and hide in a hole! What upsets me most is we are only just getting them back on track after the terrible experiences they endured last year, I don't want to move them away and lose all the friends they have around here!

 

Sorry if this is all over the place but my mind won't think straight any more!

[Guest Gordons Barking]

I would wait for one of the site team to express an opinion. If no one posts in 48 hours contact any member of the site team by personal mail. For what it is worth: Make a paper statement of where you are, so as individuals and as a group, in case the debt can be shifted to one party maximising equity as a whole or defining exactly how much you REALLY want to share all assets / debts; the key to a mortgage is available income and deposit, so if you can combine incomes and shift available equity into a new mortgage the total charge for the mortgage will be reduced - you need to find a mortgage provider not linked to your creditors or your deposit could be taken by associated credit card debt; the CCA thing seems to have worked for me no body wants to take me to court since november - 5 cards BUT I re - mortgaged before starting on that route not sure what it has done to my credit rating, only one default (and that was illegal, so I could get it removed at a later date).

[cupcake68]

Thanks Gordons barking!

 

We have tried to work ownership/income around the best we can but this truly was our only hope!

 

I'm really trying to pull myself together! I know things aren't as bad as they seem I just don't know how to protect my family as best I can.

 

Not only will we lose our home but also my disabled father who will also lose his car (through disability benefit)

 

From what I have learnt on this superb site I have no problems with CCA ing all our credit cards but all that almost seems worthless if the sub prime lenders are going to step in the moment we come to any arrangements with any creditor and take our home!

 

I think it may be time to give up and run away!

[42man]

The CCA is a good first step to take. As for the SP lender, are you up to date with payments ? Have you reclaimed any excessive charges back ? When did you take the SP loan out ? any PPI to reclaim possibly too ?

[cupcake68]

Thanks 42man.

 

We took out the SP loan in Dec 07 and haven't missed any payments and don't intend to.

 

We are not going to be able to keep up the minimum payments on credit cards after this month but we still hope to be able to pay the mortgages, the problem is the small print on the SP loan indicates that if we come to an arrangement with any creditors they have the right to sell our home, therefore it feels like all hope is gone now we can't remortgage to get rid of SP loan.

We need to raise a mortgage of 180k on a propery currently valued at 250-275k you wouldn't think it would be that hard would you?

 

I just don't know if I can keep this up!

[cupcake68]

I have another thread re the SP loan http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/mortgages-secured-loans/182358-blemain-agreement-has-gaps.html#post1966662

[creditcardmug]

Could you manage if you were paying little or nothing on the credit cards/unsecured loans?

[cupcake68]

Hi Creditcardmug

 

Yes that's the depressing thing, if we had remortgaged we would have been fine, even without the remortgage we can afford to pay the mortgages etc but not the credit cards but our terms and conditions on the 2nd charge state if we come to an agreement with any creditors they may repossess. Therefore I feel like it's hardly worth trying!

[creditcardmug]

None of this makes sense, why would the lender with the 2nd charge be, in effect, protecting creditors to whom they have no connection?

 

The lender with the 2nd charge only gets paid once the lender with the 1st charge has its money...lender 1 would have to agree to force a sale, why would they want to when you are not defaulting on your mortgage payments?

 

Notwithstanding the above, there would have to be a repossession hearing first...what judge is going to grant that when you haven't missed any payments on the mortgage or loan?

 

I really think you may have the wrong idea about this so called clause...it may be worth having a free half-hour with a solicitor, just to clear that one up.

Edited February 24, 2009 by creditcardmug

[cupcake68]

We hope the same but it definitely a clause in the agreement to say they may do this and from what i have read about this company they do exactly as they please and it would appear that because it is an unregulated loan they can do what they want!

 

Another of their terms states that if we make an insurance claim whilst they have the charge any money we receive from the insurance must go straight to them instead of being used for any repar!!!!

 

We were truly out of our minds to sign this agreement!

[underdog13]

I would follow creditcardmug's advice, if I were you, esile172 - book that initial free interview with a lawyer:)

[Guest Gordons Barking]

It is worth remembering that by CCAing the credit cards you are not entering into any arrangement with them, quite the opposite you are disputing that any agreement exists and stopping payment. You need to post up that agreement minus any identifiers as to be honest your whole premise seem bogus as is.

[cupcake68]

Thanks everyone for your comments

 

Here is my agreement blemain agreement pictures by elise_clay - Photobucket

 

I'm not expert at any of this but it seems to me they just put whatever they like in the agreement! But we did sign it therefore.......!

 

We do have a glimmer of hope at the end of the tunnel today. The mortgage that we were hoping for was turned down on monday because basically they were saying that although one of the applicants (my partner) had proved income to cover the mortgage the other (my Dad) could not afford to pay if applicant one could no longer pay!! In other words it's not a joint income they wanted, they wanted to know that both apllicants were able to pay (what a joke!). Anyhow, our mortgage broker having thought about it has raised a complaint and they are going to look at it again!

 

I just hope we can get rid of this awful sub prime loan so that I can get on with addressing the unsecured debts!

[Guest Gordons Barking]

Thanks, that makes things clearer. You have an expensive mortgage not a second mortgage presumably due to credit problems back in 2007. Can not read the detail on page 2 so how does the variable rate change. If linked to the bank of England rate it should have reduced substantially since taken out. Is your underlying debt problem the issue. If so the best thing you can do is dump the credit cards via CCA requests and let the mortgage broker earn their fee by explaining how this will improve your available cash flow to prospective 'good' mortgage providers. This is just my personal opinion as someone with no more right to live on G-ds clean earth than a weasel.

[cupcake68]

Hi GB

 

The interest rate we are paying hasn't changed since we took it out in dec 07, we are still paying 12.1% but it does state it can be changed at anytime with just 7 days notice!!

I thought a 2nd mortgage was called a 2nd charge am I wrong?

If I CCA the credit cards it is going to effect my credit rating initially therefore we won't be able to get rid of these sharks will we?

[Guest Gordons Barking]

According to the way I read your agreement ~'the loan is to be used for the sole purpose of paying off your previous mortgage'. You only have one mortgage on the property as you paid off the original with the re mortgage a second charge is when the original mortgage provider agrees to let you take a secured loan on equity above the value of the existing mortgage remaining to be repaid. If you took the credit cards out more than two years ago overall you probably have at least a 8 out of 10 chance that no enforceable agreement exists. If I were you I might talk to the mortgage provider direct or ask your broker to do this and project conservatively how this is likely to improve your debt and income situation. The credit cards should not default you if get all the CCA requests in at the same time and you have been meeting the minimum repayments. I did 5 at once only one has defaulted me since November and that was done a few weeks after the CCA request went in so was probably just a mistake on their part. You can be virtually certain that of those 2 out of 10 agreements that might exist it would be months if at all before they get converted into CCJ's. If you are not going to get the new mortgage as it is why not float the proposition outlined above if they still say no do it anyway to reduce your debt burden. This is just my personal opinion as someone with no more right to live on G-ds clean earth than a weasel.

[cupcake68]

Thanks GB (again!)

 

We still have our existing mortgage, this is a 2nd loan on our property!

 

I am going to try to find the money to pay March min payments (!) and CCA them all, hopefully in the meantime we might get our second opinion on the remortgage (although I'm not holding out much hope - their reasons for not loaning were so lame!)

 

Is that really the odds on credit cards older than 2 years? Of the the 30 we have between us (3) I think we only have one that is newer than that!

[Guest Gordons Barking]

The rules changed a couple of years ago so that the original physical agreement is no longer required to enforce payment of a credit card debt also the agreement itself does not have to be signed and dated etc if the application is done on line... You should read through relevant 'sticky' threads you can find by using the search feature for 'CCA Agreement' - start with this one: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/105315-my-agreement-enforceable-useful.html#post1005260 My figures are a conservative guesstimate with some credit cards it is virtually 100% e.g. if you had an Abbey card that was taken over by MBNA - MBNA did not buy the Abbey archive as part of the deal so have no access to the original agreements, which I imagine to longer exist.

[nosnibor]

Hi esile

Just had a quick scan through your thread and I’m sure there is a way out of this.

Do not be put off from tackling your unsecured creditors because of the clause in the Blemain contract

a) If your payments to Blemain are up to date I see very little chance of them trying to take possession of your property.

b) If they were foolish enough to try going into court and asking a judge to grant a possession order on an account that was not in arrears they would in my opinion be sent packing.

Best of luck

Nosnibor

[cupcake68]

GB

Wow! Silly mistake by MBNA! (ha ha he he!) That will serve them right for reducing my credit limit so harshly and increase my interest rate to 34%!!

 

Nosnibor

Thanks for your advice, I do find it weird but i do still worry about them having the option if they so decide!

 

We have made an appointment to see a debt counsellor next week are they likely to know/suggest about finding out if our agreements are enforceable? Is it something i can discuss with them or is it best not to mention? I will still be CCAing them whatever advice they give!

[Guest Gordons Barking]

The debt people tend to be funded by you know who and are also not going to take the potentially risky option for them of recommending a legal loophole that does not always work for each credit card to reduce debt.

[cupcake68]

Thanks GB

 

I will see what they tell me on Thursday but I will def CCA them all next weekend.

 

We still haven't heard from Abbey about the mortgage!!!

 

Let's hope next week will be a better one!

 

This site has taught me so much! The worst thing about this experience is the fear of the unknown and now I've found this site I don't feel so in the dark about it all!

 

Thank you

[cupcake68]

SO!

 

We met with the debt advice people last week, they were very helpful, but basically we aren't earning enough to pay our debts (this we knew!)

 

We now have to go away and re jig our budget to show that we have a minimum amount left in our budget to show about twenty pound spare each month, therefore stating we can only afford to pay each credit card £1 per month.

 

I asked the question about uns=enforceable credit agreements, they new nothing about them but couldn't believe big organisations like barclaycard would leave themselves open!!!

 

So!!

 

We have also been told by Abbey that the mortgage we have been waiting a decision on for 9 weeks is only available to us if we pay off our credit cards first!!! Back to the same old story, they will only lend if you can prove that you don't need it!

 

So!

 

We are stuck with the extortionately high 2nd charge for ever (well it seems like it will be forever!) let's just hope they don't increase the interest any more than 12.1% that we now pay.

 

SO!

 

I cannot pay the credit card minimum payments next month therefore I feel we have no choice but to CCA them all now hoping that we can get some off our back (I still can't believe this is possible!) then once we know where we stand with each of them we will have to go back to the debt counselling people and ask them to negotiate with each lender.

 

Does this seem the sensible thing to do?

 

My mind has been in a whirl for so long with all this I'm not completely sure I'm seeing this straight!

 

Please could anyone give me some support or advice about it all!

 

:confused::confused::confused::confused::confused::confused::confused::confused:

[underdog13]

How old are your your cards, Esile? Generally the older the account the less likely they are to be compliant or even found at all.

[cupcake68]

Hi Underdog

 

They are all quite old, I think only one is since Apr 07, it's the quantity that we have that makes me think we couldn't be so lucky!!

 

I have saved this letter from this site at some time in the last few weeks is this the letter I should be sending to them all?

 

1 High Street,

Newtown,

Kent

R21 4RH

June 28, 2006

 

The Loan Company

Company House,

Church Street,

Newtown,

Kent,

R1 7HG

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re:− Account/Reference Number 4563210025897412

 

This letter is a formal request pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide.

 

I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit. You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request, the provisions of s.77 will apply.

 

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

 

I enclose a postal order in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

 

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee.

 

We look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

Mr A N Other

 

Should I do them all at once being that I know I can't meet any of the payments next month?

 

Any advice useful!

 

Thanks