Is This A CCA or Just an Initial Application?

[***inca***]

I received this from Barclaycard (they have now passed the account on to CSL).

 

Isn't this just a copy of my initial application and then a copy of the current terms and conditions as set out by a CCA?

 

What I am hoping is my initial application...

 

 

 

 

Photocopy of their conditions...

 

 

[PGH7447]

looks like an application form to me but the scan is pretty bad

[fedup74]

No prescribed terms on your "application". Is there any way the application and their T&Cs could be part of the same document, it doesn't look like it but it is pretty hard to read too.

[***inca***]

They are two seperate documents.

 

The first one the copy is very bad and there are parts on it that I cannot read.

 

It says the following:

 

At the top on the right: BARCLAYCARD Priority Application, underneath that it has a barcode on it with my name, underneath it says 'all it needs is a little application'.

 

It has my name and address top left.

 

In the large box on the left of the paper it asks for my details:

 

Title

Name

DOB

Telephone Number

Mother's Maiden Name

Earnings

Bank

Sort Code

Whether I am employed (I ticked yes)

 

It then says in the little box underneath it: This is a credit agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, sign only if you want to be bound legally by it's terms. There is my signature and the date underneath.

 

There is then a grey box underneath that says Credit Agreement Regulated By the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and there are approximately 10 small lines of writing that is impossible to read.

 

At the bottom (where I have ticked something) I believe that is with regard to PPI.

 

I have had a couple of people look at this (no legal wizzes though) and they have said they are certain it is just an initial application that I have filled in.

 

The second document reads 'Barclaycard Conditions Credit Agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974'.

 

To me it simply looks like an application form and then a seperate sheet of terms and conditions

[PGH7447]

that is my gut reaction that it is an application form

[***inca***]

That is my gut reaction also - it even has on it which free gift I wanted, I chose the Barclaycard travel bag

 

And that they have been nice enough to throw in the current terms and conditions for me.

 

What do you think I should do?

[PGH7447]

send the account in dispute letter back at them

[***inca***]

I was hoping you were going to say that!

 

Now, I have been dealing with Credit Solutions for months as BC passed it onto them, I CCA'd CSL and they said they were getting in touch with BC, this 'CCA' garb actually came from Barclaycard, complete with compliments slip.

 

Do I send the dispute to CSL or BC?

[PGH7447]

bc and cc csl

[***inca***]

Will do, thank you for your help

[***inca***]

Is there anyone else that has had a look at this and thought differently?

[davey77]

A response to a CCA that is in part illegible is one cause for the unenforceable argument. The Creditor is duty bound to supply the documentation in a clear and readable state.

 

As said, it's hard to read and initially it looks like a copy of the application form and separate T&Cs

[***inca***]

Thanks Davey.

[MickKane]

Yep looks like an application to me aswell, im having the same sort of dispute with MBNA good luck

[davey77]

Apart from the fact i only see one signature. Where is the lenders?

 

s61 CCA - Signing of agreement:

(1) A regulated agreement is not properly executed unless—

(a) a document in the prescribed form itself containing all the prescribed terms and conforming to regulations under section 60(1) is signed in the prescribed manner both by the debtor or hirer and by or on behalf of the creditor or owner, and

(b) the document embodies all the terms of the agreement, other than implied terms, and

© the document is, when presented or sent to the debtor or hirer for signature, in such a state that all its terms are readily legible.

s127(3) CCA:

(3) The court shall not make an enforcement order under section 65(1) if section 61(1)(a) (signing of agreements) was not complied with unless a document (whether or not in the prescribed form and complying with regulations under section 60(1)) itself containing all the prescribed terms of the agreement was signed by the debtor or hirer (whether or not in the prescribed manner).

[***inca***]

I am sending a dispute to them, should I send a SAR too or wait to see what they say about the dispute?

[summerbreeze]

Can I ask how you upload the image ? is it from a hosting site or direct from your PC ?

I need to have 2 ccas looked at

Thanks for any help

[***inca***]

I uploaded them to my laptop via my phone and then used Image hosting, free photo sharing & video sharing at Photobucket to link them to here

[davey77]

Can I ask how you upload the image ? is it from a hosting site or direct from your PC ?

I need to have 2 ccas looked at

Thanks for any help

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/welcome-consumer-forums/177224-credit-agreement-copy-2.html#post1956681

[davey77]

I would Subject Access Request them as they can take a very long time to comply. 40 days is the limit but they may go over that and then you'll have to complain to the Information Commissioners Office etc. Again takes time.

[***inca***]

Okay, will do.

 

If I SAR them, am I still meant to make payments? I haven't been doing so, although they took an unauthorised payment from my card today, so have had to get on the phone to my bank etc. Nightmare (a whole other thread infact!).

[davey77]

I wouldn't like to say don't pay, on the basis of what they have sent. As it's not an obvious unenforceable agreement to the eye immediately (to me at least) then, if it's affordable, then probably best to continue to pay (and avoid a lot of hassle, calls & letters in the mean time IMO.

 

On a question of affordability then priority debts take precedence and you pay what you can afford after rent, food, utilities. If they don't like it on that basis then tough. (National Debtline would agree on that front.)

 

I didn't have such worries, eventually, with no assets, property etc. Other people who actually have something to lose and don't pay, based only on what they receive to a CCA request, have to consider the matter more carefully.

[ashmk]

it even has on it which free gift I wanted, I chose the Barclaycard travel bag

 

Accepting the bag binds you into the contract and you must pay or they will take you to court, make you bankkrupt, sell your house and chain you to a lamppost for 20 lashings.

[***inca***]

Oh darn. That's me done for isn't it then

 

Davey - the payment is the whole reason I discovered CAG in the first place. I am on JSA and was paying £35 a month, I made a late payment to them and they then put it up to £50. I said it was too much. They said TOUGH basically.

 

I then came on here and here I am.

 

I have no idea what to pay them, and as they have now stolen money from my account (see my other thread) I am loathed to pay them anything unless I have to!

[ashmk]

Stolen money from your account ??? You have a direct debit with them ??

 

RULE 1 ... CANCEL DCA DIRECT DEBITS.

 

If they have your card number.. Cancel the card and get a new one.