Blair, Oliver and Scott--Need Advice please!

[rb2010]

Hi,

 

This is my first time posting on the site and i'm looking for some advice. I am a full time student and some years ago had a personal loan with Bank of scotland/halifax and a student overdraft.

 

I fell behind with my loan payments and it was referred to Blair, Oliver and Scott along with my overdraft, which at the time of taking out was told by the bank that i would not need to pay back until i had graduated. However, my account was closed half way through my course and i am now making payments to my loan and overdraft via Blair etal.

 

I have been reading some posts and have sent letters to blair et al requesting credit agreements for both debts. What i would like to know is what do i do next once the 30 days are up, whether i get a reply or not from blair et al?

 

I feel that they shift the goal posts whenever they feel necessary, since i started paying the debt via blair et al i have not missed a payment, but they keep harassing me to make increased payments and i am still studying. they know this but refuse to leave me alone everytime they decide to up my payments.

 

when i was making my last payment i chanced it and asked the call handler to send me out the agreements and she said no problem, however, all i got was a list of the payments i had made. So, don't think they will send me any agreements.

 

Also, is it true that a debt is not enforceable under the original bank agreement if it has been passed to a company such as blair et al?

 

Where does this stand with overdrafts?

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Below is the original letter i sent out.

 

 

Blair Oliver and Scott

PO Box 66 Rosyth KY112WG (Via recorded delivery)

Dear Sir/Madam,

Re: xxxx

I am presently striving to organise my personal information and can find no reference to the above agreement that I am presently paying money into.

Could I ask that you supply me with a true copy of the agreement? I understand that this is my right under the legislation contained within section 77 (1) and section 78 (1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I also understand that it is your obligation to provide me with a statement of account. I enclose a £1 postal order in payment of the statutory fee.

 

Since you are a Debt Collection Agency could I ask that you supply a signed true copy of the deed of assignment of the above referenced agreement? This is, I understand, an obligation, whether you are the original creditor or not, under section 189 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

I hope to hear from you within the statutory time limit.

Yours faithfully,

[N.P]

So, you sent the above letter and all they sent you back were statements which you had paid?

 

Do you have a scanner to scan in your documentation, editing out any identifying features, of course.

 

DCA`s are parrassites, who terrorise people, that is why they should be bombed. That`s what you do with terrorists

 

Anyway, they are asking for more, because you are already paying them, so they know your a soft touch.

 

The first thing is, to get them to PROVE the debt is yours, and then to see if they have a right to collect it

 

Can I just ask how much the debt is and how much you are paying a week or month?

 

Here is a PROVE IT letter I sent to Lowell Financial. Edit it to suit your needs. It`s a `who the **** are you talking to `no no-nonsense` letter`.

 

I`ve used it with a couple of friends to good effect.

 

 

 

 

Dear empty heads,

 

You have contacted me regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by myself.

 

What the hell are you dribbling on about? You ask me for a payment, without proving anything. Are you on smack or something? I would point out that I have no knowledge of any such debt being owed to, or have even heard of Lowell Portfolio.

 

I am also familiar with the Office of Fair Trading Debt Collection Guidance which states that it is unfair to send demands for payment to an individual when it is uncertain that they are the debtor in question.

 

I would also point out that the Office of Fair Trading say under the Guidance that it is unfair to pursue third parties for payment when they are not liable. In not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonably queried or disputed debt you are using deceptive/and or unfair methods.

 

Furthermore ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment amounts to physical/psychological harassment.

 

I would ask that no further contact be made concerning the above account unless you can provide evidence as to my liability for the debt in question, for example, the last bill you have at our address, or your receipt of purchase. This would be very interesting to see.

 

Further to the above, and your threat to arrange for one of your moron`s to visit, do you honestly think I’m going to entertain your so-called agent? I don’t think so! Make sure that any contact by yourselves is made in writing only to the above address. Telephone calls and personal visits will not be accepted and viewed as harassment and dealt with accordingly - Administration Of Justice Act 1970, Protection From Harassment Act 1997, Communications Act 2003. If you choose to harass me by telephone I will report you to OFCOM, Trading Standards and The Office Of Fair Trading, meaning that you will be liable to a substantial fine, far more than this alleged debt. Failing that, I will sue for damages.

 

May I remind you, there is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc, and let`s not forget the pizza boy (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd (1959) 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.). Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your empty headed representatives to visit me at my property and if you do so, then you will be liable to damages for a tort of trespass and action will be taken, including but not limited to, Police attendance.

 

I await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed. Otherwise I will have no option but to make a complaint to the Trading Standards department and consider informing the Office of Fair Trading of your phishing actions.

 

I look forward to your reply.

 

Yours sincerely

 

 

 

Me.

 

PRINT YOUR NAME - DO NOT SIGN!

 

 

 

 

Send that off and we`ll see what comes back.

 

In the mean time, it is up to you if you want to keep paying these imbeciles, after all, they haven`t proved anything yet, so why pay them anything? It`s like me writing to you and saying you owe me money and I want it all NOW, would you pay up? If not, why? If so, why?

 

Hope this helps.

 

Ciao for now.

 

Regards

 

 

 

N.P

Edited January 14, 2009 by N.P
Dodgy spelling

[rb2010]

Thanks,

 

But what sort of evidence is satisfactory? I get a bank statement still from bank of scotland every month for both accounts showing my payments have been made. Would this letter only concern the overdraft? Someone said i should claim back the charges on both accounts. would i send this to the Bank or blair et al? I know i owe the money, so in theory i should be paying it back. But i also know the way they treated me in closing my accounts etc was unjustified. My loan amounts to £6500 and my overdraft is at £1900. I pay £35 to each account each month.

 

Thanks for your help.

[N.P]

The thing is, your paying a Debt Collection Agency. You should cut these cranks out and pay the Bank directly.

 

Even if you do owe the money, the DCA still have to prove you owe the debt. Let them do all the work and if they do come up with proof, then deal directly and only with the Bank.

 

If there are charges applied then start the claim process. If the Bank don`t have an agreement or account opening form, then it could be considered the overdraft was a gift.

 

My Bank, Lloyds TSB said I have broken the agreement of the overdraft, yet after almost a year, they still haven`t shown up with any paperwork. Although my account is around 23 years old, and at the time a charge was only £5, they would still have to prove that I entered into an agreement. Same thing would apply to you.

 

As to your statements, well someone appeared in Court over a similar dispute and showed the Judge a copy of a statement he`d edited himself, simply to prove statements alone are not enough evidence, and that anyone can print them out and edit them to suit.

 

Send your letter to whoever is chasing you for money, is this case it would be the DCA.

 

Have you CCA them regarding your loan? When was this loan taken out?

 

At the end of the day, it`s up to you what you do. What exactly are you wanting from this? Afterall, you came on here for help because your being chased by a DCA and now your saying they have a right because you owe the money.

 

What do you want to do?

 

Regards

 

 

 

N.P

[N.P]

Hi rb2010,

 

I see you have posted on the Multiple Agreements Under Section 18 Thread, for further advise.

 

Have you sent off the above letter?

 

Section 28 arguements will not help you, as you have not agreement to check. If your happy making payments then fine, but you look at it this way, all a DCA is after is your money, to make something for themselves. They are not interested in help you at all.

 

You are quite within your rights to ask the morons for proof of this debt, and also their right to claim it. I understand you may be nervous about challenging them, but beleive me, EVERYONE on here felt the same when we first turned to CAG for help. Nowadays, I get bored of waiting for the postie because at the moment, everything has been quiet for quite some time now.

 

You say you admit to oweing the money, that maybe so, so why do you pay a DCA when you DON`t owe them anything?

 

Send that letter which I pasted up, or one of your own, but you must challenge them or they`ll make you life hell!

 

Everyone wants to help each other, so let us know what your intentions are?

 

Ciao for now.

 

 

 

N.P

[N.P]

One more thing,

 

You mention you opened the Loan some years ago and fell behind.

 

When did you actually open the Loan account?

 

The Loan and Overdraft would be two seperate accounts. We need the CCA for the Loan and we can challenge the overdraft too.

 

A duff CCA for the Loan could possibly turn this around for you.

[rb2010]

Hey N.P.

 

The loan was originally opened in 2005 and after that the bank offered to reschedule the loan, which started in 2006. This was then passed on to Blair et al. On the original loan, there is a customer account status message on my credit file which states.

 

"Partial settlement: Payment received as full and final settlementalthough the payment would not fully clear the balance."

 

Also, on the rescheduled loan that was sent to Blair et al the terms on the credit file say " 0@£89" Both files have never been updated since they were defaulted.

 

Btw, still haven't heard anything from Blair et al since my first letter.

 

Regards,

R.B.

[rb2010]

Hey,

 

Drafted up this second letter to be sent in the instance that Blair et al do not contact me or provide me with a valid CCA.

 

Thanks to this forum of course, for the material etc.

 

Please take a look at it and feel free to tweak.

 

Blair Oliver and Scott

PO Box 66

Rosyth

(Via recorded delivery)

 

 

Account in Dispute.

 

 

Do not ignore this letter.

 

 

 

Dear Sir,

 

Re: Agreement reference

This letter has also been sent to the Company Secretary, Blair Oliver & Scott Ltd, 8 North Bank Street, Edinburgh, EH1 2LP

Before I continue I wish to establish that I am not seeking to avoid responsibility for any debt that I may have or had, I am seeking to redress a wrong.

I wrote to you on the [INSERT DATE] requesting a copy of the executed agreement under the Consumer Credit Act (1974). I also asked for a statement of account. A ‘Lxxa’ at your address assured myself that she would contact the relevant department to ensure that my original letter had been received. I also requested an executed deed of assignment documenting Blair Oliver & Scott’s involvement; this too has not been supplied.

In the statutory time you have been unable to supply an agreement .

Consequently I do not acknowledge any debt to your company

As you will know your non-compliance with my request means that your company has committed an offence under Section 77 (4) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, summarily punishable by a Level 4 fine on the standard scale.

A credit agreement that is not properly documented and signed by the customer is totally unenforceable under the Consumer Credit Act and is therefore a complete defence to any court claim that is issued. Please take note that any legal action you may contemplate will be vigorously defended and contested.

I also contend that the money that you have obtained from me has been unlawful since you have not provided me with any documentation to prove the contrary, and under common law you may not profit from an unlawful act.

Furthermore your actions arguably do not comply with the Office of Fair Trading’s (OFT) Debt Collection Guidelines of July 2003, in that you have ‘communicated with [me] in an inaccurate or misleading manner (section 2.1) by ‘presenting information in that it creates a false or misleading impression’ and ‘failing to provide [me] with information on the status of debts’.

Notwithstanding the above your operatives have sought to contact me on a number of occasions (approximately ten times) in one day,I would imagine regarding your Company’s viewpoint on the above now disputed agreement. I know of these attempts because of the recording received when using British Telcom’s 1471 facility. This intrusion into my privacy has caused a great deal of distress to my family and myself, since because of The Data Protection Act (Data Protection Act) your operatives say they are not allowed to discuss matters with them. We now consider that your ‘phone calls constitute harassment and so from this date any further calls to me will be reported to the Police. In addition you are in breech of the OFT’s July 2003 guidelines in that you are wrongly pursing me contrary to Section 2.8(i).

Another worrying facet of this whole case is the unlawful dissemination of my data by your company to a third party. Under the Data Protection Act I have principled rights in that

 

(Schedule I)

 

1. Personal data shall be processed fairly and lawfully.

2. Personal data shall be obtained only for one or more specified and lawful purposes, and shall not be further processed in any manner incompatible with that purpose or those purposes.

 

(Schedule II)

 

1. The subject has given his consent.

2. The processing is necessary –

a. For the performance of a contract to which the data subject is a party.

I have recently conducted an audit of my personal credit reports supplied by Experian and Equifax. Within both files, an entry referenced as “Bank of Scotland” is lodged indicating a loan. This is recorded as “In Default” on the 27th February 2004. However, I note that files have been updated continually since then. Since I have had no contact with The Bank of Scotland I can only deduce that it is Blair Oliver & Scott that is updating my credit file without my consent or that your company is disseminating my information to a third party without my consent

The fact that you cannot provide me with a copy of the agreement negates any Notice of Default being served on me, as required by the conditions of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. Incidentally, I cannot recollect receipt of the said documentation. If the documentation were to be produced as you are aware the default notice cancels any original terms and conditions and as such cancels any right to share my information without my consent.

What I require.

1. I require you with immediate effect to ensure that all data held by you regarding the alleged agreement is removed from any and all Credit Reference Agency database.

2. Ensure that all data held by you regarding me and my family is destroyed.

3. Refund all monies paid to you by me since August 2007.

4. Ensure that no further telephone calls are made to me or my place of work.

5. Ensure that all correspondence is made in writing.

6. I require written confirmation of the above together with a quarterly statement that no data has been processed regarding me by you.

 

Failure to comply

• Failure to comply with my request under the Data Protection Act 1998 will result in the matter being referred to the Information Commissioner.
  
• Failure to comply with the requirements of the Consumer Credit Act will cause me to refer the matter to the Office of Fair Trading, and Trading Standards.
  
• Failure to comply with the requirements Office of Fair Trading guidelines will lead to a report being submitted.
  
• Continued telephone contact will generate a complaint to the police.
  
• Failure to repay the paid sums shall cause me to report you to the OFT, Trading Standards and the Financial Services Authority.
  
• If you fail to comply with any or all of the above I reserve the right to offer the experience to Consumer Interest media, I have just enrolled with BBC TV’s consumer watchdog database.
  
• If you fail to comply with any or all of the above I reserve the right to take action against you without further contact.
  

I hope to hear from you within 12 working days from the date of this letter, failure to do so will be taken that you failed to comply with my request.

Yours faithfully,

[N.P]

rb2010,

 

What is wrong with your copy and pasting? It`s terrible.

 

I started reading it, then gave up as it was doing my eyes in

 

I have noticed you started by stating you are not looking to avoid responsibility for the alleged debt, but then go on to use clippings of the CCA request and Data Protection Act, which are often used in a defense. In other words your contradicting yourself. It doesn`t make sense.

 

I don`t know if you realise, but these DCA`s are no-bodies! They are nothing special, your better than them, so why do you find the need to explain yourself to them. Afterall, you don`t owe them anything, they`re just in it for the money.

 

Stop messing about and send that letter I pasted for you, it will let them know you won`t be pushed about.

 

What are you hoping to achive from this thread?

 

 

 

N.P

[Fred Bassett]

RB, you're obviously having a problem with this copy & paste business. Here's a suggestion. Type Start>Run>Notepad and hit enter. Paste into notepad then copy and paste from there. It will get rid of all of the coding.

 

Regards.

 

Fred

[rb2010]

Ok sorry bout the code. second time lucky.

 

Please take a look at it and feel free to tweak.

Blair Oliver and Scott

PO Box 66

Rosyth

(Via recorded delivery)

 

Account in Dispute.

 

Do not ignore this letter.

 

Dear Sir,

Re: Agreement reference

This letter has also been sent to the Company Secretary, Blair Oliver & Scott Ltd, 8 North Bank Street, Edinburgh, EH1 2LP

Before I continue I wish to establish that I am not seeking to avoid responsibility for any debt that I may have or had, I am seeking to redress a wrong.

I wrote to you on the [iNSERT DATE] requesting a copy of the executed agreement under the Consumer Credit Act (1974). I also asked for a statement of account. A ‘Lxxa’ at your address assured myself that she would contact the relevant department to ensure that my original letter had been received. I also requested an executed deed of assignment documenting Blair Oliver & Scott’s involvement; this too has not been supplied.

In the statutory time you have been unable to supply an agreement .

Consequently I do not acknowledge any debt to your company

As you will know your non-compliance with my request means that your company has committed an offence under Section 77 (4) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, summarily punishable by a Level 4 fine on the standard scale.

A credit agreement that is not properly documented and signed by the customer is totally unenforceable under the Consumer Credit Act and is therefore a complete defence to any court claim that is issued. Please take note that any legal action you may contemplate will be vigorously defended and contested.

I also contend that the money that you have obtained from me has been unlawful since you have not provided me with any documentation to prove the contrary, and under common law you may not profit from an unlawful act.

Furthermore your actions arguably do not comply with the Office of Fair Trading’s (OFT) Debt Collection Guidelines of July 2003, in that you have ‘communicated with [me] in an inaccurate or misleading manner (section 2.1) by ‘presenting information in that it creates a false or misleading impression’ and ‘failing to provide [me] with information on the status of debts’.

Notwithstanding the above your operatives have sought to contact me on a number of occasions (approximately ten times) in one day,I would imagine regarding your Company’s viewpoint on the above now disputed agreement. I know of these attempts because of the recording received when using British Telcom’s 1471 facility. This intrusion into my privacy has caused a great deal of distress to my family and myself, since because of The Data Protection Act (Data Protection Act) your operatives say they are not allowed to discuss matters with them. We now consider that your ‘phone calls constitute harassment and so from this date any further calls to me will be reported to the Police. In addition you are in breech of the OFT’s July 2003 guidelines in that you are wrongly pursing me contrary to Section 2.8(i).

Another worrying facet of this whole case is the unlawful dissemination of my data by your company to a third party. Under the Data Protection Act I have principled rights in that

 

(Schedule I)

1. Personal data shall be processed fairly and lawfully.

2. Personal data shall be obtained only for one or more specified and lawful purposes, and shall not be further processed in any manner incompatible with that purpose or those purposes.

 

(Schedule II)

1. The subject has given his consent.

2. The processing is necessary –

a. For the performance of a contract to which the data subject is a party.

I have recently conducted an audit of my personal credit reports supplied by Experian and Equifax. Within both files, an entry referenced as “Bank of Scotland” is lodged indicating a loan. This is recorded as “In Default” on the [insert date]. However, I note that files have been updated continually since then. Since I have had no contact with The Bank of Scotland I can only deduce that it is Blair Oliver & Scott that is updating my credit file without my consent or that your company is disseminating my information to a third party without my consent

The fact that you cannot provide me with a copy of the agreement negates any Notice of Default being served on me, as required by the conditions of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. Incidentally, I cannot recollect receipt of the said documentation. If the documentation were to be produced as you are aware the default notice cancels any original terms and conditions and as such cancels any right to share my information without my consent.

What I require.

1. I require you with immediate effect to ensure that all data held by you regarding the alleged agreement is removed from any and all Credit Reference Agency database.

2. Ensure that all data held by you regarding me and my family is destroyed.

3. Refund all monies paid to you by me since August 2007.

4. Ensure that no further telephone calls are made to me or my place of work.

5. Ensure that all correspondence is made in writing.

6. I require written confirmation of the above together with a quarterly statement that no data has been processed regarding me by you.

Failure to comply

Failure to comply with my request under the Data Protection Act 1998 will result in the matter being referred to the Information Commissioner.

Failure to comply with the requirements of the Consumer Credit Act will cause me to refer the matter to the Office of Fair Trading, and Trading Standards.

Failure to comply with the requirements Office of Fair Trading guidelines will lead to a report being submitted.

Continued telephone contact will generate a complaint to the police.

Failure to repay the paid sums shall cause me to report you to the OFT, Trading Standards and the Financial Services Authority.

If you fail to comply with any or all of the above I reserve the right to offer the experience to Consumer Interest media, I have just enrolled with BBC TV’s consumer watchdog database.

If you fail to comply with any or all of the above I reserve the right to take action against you without further contact.

I hope to hear from you within 12 working days from the date of this letter, failure to do so will be taken that you failed to comply with my request.

Yours faithfully,

[rb2010]

Hi Guys,

 

Still haven't heard from Blair et al. They recieved my first letter requesting the credit agreement on the 9th Jan. How long do i wait before sending any other letters/stopping payments?

 

Any advice?

 

Thanks

[Fred Bassett]

Hi Guys,

 

Still haven't heard from Blair et al. They recieved my first letter requesting the credit agreement on the 9th Jan. How long do i wait before sending any other letters/stopping payments?

 

Any advice?

 

Thanks

 

Hi RB, they have 12 working days + 2 so you might be a tad early year. Personally I would give them until the end of the month. These things can take time, I had one from BoS that took over a year!

 

Regards.

 

Fred