Excel Parking ECN - Bawtry Town Council

[jeeves72]

I have read on this site that "Private Parking Companies are not backed by any aspect of criminal law. Tickets from Traffic Wardens working for the police or local authorities or tickets issued by police officers are. There are provisions for them in the Road Traffic Act 1991 and these provisions allow sanctions that the issuing authority can take. "

 

I have an excess charge notice from Excel Parking Services Limited relating to off street parking for Bawtry Town Council. I am confused as to whether the RTA applies in this case. I had intended to take the route of asking for evidence of the driver etc but am now unsure.

[Guest Ting]

If it's a private co contracted to the Council then it's legit and issued under old criminal legislation. does it say RTRA 1984?

 

otherwise, a ppc pretending to act for a Council is a big deal - Nick nick for them.

[jeeves72]

It's the whole town/parish thing that I was unclear about. The parking certainly does belong to Bawtry Town Council and yes, does quote Section 35a of RTA 1984.

[Guest Ting]

Sounds legit then. Can only be contested at Maggy's Court - and that's risky wihout a strong case.

 

Couldn't establish any facts from Council website. You maybe could just check that this is a proper contractor.

 

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[Guest Ting]

Now I think about it i wonder if a Council can actually use a contractor to enforce when still using criminal system?

Not sure. 'Lamma' might know.

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[Barnsley Boy]

Some links here:

 

Warsop Web Letters

 

http://www.excelparking.co.uk/downloads/flyer/Excel%20Flyer%20Issue%206.pdf

 

Although excel claim on their website that they manage the car park for the council under the RTRA 1984, this certainly deserves checking. After all, they have something of a reputation for being somewhat casual with the truth.

 

Yes, Excel have a contract with the council for the management of the car park, but is this a wholesale contracting out or are Excel acting as an agency?

 

Jeeves, could you scan in the paperwork, washed of all personally identifying information? We should be able to tell from this whether Excel are acting on their own account or not.

[lamma]

lets see the paper.

[RichardM]

According to minutes of the Bawtry council meetings, Excel are operating the Market Hill car park on behalf of the Council. It would seem, from the comments of the mayor in his annual address of 2007, that the car park is effectively funding a large portion of their budgets, the council being paid 50% of the takings.

 

http://www.bawtrytowncouncil.co.uk/Assets/Minutes/Annual.pdf

 

Bawtry are part of the Doncaster Metropolitan Borough Concils (DMBC) who have a customer services office which deals with appeals for fixed penalty notices issued in the DMBC area, but NOT appeals for tickets issued in the Market Hill car park at Bawtry.

 

It would be interesting to ask Bawtry Council the following questions.

 

1. What is the appeals process for tickets issued in the market street car park.

2. What is the standing policy for judging those appeals.

3. How many appeals have been made against parking tickets issued for the Market Street car park in the last five years.

4. How many of those appeals were successful.

 

They should be obliged to provide the information under the FOI if excel are working on their behalf and they are taking a substantial cut of the proceeds.

[pin1onu]

Bawtry are part of the Doncaster Metropolitan Borough Concils (DMBC) who have a customer services office which deals with appeals for fixed penalty notices issued in the DMBC area, but NOT appeals for tickets issued in the Market Hill car park at Bawtry.

According to the website DMBC operate a DPE scheme. This begs the question why Excel are issuing tickets under 1984 Road Traffic Regs and not under the Traffic Management Act 2004?

 

It would also be useful to obtain the Traffic Regalation Order for the car park. The TRO will give details of restriction times, days and so forth. Some councils are very lax at keeping these up to date.

[lamma]

I agree re the TRO - ALWAYS a good idea to get it. I can think of a reason why they may be issuing under 1984 regs in an off-street car park (TMA mess up). Excel want their cash and the council can allocate revenue from off street parking in any way they like so this looks like a 'hot spot'. but lets see the paperwork please.

[patdavies]

Now I think about it i wonder if a Council can actually use a contractor to enforce when still using criminal system?

Not sure. 'Lamma' might know.

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RTRA 1984 S.63A(3) (b)

[Barnsley Boy]

Pat - erudite as always:

Relevant extract of RTRA 1984 attached [RTRA 1984 S.63A(3) (b)

Parking attendants.

— (1) A local authority may provide for the supervision of parking places within their area by individuals to be known as parking attendants.

 

(2) Parking attendants shall also have such other functions in relation to stationary vehicles as may be conferred by or under any other enactment.

 

(3) A parking attendant shall be—

(a)

an individual employed by the authority; or

 

(b)

where the authority have made arrangements with any person for the purposes of this section, an individual employed by that person to act as a parking attendant.

However, in this case, it may be that Excel have taken over wholesale management of the car park rather then just providing attendants acting as agents of the council. In this case would not RTRA S33(7) be more applicable. Relevant extract below.

33.

Additional powers of local authorities in connection with off-street parking places.

(7) A local authority shall have power to enter into arrangements with any person under which, in consideration of the payment by him to the authority of a lump sum, or of a series of lump sums, he is authorised to collect and retain the charges made in respect of the parking of vehicles in an off-street parking place provided by the authority under section 32 of this Act.

If this is indeed the case, would Excel also have delegated powers to enforce? I rather think not, but that is just my opinion, a far from expert one at that.

 

Full Act here, for those with the stamina - http://www.statutelaw.gov.uk/content.aspx?activeTextDocId=2223862

 

[lamma]

pat is a correct (as ever). thats the how but the why (use the 84 regs for this car park) has to be TMA related and the Waldron notes, or so I surmise. Always worth checking they filled the gaps created by TMA correctly.

[jeeves72]

Thanks for your help but it seems I don't permission to post attachments. The ECN stares - Bawtry Town Council (Market Place, Bawtry) Off Street Parking Places Order 2002. Failure to pay is an offence and will lead to legal prosecution under Section 35A of the Road Traffic Regulations Act 1984. The subsequent notice to owner has Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 under the Excel logo. States I was contravening paragraph 8(a) of the Bawtry Town Council (Market Place, Bawtry) Off Street Parking Places Order 2002. The letter then quotes 'it is an offence under section 35A of the RTRA 1984 to fail to pay the full excess charge etc.

Please note I was parked after the expiry of time.

[patdavies]

Thanks for your help but it seems I don't permission to post attachments. The ECN stares - Bawtry Town Council (Market Place, Bawtry) Off Street Parking Places Order 2002. Failure to pay is an offence and will lead to legal prosecution under Section 35A of the Road Traffic Regulations Act 1984. The subsequent notice to owner has Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 under the Excel logo. States I was contravening paragraph 8(a) of the Bawtry Town Council (Market Place, Bawtry) Off Street Parking Places Order 2002. The letter then quotes 'it is an offence under section 35A of the RTRA 1984 to fail to pay the full excess charge etc.

Please note I was parked after the expiry of time.

 

Are you sure that it is a Notice to Owner? I ask, because this is a specific term relating to PCNs - which are decriminalised parking and nothing to do with RTRA 1984.

 

Also, if you have a letter about an unpaid ECN, it must give you the opportunity to name the driver. ECNs and FPNs (non-DPE) are the responsibility of the driver, not the owner.

 

Can you scan. wash and post both the ECN and the NtO(?). Something smells not right here (unsurprising if it involves Excel and ther ilk)

 

AUIU. you must have made at least 5 posts before you can post attachments. Silly rule, but there you go,

[patdavies]

pat is a correct (as ever). thats the how but the why (use the 84 regs for this car park) has to be TMA related and the Waldron notes, or so I surmise. Always worth checking they filled the gaps created by TMA correctly.

 

The RTRA will be used if the Council is not yet authorised to operate a DPE regime. There is nothing sinister in this.

 

However, if the Council is DPE, then ECN's can no longer be used for parking regulation.