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    • If anybody has any advice here, it would be greatly appreciated, I already suffer with pre-existing disabilities & have struggled with this so far. 
    • so return of goods order etc etc read upload  scan pages to jpg, redact in mspaint. the convert to and merge to one mass PDF  read upload and use the online listed sites for all 3 stages. do you want to keep the car? i will guess this was a manual paper claimform direct from the co.court or was it org sent from salford bulk processing and has just got reaq ssigned?      
    • Speaking of the reformatory boys, here they are with all of their supporters, some of whom traveled with them from miles away, all carefully crammed together and photographed to look like there were more than about 80 .. rather like Farages last rally with even fewer people crammed around what looked like an ice cream van or mobile tea bar ... Although a number in the crowd apparently thought they were at a vintage car rally as they appeared to be chanting 'crank-her'. A vintage Bentley must be out of view.   Is this all there is? Its less than the Tory candidate. - shut up and smile while they get a camera angle that looks better
    • in order for us to help you we require the following information:- Which Court have you received the claim from ? Canterbury Name of the Claimant ? Moneybarn No 1   How many defendant's  joint or self ? One Date of issue –  29/05/24 Acknowledged by 14/06/24  Defence by 29/06/24  Particulars of Claim PARTICULARS OF CLAIM 1.  By a Conditional Sale Agreement in writing made on 25th August 2022. Between the Claimant and Defendant, the Claimant let to the Defendant on Conditional Sale. A Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi (200 P S) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200cc (Sep.2015) Registration No, ******* Chassis number ***************** (“The Vehicle”).  A copy of the agreement is attached  2.  The price of the goods was £15,995.00. The Initial Rental was £8500.00.  The total charge for credit was £3575.;17 And the balance of £11,070.17 was payable by 59 equal consecutive monthly instalments of £187 63. payable on the 25th of each month. 3.  The following were expressed conditions of the set agreement, Clause 8: Our Right to End this Agreement  8.1   Subject to sending you the notice as required by law, any of the following events will entitle us to end this Agreement: 8.1.2  You fail to pay the advance payment (if any) or any of the payments as specified on the front page of this agreement or any other sum payable under this Agreement. 8.1.3 If any of the information you have given us before entering into this Agreement or during the term of this Agreement was false 8.1.4 We consider, acting reasonably, that the goods may be in jeopardy or that our rights in the goods may otherwise be prejudiced. 8.1.5 If you die 8.1.6 If a bankruptcy petition is presented against you; if you petition for your own bankruptcy, or make a live arrangement with your creditors or call a meeting of them. 8. 1.7 If in Scotland, you become insolvent or sequestration or a receiver, judicial factor or trustee to be appointed over any of your estate, or effects or suffer an arrestment, charge attachment or other diligence to be issued or levied on any of your estate or effects or suffer any exercise, or threatened exercise of landlords hype hypothec 8.1.8 If you are a partnership, you are dissolved 8.1.9 If the goods are destroyed, lost, stolen and/or treated by the insurer as a total loss in response to an insurance claim. 8.1.10 If we reasonably believe any payment made to us in respect of this Agreement is a proceed of crime. 8.1.11 If steps are taken by us to terminate any other agreement which you have entered into with us. Clause 9.  Effect of Us Terminating Agreement 9.1 If this Agreement terminates under clause 8 the following will apply 9.1.1 Subject to the rights given to you by law, you will no longer be entitled to possession of the goods and must return them to us to an address as we may reasonably specify, (removing or commencing the removal of any cherished plates) together with a V5 registration certificate, both sets of keys and a service record book. If you are unable or unwilling to return the goods to us then we shall collect the goods and we'll charge you in accordance with clause 10.3 9.1.2 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you for all payments and all other sums do under this agreement at the date of termination 9.1.3 We will sell the goods or public sale at the earliest opportunity once the goods are in a reasonable condition which includes a return of the items listed in clause 7.1.4 9.1.4 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you of the rest of the Total Amount Payable under this agreement less: ( a) A rebate for early settlement ias required by law which will be calculated and notified to you at the time of payment (b) The proceeds of sale of the goods (if any) after deduction of all costs associated with finding you and/or the goods, recovery, refurbishment and repair. Insurance, storage, sale, agents fees, cherished plate removal, replacement keys, costs associated with obtaining service history for the goods and in relation to obtaining a duplicate V5 registration certificate 4, The following are particulars required by Civil Procedure Rules. Rule 7.9 as set out in 7.1 and 7.2 of the associated Practice Direction entitled Hire Purchase Claims:- a)     The agreement is dated 25 August 2022. And is between Moneybarn No1 Limited  and xxxxxxxxx under agreement  number xxxxxx. b)    The claimant was one of the original parties to the agreement. c)    The agreement is regulated under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. d)    The goods claimed Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi ( 200 PS) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200 cc (Sep2015} Registration No ^^^^^^^ Chassis number ***************** e)     The total price of the goods £19570 f)     The paid up sum £1206 5 g)    The unpaid balance of the total price £7505 (to include charges) h)    A default notice was sent to the defendant on 20th February 2024 by First class post i)      The date when the right to demand delivery of the goods accrued 14 March 2024 j)      The amount if any claimed as an alternative to delivery of the goods 7505 22 include charges 5.  At the date of service of the notice the instalments were £562.89 in arrears. 6. By reason of the Termination of the Agreement by the notice, defendant became liable to pay the sum of £7502 7. The date of maturity the agreement is 24th August 2027. 8. Further or alternative by reasons of  the Defendant breaches of the agreement by failing to pay the said instalments, the Defendant evinced an intention no longer to be bound by the Agreement and repudiated it by the said Notice the claimant accepted that repudiation 9. By reason of such repudiation the claimant has suffered loss and damage. Total amount payable £19570 Less sum paid or in arrears by the date of repudiation £12064 97 Balance £7505 (to include charges.) ( The claimant will give credit if necessary for the value of the vehicle if recovered.)  The claimant therefore claims 1.    An order for delivery up of the vehicle 2.    The MoneyClaim to be adjourned generally with liberty to restore,  Upon restoration of the MoneyClaim following return or loss of the vehicle. the Claimant will ensure the pre action protocol for debt claims is followed. 3.    Pursuant to s 90 (1)  of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. An order that the Claimant and/or its agents may enter any premises in which the vehicle is situated in order to recover the vehicle should it not be returned by the Defendant 4.    further or alternatively damages 5.    costs Statement of truth The Claimant believes that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true. The Claimant understands that the proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes or causes to be made a false statement in the document for verified by statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. I am duly Authorised by the Claimant to sign these Particulars of Claim signed Dated 17th of April 2024  What is the total value of the claim? 7502   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? No   Never heard of this   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? n/a Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? No   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After  Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? In a garage  Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes  Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Original Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? n/a   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? They said sent but nor received   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? None seen   Why did you cease payments? Still Paying,   What was the date of your last payment? Yesterday  31st May 2024   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? Yes on 12 Feb 2024   What you need to do now.   Can't scan, will do via another means as you cant have jpg  
    • Now that is an interesting article which adds afew perspective that I hadn't thought significant - but on reflection of the perspectives offered ... Now Starmer is no Blair, however 'blairite he may be perceived, but the Tories aren't tories and aren't even remotely liberal   The fast 'unannounced and unexpected election call from sunack may well be explained by the opinion linked that he hoped reform would be unprepared and effectively call a chunk of Farages largely empty bluster - making him look even more of a prat, leave scope for attacks on shabby reform candidates and mimimise core vote losses to reform - while throwing the 'middle ground' (relative) tories TO THE DOGS - and with the added bonus of likely pacifying his missu' desire to jogg off to sunny cal tout suite somewhat   thumb in the air - I expect about 140ish tory seats, but can hope for under a hundred Reform - got to admit the outside possibility of 1, maybe 2 seats with about 8% of the vote - but unlikely. I think projections of over 10% of the vote for reform is nudged and paid for speculation - but possible with the expected massive drives from Russian, Chinese and far right social media bot and troll prods targeting the gullible.
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      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

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Help 48 xxx versus Capital One


Help48xxx
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Oooo...sounds like fun ahead for me then CitB!

 

I have MAJOR issues with the PPI side of things for many reasons which I will make clear later..(you never knows who's watching :rolleyes:).

 

What a shambles!. But what a joy to be confident in telling them how they are failing to do their jobs :D

 

xx

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Help, I worry that you are starting to enjoy this far too much :-D Hope you are well.

 

Mockenrue, it most certainly is.

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Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Today, received the terms and conditions of the insurance. Across the front page there was a handwritten note advising that this was "sold over the internet on 20/08/03". Erm.. no it wasnt. Apart from the fact that we didnt get hooked up to the internet until 2005. OH wouldnt know how to apply for anything online and the account itself was set up on 09/07/03 :confused: Have written back asking them to provide a copy of the internet request. Now this should be very interesting. :D And.. why would he apply for a card using the mailer application form and then go online to order the PPI separately in the first instance ??.

 

Just thought you might like to know what you are in for. :p

 

Don't like to worry you, but when I asked for proof that I'd ticked the box on the internet - they sent me a screenshot of the internet application with the box ticked.

 

Not sure if they could "fiddle" this on their system or not.

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Sounds like pulling teeth citizenB! Thankfully I didn't take out the 'compulsory' PPI.

 

My next hurdle will be trying to claim back all the charges from Cap1 even though I've defaulted and been passed to CapQuest.

 

I was defaulted and passed to Debitas. Didn't bother with CCA at all, just went straight to Crap One with prelim, LBA etc. Got their standard bog off stuff. Filed at court and got the full amount, plus stacks of interest, plus stat8%. About 3 months start to finish.

 

Plus once you've sent the Prelim etc the account will be indispute so they won't be able to set the DCA hounds on you.

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Across the front page there was a handwritten note advising that this was "sold over the internet on 20/08/03". Erm.. no it wasnt. Apart from the fact that we didnt get hooked up to the internet until 2005. OH wouldnt know how to apply for anything online and the account itself was set up on 09/07/03 :confused: Have written back asking them to provide a copy of the internet request. Now this should be very interesting. :D And.. why would he apply for a card using the mailer application form and then go online to order the PPI separately in the first instance ??.

 

 

Don't like to worry you, but when I asked for proof that I'd ticked the box on the internet - they sent me a screenshot of the internet application with the box ticked.

 

Not sure if they could "fiddle" this on their system or not.

 

Wendy, we didnt even have a computer, let alone internet until late 2004/early 2005. Neither did we have access to .

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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I got a response to my SAR today...sent by registered mail!

 

It's pretty much as you said it would be CitB...years of statements with a list of terms used in the data.

 

So...most of what I requested isn't there, and there's no explanation as to why. I'm going to have to dust off my varifocals and trawl through what they have provided, (trying my best to understand it), and send a list of outstanding documentation. Deep joy!

 

xx

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I got a response to my S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) today...sent by registered mail!

 

It's pretty much as you said it would be CitB...years of statements with a list of terms used in the data.

 

So...most of what I requested isn't there, and there's no explanation as to why. I'm going to have to dust off my varifocals and trawl through what they have provided, (trying my best to understand it), and send a list of outstanding documentation. Deep joy!

 

xx

 

Well there is nought on the tv tonight, so it will give you something to do :-D

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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would appreciate seeing your letter / response of what's missing as I really do not understand what I asked for in mine to be honest!

 

They sent me their third attempt - yet again statements and some print screen captures of 'something'! Nothing else. Need to let FOS and ICO know technical response!! :roll:

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Hi willtheywontthey,

 

I've started trawling but it's so far short of what I requested that I'm going to use a copy of my original request and highlight the one's they have sent, (as there are far less of them), then request the ones they ignored, (sorry...I did of course mean overlooked ;)).

 

That will have to wait until the weekend as I've gone bug eyed just trying to read the stupid screen print outs they've sent.

 

I'd be inclined to ask CitB as she seems to have some pretty great templates.

 

xx

Edited by Help48xxx
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Hi folks,

 

I need some help here.

 

I've had a look through the paperwork and have listed all the account charges since 2001. They range from £18.00 - £98.00. I took the card out in 1997 but only have credit limit and balance info from 1999 until 2001. The details from 2001 are more detailed, (transactions etc).

 

So, I need to know what to do with this information about the charges. How do I go about deciding if I can claim them back or if it's best not to whilst I'm in dispute about the CCA?

 

This is the furthest I've got with any of my creditors, so I need a bit of a tutorial in how to deal with information provided.

 

xx

Edited by Help48xxx
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Hi Help, this is something I am a bit confused about as well. If the validity of the CCA is being disputed as a whole, is it right to claim back charges?. Because to my thinking, if you ask for the charges back you are admitting the debt.

 

However, if the charges are more than the outstanding debt could that be a way forward.

 

Sorry not to be able to help on this one. :(

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Its either CCA- unenforceable, or claim the charges back. Not both.

 

I think it can be both. The issue boils down to two main issues:

 

(1) Did they ever set up the Agreement correctly.

 

(2) Have they added Unlawful Charges.

 

The issue of admitting a Debt should be removed from the equation. The Statements all prove that money went to and from Help48xxx, so that is not doubted, but does not affect the issue.

 

This was an Agreement that was Regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (CCA-1974).

 

There is ample and binding Case Law that confirms that any surplus of funds paid to the Consumer have to be regarded as a Gift from the Original Creditor (OC) if the OC neglected to set up a properly executed Regulated Credit Agreement (and complied with any Cancellation Rights requirements and Copy Agreement despatch timescales etc).

 

In effect, they are required to get the paperwork right at the very outset. That is mainly all they have to get right. After that, it's just Account Management and sending Statements. Then lawful Default/Termination and possible Enforcement if it all goes pear shaped for them.

 

The OC, we have to assume, was a large and sophisticated financial institution, with an Army of Lawyers whose sole task was to get the paperwork right. The CCA-1974 requires nothing less.

 

They were holding all the Aces when Help48xxx first went near them. It was their Agreement and it was on their Terms. But the Agreement was nevertheless Regulated by the CCA-1974.

 

Now that it has gone sideways for them, the Agreement is absolutely vital for them. If their Army of Lawyers messed up, then there may not be an Agreement that can Enforce the Debt. If they can't Enforce because there is no Agreement worth squat to Enforce, then what we have is a Gift, not a Debt.

 

No Agreement = Gift to Help48xxx.

 

No Agreement = No Right to Default.

 

No Agreement = No Agreement to Terminate.

 

No Agreement = Nothing to Enforce.

 

No Agreement = No Consent to Share Data.

 

Now, if that is the case, then what we have are records of Gifts flowing to Help48xxx and Payments back from Help48xxx to the OC.

 

In my opinion, if Help48xxx has paid back more than the Gifts, then Help48xxx should ask for the difference back.

 

This does not mean asking for the Interest back, as the Interest is of no interest (forgive the pun), as the OC never had a right to charge it anyway.

 

What Help48xxx is asking for back is the excess of Payments over the Gift of funds.

 

Unlawful Charges can be combined with the above request, depending on whether these are greater or lesser than the excess of Payments made by Help48xxx to the OC.

 

I must stress that none of this has been tried yet, but if you follow my reasoning, I think it is quite valid.

 

However, if Help48xxx wanted to go ahead and claim for the Unlawful Charges, that too should be fine. All Help48xxx is doing is asking for Unlawful Charges back based on the Account Statements.

 

This request does not admit any Debt.

 

The argument about the Agreement can carry on, and if they cannot produce one, then Help48xxx can either walk away safe in the knowledge that the OC were silly to make a Gift, or Help48xxx can ask for any surplus back that went above the Refund of Unlawful Charges.

 

The bottom line has to be, if they failed to create a binding Agreement at the very outset, one that completely satisfied the requirements of the CCA-1974, then there can be no Debt. There is nothing to Enforce.

 

I appreciate they will sell this on to a DCA, and there will be lots of moaning and bitching from the OC. But it is entirely their own fault.

 

OK...if they produce a binding Agreement, and can bring the Original Copy of that to Court. Then there is a Debt and it's to be expected that they will seek to Enforce that. In that case, Help48xxx has a battle on, and the tactic has to be either re-claim Charges now, or hold that back as a Counter-Claim should the OC decide to go to Court to Enforce.

 

As always, this is my own interpretation. Please discuss rather than act on anything I have said.

 

Cheers,

BRW

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I follow your reasoning - I think!. As you say though, that hasn't been tried and tested in court yet. Maybe if and when it is we will have a clearer idea, but until someone does, and a precedent is set, we won't know. And that depends on someone having the bottle (and the funds) to take it all the way.

 

I think it boils down to this:-

 

How much is the debt to Crap One? and Would reclaim of charges wipe the debt out/reduce it significantly?

Because you have to remember that if the balance is made up of charges, then Help48 won't get the money refunded to him, as he hasn't actually paid them in the first place if they are still an outstanding balance.

 

And even if they can't produce an enforcable agreement, it doesn't mean the debt will go away, it will just lurk around and get passed from DCA to DCA, it won't stop them chasing it every now and then, which will mean more hassle from various DCAs and it will never go away. Thats why I think a charges reclaim, get rid of it once and for all, pay off what is legitimately owed, and it's one less thing to worry about.

 

I also think that using CCA to get out of paying what you correctly owe is a cop out and morally wrong. I am not in any way suggesting that's what's happening here.

 

Just my opinion.

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BRW, I would have tipped your scales, but apparently I have to spread some around.

 

Wendy, Help48 is a "she" :)

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

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Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Hello WendyB!

 

And that depends on someone having the bottle (and the funds) to take it all the way.

 

It may not be such a hard one to fight and argue, as it would not be asking for Interest back, which is the main thing the bankers would fly off the handle about.

 

All that is being asked for is the excess of Payments over Spending on the Unenforceable non-Account.

 

Just to quote one of my own Cards as an example, the bankers say I owe them around 20k. However, over the 10 or so Years that I have had the Card, I have spent in total around 72k. But I have also re-paid them over 78k.

 

So, I've Paid around 5k more than I have ever Spent (just making it simple by saying 5k, the actual is between 5k and 6k).

 

The sum Total of all Interest and all Charges comes to around 25k.

 

Take the 5k I have over-paid off that and we get the 20k they say I now owe.

 

However, what if, as seems to be the case, there is no valid Agreement? The bankers messed up. They failed to do the one thing they needed to get right. The one thing they had an Army of Lawyers to help them get right.

 

So, now I have a banker wanting 20k, who is potentially up a creek and without a paddle. I can't tell, as they seem reluctant to show me the Agreement.

 

I could walk away and just call it a day. But they have not ceased in their Telephone and Letter Writing Harassment, despite their abject failure to produce the very document I have asked for to prove I am required to Pay them the 20k of Charges that they say I owe.

 

Some of those Charges are Unlawful, and much of the Interest is Penalty Interest, far above anything that can be considered reasonable. Although I regret it is within the Law. 35% is not, sadly, a crime, although it ought to be.

 

If you see where I am heading with this, morals do not come into it. I'm not seeking to get out of paying anything other than Unenforceable Charges, Unlawful Charges, Unenforceable Interest and Unenforceable Penalty Interest.

 

But my case is really quite simple. Just give me back the excess I paid over what I spent, and all the rest is their problem.

 

If, as I suspect, Help48xxx is in a similar position, then she may find the whole argument boils down to Payments v Spending. How to play that then depends on the Agreement, or lack of it, and if Spending is higher than Payments or vice versa.

 

I fear this is very simplistic, but sometimes cutting through all of the banking hot air and bumf can bring some clarity back into things.

 

I do fully agree that this will not go away unless something is Paid, or unless something is Claimed to wipe out what they say is owed.

 

One option is for Help48xxx to just resign herself to maybe 6 Years of hassle, and after that it's Statute Barred anyway, end of story. But in that time, CapOne and any DCAs following on, may litter Help48xxx's Credit (Debt) Files with unlawful Defaults and malicious adverse Data, and thus cause on-going problems with day to day finance and general banking.

 

The only defence there is to keep writing Letters and Complaints, and build up any Harassment evidence for Claims or Counter-Claims.

 

This is the sad fact, the bankers are not nice people, and you soon realise that when you cross them. They get very hissy, very quickly.

 

It takes mind-numbing stupidity to be unable to make money in a Business that can create money. 97% of all money in circulation within the UK has been created by Building Societies and bankers, only 3% was created by the Bank of England as Coins and Notes.

 

That's 97% number-money...created by the same people who are now moaning about how difficult life is for them in this Financial Mess of their own making.

 

Cheers,

BRW

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Hi CitB,

 

to be honest, I'd just be happy to get the debt written off or whatever they do. I do however think I should go after the PPI fees as they refused to let me cancel it and the charges, (without interest) amount to more than half the debt! So that's something I think that I should check out, if only as a matter of principle.

 

xx

 

xx

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Sorry guys & gals but my post got caught up in all this fantastic info', and so was delayed.

 

Yep Wendy, as CitB mentioned I'm female. As such, I'm am going to take an hormonal break and resume when my brain decides it knows how to function properly

 

xx

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Hi CitB,

 

to be honest, I'd just be happy to get the debt written off or whatever they do. I do however think I should go after the PPI fees as they refused to let me cancel it and the charges, (without interest) amount to more than half the debt! So that's something I think that I should check out, if only as a matter of principle.

 

xx

 

xx

 

I agree with you on this one. I read on text the other day that the FSA are going to have another "go" at Financial institutions that have sold this inappropriately, so definitely push to get this money repaid.. once you have added the interest on, then that is most of the debt removed :p

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1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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  • 2 weeks later...

I got a HUGE letter from Capquest. It had all the same documents as I got from Cap1 in response to my S.A.R - (Subject Access Request). So, either it's a total coincidence that they both sent the exact same amount of documents, or they're both ignoring the specific requests I made. I won't bother with Capcreeps, I'll bounce it all back to Cap1.

 

xx

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