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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Credit Crunch - What now?


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I opened the letters and I have finally added everything up, see below for the specifics. My total unsecured debt is £73k and my net monthly income is £3k. After taking all the priority payments and being really tight on miscellaneous expenses I have £400 pm. Effectively 0.6% for each creditor and the accounts cleared in a little under 14 years. No wonder I cannot sleep at night and what makes it worse is that my wife has no idea. Think she will leave me and take the kids if she finds out. So all seeming quite grim.

 

Is there anything I can do initially to delay the collection process or should I just start by trying to get them to accept reduced payments?

 

Worst of all this is the need to travel with my job and claim the expenses back. Getting overseas with no money and no credit card is major problem as the card I was managing to keep going has, following a payment of £6k, reduced my limit to just a few pounds above the outstanding balance of £175.00. Have seen a pre payment credit card but as always they take a cut on every transaction. If my employer finds out about this situation then I will no doubt get fired!

 

Any guidance from you guys would be so very much appreciated on where to start or the best strategy.

 

Can anyone beat me on this figure because if they can perhaps I will feel a little better! Not sure I will sleep any better tonight but at least I have faced the music. As to how did this happen? Well perhaps a story for another time which involves the death of a child and trying to buy happiness again.

 

Thanks

 

Virgin (MBNA) 4,826

Next 500

Nationwide 3,415

Mint (Royal Bank of Scotland) 2,641

Marbles 977

 

Lloyds TSB Credit Card 13,475

Lloyds TSB Loan 1,577

Lloyds TSB Overdraft 6,006

Lloyds TSB Overdraft 982

Lloyds TSB Overdraft 188

 

John Lewis 422

Halifax 9,725

Egg Money Account 8,842

Egg Loan 3,011

Egg Credit Card 8,486

Cahoot Flexible Loan 7,545

Cahoot Credit Card 539

 

Total £73,157

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Hi

 

I cant beat your 73k but i do know what 44k feels like and I know how much that hurt. I too kept it away from my wife and kids but they found out eventually. Yes there were lots of tears to start but it has made our family closer now than we ever were.

 

I'm working on my debts and now have them down to 28k so still a long way to go.

 

As far as foriegn travel goes etc, could your company not issue you with a company credit card to cover your expenses?

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Hi, Mrs Z here, if it makes you feel any better, we are over 90k in debt albeit unsecured.

 

What I will say to you is this ; you should not keep it from your wife.

 

When my DH put me in the "whole" picture as to just how much debt we were in I felt sick as a parrot. TBH, deep down I knew our finances were a mess and that in a matter of time it would become unmanageable, but I had stupidly buried my head in the sand for a good while leading up to the inevitable.

 

As a team, you and your wife can work it out I'm sure. I know how Mr Z felt when we finally had the discussion, he said the relief at us both sitting down and talking about it and our plans for our way forward was unbelievable.

 

As much as it scared me, I came to realise that the financial burden was the both of ours and not just for him to cope with. Our debts built up through trying to maintain living whilst our business was just not working out, certainly not for luxuries.

 

I truly hope that you and your wife can sit down and talk and plan your own way forward and I wish you the best of luck :)

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Oh well if thats the case, a debt halfed (joint) a positive to everything IMHO.A Mrs Z states "I came to realise that the financial burden was the both of ours and not just for him to cope with"

 

 

Regards

 

Andy

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The thing is, this is an awful burden for you to have to carry on your own. Are you sure that you won't be able to talk with her? I don't know your personal circumstances of course, but at some point you may find it difficult to hide it from her.

 

I know how awful I felt when DH informed me of the extent of our debt, because secretly I knew it couldn't go on, so in a way it was a relief for me too that it was now in the open so to speak.

 

Please think about it, your wife may be more understanding than you think.

 

Good luck with whatever you decide to do :)

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Have to agree with Mr/Mrs Z

 

Please try and talk to your other half.

 

I am not saying it will make things better if you own up, but it is much better to do that than worrying about them finding out of their own accord.

 

I've found out the hard way that there is nothing worse than a friendship ruined because of an undisclosed debt.:(

 

Please try and talk to them about it

 

GOOD LUCK :)

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For everyone with massive debts - you need to talk to someone/partner. You shouldn't try and cope with the stress and burden of this debt alone.

I understand how easy it is to run up debt and feel for you.

 

Not that I have a clue about things but I guess you've all looked a bankruptcy seriously? Failing that start listing all your assets and other possible things you could sell/down grade to raise some cash.

I always laughed at that programme "How to pay off your mortgage in 2yrs" the answer was always set up a successful business and pay yourself loads - if only!

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hi dash have you taslked with national debtline on 0808 808 4000 to see what are u options towards your debt?

 

i am bankrupt since 2 month agos myu OH and me we owed about 50 K not counting any interest ... although it is quite extreme but i have no regret of doing it i will be no longer liable to any of our debt in 10 month time .

i was mainly silly i took on a lot of loan and credit card store card etc ... ... because it was easy spending and i had never though of how i will repay them. then the fun began, phone call constantly every day , letter demanding this and that , the threat of bailiff ...

 

to be honest one day i had enough of all this crxp. my wages was only covering the repayment and as such i incure a lot of rental arrear ! i never had enough money to buy food etc... i went to court declared myself BR and now i begin to be much more happier than i was ever .

 

owing money is not a crime ! we all have made mistake at some point.

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Hi Dash

 

I was in same boat and was forced into other half finding out when I started new job and missed the postman every day. I am sure many of you what thats like!

 

Anyway, long and short of it is that my wife was surprisingly good about it, disappointed but supportive. It has helped as I can actually deal with things rather than concentrating on hiding things.

 

As for prepaid debit/credit cards; I run a Tuxedo card with a £4.99 monthly payment on, this gives me commission free purchasing here and abroad. It also has great exchange rates if you are abroad so you could tell your employer it saves them money! They could give one to all staff.

 

Can't see your employer firing you for oweing money, unless your job is in the financial sector.

 

Good luck

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Hi Dashforcash....

 

I opened the letters and I have finally added everything up, see below for the specifics. My total unsecured debt is £73k and my net monthly income is £3k. After taking all the priority payments and being really tight on miscellaneous expenses I have £400 pm. Effectively 0.6% for each creditor and the accounts cleared in a little under 14 years. No wonder I cannot sleep at night and what makes it worse is that my wife has no idea. Think she will leave me and take the kids if she finds out. So all seeming quite grim.

 

Seems overwhelming, huh? There's a few points right away here - and please don't think I'm being in any way judgmental - just trying to point you to a few things we ALL end up having to consider IRO debts.....

 

First up - it doesn't matter HOW you got the debt you did - but you need to have a SERIOUS look at WHY. Is this all realted to work travelling? Or is it a lifestyle thing? Do you or your partner just spend for the hell of it if you want something, or something else - what's the reason behind all this debt - you need to answer yourself honestly.

 

Second up - one way or another, your partner has some responsibility in this - she's either helped run up the debt, or hasn't helped by being aware of how much you're spending - does she have an income? Expensive habits? Again, be honest with yourself. I find it hard to imagine that a partner who loves you would just quit on you - it isn't an uncommon situation to be in debt.

 

Third up - you're earning around £100k per annum, and presumably your house is bought (mortgaged?) - you need to be taking steps to make sure that's as safe as possible - or perhaps put on the market for a cheaper property......

 

Is there anything I can do initially to delay the collection process or should I just start by trying to get them to accept reduced payments?

 

Delaying dealing with this won't help you. There are letter templates on here which will allow you to make contact with all your creditors, and ask them to consider your cirumstances. Right now, most of them will want to get *something* from you, rather than nothing.

 

Have you requested copies of your credit reference files yet? If not do so right away just to be sure you know exactly what your creditors already do.

 

You need to look at the possibility of claiming back any charges and interest you can from some of these accounts - this may, ultimately reduce some of these debts, and in any case, may put further charges on hold.

 

The other thing you need to do fast, is open a new "parachute" bank account - withOUT an overdraft, and have your salary paid into that, along with direct debits, or SOs for all your essential outgoings - e.g. council tax, mortgage, energy, and whatever it takes to keep the roof over your head.

 

I would SERIOUSLY be looking at closing ALL of these accounts, getting the balances frozen, and then challenged before anything else.

 

Worst of all this is the need to travel with my job and claim the expenses back. Getting overseas with no money and no credit card is major problem as the card I was managing to keep going has, following a payment of £6k, reduced my limit to just a few pounds above the outstanding balance of £175.00. Have seen a pre payment credit card but as always they take a cut on every transaction. If my employer finds out about this situation then I will no doubt get fired!

 

Unless you are in some very specific employment, your employer CANNOT fire you for being in debt - that is discriminatory, and probably against the law, in most cases.

 

Your employer CANNOT force you to meet expenses out of your own pocket and then claim them back as part of your job conditions - your job, unless specifically agreed - is NOT to fund your employer's business, which is what that is.

 

How long are you expected to sit out expenses once you've paid them? Does your employer have an HR rep you can talk to in confidence?

 

Any guidance from you guys would be so very much appreciated on where to start or the best strategy.

 

No expert, but honestly - talk to your partner, then to your employer, and get a stop put on ALL of those accounts right away (and the balances frozen if you can). And put a plan together that reduces as many non essential outgoings as possible....

 

Can anyone beat me on this figure because if they can perhaps I will feel a little better! Not sure I will sleep any better tonight but at least I have faced the music. As to how did this happen? Well perhaps a story for another time which involves the death of a child and trying to buy happiness again.

 

My friend, you will find oodles of help here - if I can chance an honest comment - have you (and your partner) sought any form of counselling for this bit? Sounds like it might help.......for yours and your partner's (and children's) sakes.......

 

You've made a good start - now you need to keep talking (don't feel on your own) and start doing something positive about it.......

 

I'm sure from my own experience so far, that you'll find a LOT of help here.

 

Good Luck....

 

Thanks

 

Virgin (MBNA) 4,826

Next 500

Nationwide 3,415

Mint (Royal Bank of Scotland) 2,641

Marbles 977

 

Lloyds TSB Credit Card 13,475

Lloyds TSB Loan 1,577

Lloyds TSB Overdraft 6,006

Lloyds TSB Overdraft 982

Lloyds TSB Overdraft 188

 

John Lewis 422

Halifax 9,725

Egg Money Account 8,842

Egg Loan 3,011

Egg Credit Card 8,486

Cahoot Flexible Loan 7,545

Cahoot Credit Card 539

 

Total £73,157

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  • 3 weeks later...

About 20 months ago I got a wake up call - Cahoot jacked up the interest they were charging on their flexible loans - it was the straw that broke this particular camels back. I totted up the total amount of money I owed and reeled - it was £93k. Then I called the CCCS - found their details on the BBC web site. It was perhaps the most productive phone call I have ever made, when I put the receiver down I knew how I was going to get myself out of the mess. The CCCS sent me a pack - including template letters, that I used to contact my creditors and in January 2007 my debt management plan was up and running.

 

My net pay is similar to yours and my total debt is now just under £69k - I'll be clear in about another 3 years. My creditors have all accepted the DMP and with the exception of MBNA have frozen all interest. Egg and Cahoot were the most co-operative, Northern Rock were initially the most challenging but after about 8 months accepted my plan.

 

My other half knew that I owed a lot of money but not the amount, I think that over the years he despaired over my carelessness with money but he certainly enjoyed the life too - I put our 2 boys through private schools and whilst we do not have a flash executive house its a roomy old pre-war semi in a very nice part of town.

 

I would really recommend that you contact Payplan, CCCS or National Debtline - I of course prefer CCCS. Not once have I been judged - which did surprise me, these people deal with facts - they are what they are. They will give you that bit of 'moral' that gets you over the first hurdle. Then you can put a plan together, with a plan in place you'll be taking control again, it feels good.

 

I too travel extensively by the way, sometimes I'm away for 12 weeks at a stretch, I have an Amex Corporate card - its a debit card but I can withdraw as much cash as I need on it. All business expenses are reimbursed through our expense accounting and so long as I keep up to speed with reporting them I am always able to pay the account in full each month

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