Urgent advice needed - wages

[Dipply75]

Hey animal lover, they really make this like swimming through mud don't they.

 

I would back yourself up right now by sending a letter clearly stating your position and a few facts - to get things moving and just to get it on record. State

 

You have expressed your wish to go to the formal grievance procedure as you have tried to sort this informally for months now. You therefore see no point in meeting with the branch that a: caused all the problems and b: the branch that have had every opportunity and failed to sort this informally for X amount of months now - you have been more than patient!

 

You are not well enough to visit the branch for a meeting to argue your case again. You did not attend the first two meetings as they did not give you enough time to sort arrange your rep. You are also waiting for that same rep to deal with the other letter (state date of letter), to speak with Head Office for you and the outcome of this.

 

You want Head Office to start the formal grievance procedure for these reasons and can they advise on the company procedure you are to follow.

 

That way you avoid all the 'he said, she said' accusations later about not going to meetings etc - that is dealt with and on record. This is just my opinion - back yourself up in writing clearly stating the current position as you see it, giving them a chance to respond if need be.

 

It also puts you back in control and puts the next step on them as your rep seems to come and go a bit.

 

What do you think? Must say, you sound much calmer and stronger today!

Edited September 29, 2008 by Dipply75
oopsed

[animal_lover]

Yep Thanks i'll send that as i wouldn't be suprised if they turned around and made up a load of lies about it so it would definately better having it on the record. Recorded Delivery also.

 

I feel stronger i'm not sure about calmer lol, the more i think about it and the situation i'm in the more angry i get and the more i wanna take it out on them

 

But i suppose one good thing has come out of it, when i feel better i'm gonna enroll back to college to do a course in Accounting/Admin it's something i've always wanted to do and after all the bad experiences i've had in retail i think it will be pretty stupid to go back there knowing i'm never gonna enjoy it like i used to.

 

Thanks for the letter

 

AL

[animal_lover]

My Union Rep has just rang me and he's set up a meeting with "work" for this Friday morning when i didn't ask him to. Last time we spoke i said i wanted to go straight to the formal grievance as it's been going on long enough.

He said he would ring the lady at Head Office who is supposed to be doing the investigation but it appears he didn't and he said will get it sorted out on Friday.

I really don't wanna go just the thought is stressing me out, Is there any way i can get out of it.

Judging by the fact they haven't given up yet after all the problems with the previous meeting etc. It makes me wonder why.

 

AL

Edited September 29, 2008 by animal_lover
posted before finishing

[Dipply75]

Strange, could it be that they know what they've done and now want to settle it asap quietly before it goes all official?

 

The other thing I think you need clarified, and definitely in writing, is...have you actually been sacked? You certainly did not actually resign yet you have had a P45 through....you need to know what has been recorded about your leaving in their records and where that info came from (did that manager that sent you that letter confirming your supposed resignation tell head office you did resign?)

 

I think you should get back to the CAB if you can and see if someone can represent you, it is unfair to expect you to be able to handle all this just now.

[animal_lover]

My Union Rep says he's com9ing in with me but yet he said he doesn't need to till it gets to the formal grievance.

 

I don't even now if i want him there now as doesn't seem to be in my corner very much.

 

Do you think i should/need to go?

 

What questions do you think i should ask?

 

Thanks AL

[Dipply75]

Am not sure if you need to go, can ACAS advise? Who is the meeting with at the branch, is it a manager and have you had problems with them at all?

 

As for a list of questions, the easiest thing to do is sit with a cuppa and write a list of all the things they have done wrong/to cheese you off/ to upset you. From that list you can then go through it one by one and note what you want explanations for/answers to or action taken about.

 

Off the top of my head -

why weren't you paid properly in the first place

why would no-one sort it once you reported it

why this long has passed and it is still not resolved

why did you receive a P45, have you been sacked - with no notice , warning or reason? You did not resign, did someone say you did and do they have proof?

why were you pressured into working whilst signed off by a doctor?

Have their staff had ANY training on equalities or disability rights in the workplace, and if so why have you been treated in this manner?

 

I could go on all night after their carry on lol - its been one of those days and am right in the mood - if I could I would pop down and go with you! God, they've annoyed me so I understand how angry it has been getting you. It really will do you good standing up to them though and making them respect you and your rights, then you can get on with your life : )

[animal_lover]

Hi, I didn't get chance to ring ACAS today but i will ring tomorrow and ask them if i need to go, The meeting is with either the Assistant Manager (who i told i was thinking of handing in my resignation) or the Personnel Manager (who i've sort of had problems with the last time i was off in May to July this year she told me i had to come back otherwise they would sack me and i still had a week left on my Sick Note).

 

I wish you could come with me aswell i'd feel a hell of a lot better about it, Should i still send the letter about the problems with the meetings and add for them to clarify why i recieved my P45. So it's still on record.

 

I also haven't heard from head office since they told me they were investigating my complaint so i'm gonna ring them tomorrow for an update.

 

AL

Edited September 30, 2008 by animal_lover
Hadn't finished typing before it posted

[Dipply75]

Yes I would still send that letter. It puts the onus on them to reply with some answers, or at least deal with it. If they just ignore it you have even more proof they haven't bothered their backsides. The P45 is a cracker - not only could they have essentially sacked you while signed off sick, they gave no warning, no notice or no reason. i remember a few posts back there was talk of sending a letter stating you DID NOT resign - can't remember (sorry!), did you send that?

 

When you speak with ACAS tell them that they are trying to arrange meetings with the same branch management that you have had some of the issues with. I should hope that alone would be reason to cancel the meeting - how can you be expected to complain to one of the people you are complaining about?! Have a look at the Employment Tribunal website too, i am sure they have rules about that sort of situation.

 

It is such a scary thing to do, to go in t o argue with them. You certainly need a witness (or a tape recorder!) with you , I would try and get a welfare rights officer or some advocate to be with you....someone who can help represent you. Can the CAB maybe recommend someone in disability rights in your area?

 

You keep your chin up, they are probably gobsmacked at your fighting back! Just you show them you will not be treated like that, you are better than that ; )

 

OH, just thought - you could ask head office what is the purpose of the branch meeting if Head Office are already investigating the complaint?

Edited September 30, 2008 by Dipply75
had another thought

[animal_lover]

Hi,

 

Yep I did I sent the letter to both Head Office and my store. I sent it to my store later than they asked as they only give me two days to think about it and get back to them. I've kept the letter they sent and it doesn't say anything about what could/would happen if i didn't send it back by that date.

 

I'll have alook into that and ask ACAS tomorrow to make sure.

 

I'll ask the CAB tomorrow if someone can some in with me but my Union Rep is supposed to be meeting me there and i really don't want him to be as he seems to be helping my work more than me.

 

I'll ring Head Office tomorrow also as i wanted to ring them for an update anyway.

 

I have so much to do tomorrow it's unreal i've got to be up at 8.30 and i'm know where near getting everything ready.

Edited September 30, 2008 by animal_lover
Typo error

[animal_lover]

I just wanted to make sure this was ok before i posted it

 

Dear Sirs,

 

I have already expressed my wish to go straight to the formal grievance procedure as I’ve tried to sort this informally for months now. I therefore see no point in attending an informal meeting with the branch that a: caused all the problems to begin with and b: the branch that have had every opportunity and failed to sort this informally for 7 months now - I think I have been more than patient!

 

I’m not well enough to visit the branch for a meeting to argue my case again. I did not attend the first meeting as you did not give me enough time to arrange for my union rep to attend and for the second my union rep was meant to contact you to again expressing my wish to go straight to the formal grievance. I’m also waiting for that same rep to deal with the other letter dated 07/09/08, to speak with Head Office for me and get the outcome of investigation.

 

I want Head Office to start the formal grievance procedure for these reasons and can you advise me on the company procedure I’m to follow.

 

The other thing I wish to be clarified and in writing is… Have I actually been sacked?

I certainly did not resign yet you have sent me my P45. Please can you tell me what has been recorded about my leaving in your records and where the information came from.

 

Yours faithfully

 

Thanks

 

AL

Edited October 1, 2008 by animal_lover
Would help to post it lol

[animal_lover]

Just spoke to ACAS, They told me that i don't need to go to the meeting tomorrow but if i want to make a claim to the ET then it will probably be best to go. I told them about the whole resignation issue and the fact i recieved my P45, she said it might be because i gave my verbal resignation but to contact HR about why i recieved it. And if it doesn't get resolved tomorrow then to ring them back as there trying to cut back on claims going to the ET but if i want to go to the ET to then fill in the ET1 form.

 

Just rang to see if my union rep is still coming with me tomorrow but he wasn't in the office so there gonna get him to ring me back.

 

I really don't wanna go plus i can't even think of any questions to ask apart from the ones Dipply gave a few posts up, I'm so nervous but i don't know why.

 

Should i give them the letter that i've posted above tomorrow or should i send it recorded delivery? and the Disabilty Questionaire my Union Rep told me that they will fill it in for me so i haven't done it yet should i take it with me tomorrow?

 

Hoefully the money side will be sorted tomorrow if nothing else

[animal_lover]

I'm just getting ready to go to the meeting today at 10am, I've not been this scared and nervous for a long time.I've not slept i can't eat plus i can't seem to stop crying. i really don't wanna do but i know i need to.

 

I managed to get a hold of my Union Rep yesturday and he's still coming with me so i suppose that's a good thing or is it!!!!

 

I'll let you know how i get on when i get back.

 

AL

 

AL

[Dipply75]

Hey Animal lover, I know you won't get this until you are back but am thinking of you. You will be fine, the worrying beforehand is usually worse than anything that can actually happen.

 

I am so sorry I couldn't get back to you yesterday, ended up in casualty with my wee boy - was stung by a wasp and started swelling up everywhere!

 

Will be checking in regularly to see how you get on today. Best of luck

[animal_lover]

Well it went as bad as i thought it would.

 

Firstly they have put my reason for leaving as resignation because i didn't reply within the two days they give me when they sent the letter asking me to confirm it so it automatically went to ime verbally resigning.

 

They said all the things regarding my Disability like the harassment and unreasonable adjustment are unfair and damning but are willing to let it go.

 

They are not threatened by the fact of it possibly going to the ET as they don't feel they have done anything wrong. And will do whatever it takes to make sure i don't get any money.

 

but i can have my job back as they will put it as a misunderstanding my Rep made me think it would be a good idea just to see how it goes i agreed and already i'm regretting it i've only been out of the meeting about 25 minates.

 

I'm coming to the end off my support period so if i can't get back into work in the next three weeks (as i'm still covered by a sick note) then they where likely to dismiss me anywayon the grounds of ill health.

 

I told them i was covered under the sick note for another 3 weeks but i've just realised this is only a one week sicknote and i had to go back in next Friday but work want me to go to my doctors about going back asap and also to bring the sicknote in.

 

I said i would go back if i was on a different department but would consider going back on checkouts if there was nothing else.

 

Is it to late to turn around and say i've changed my mind and that i don't want to come back I just want to draw a line under the whole thing and i don't think i would be comfortable going back. As i'm only on a 16hr contract and i've already processed my claim for Incapacity Benefit i would be better off in so many ways to stay on IB and then get myself better to enroll at college in Jan for something i actually want to do.

 

I don't feel any better about the situation as i thought i would now that it's "resolved"

[389shell]

Sounds like they have talked a load of old s**t to me.

 

They said all the things regarding my Disability like the harassment and unreasonable adjustment are unfair and damning but are willing to let it go.

 

Of course they would say this!

 

 

my Rep made me think it would be a good idea just to see how it goes

 

Sounds about right for this little cloth eared sloth!

 

 

See if you can get an appointment with CAB and see what they say, I'm no expert but to me you have been hounded out of your job on every front.

 

Good luck.

[animal_lover]

I've signed a form to say it was resolved now after my rep kept pressuring me to ASK for my job back.

Which i regret doing but i suppose it won't cause any harm to talk to them i have an appointment with them on Tuesday anyway.

Thanks

[Dipply75]

Who was it that held the meeting, as they really are that stupid *sigh*, they are also under the impression that bullying you a bit more is the way to go?! I am very concerned that this is all being kept within the branch, all quiet like, and they have the brass to say that by complaining YOU are being cheeky, but THEY will let it go???!!!!!! And that rep - useless.

 

So basically, they have said that the genuine grievances you have raised as made up and offensive and they will not actually investigate then?

 

They have tried to confuse you into going back to work - still while signed off sick without investigating your complaints at all?

 

And (my favourite) they made up their own little rule that says if we write to you telling you that you resigned (oh yeah, prove it), we will only give you 2 days to reply or it stands - tosh. Simple fact is, you mentioned thinking of it in passing and you then put in writing that you did not actually resign to clear up THEIR little 'misunderstanding' - their imaginery timescales mean sod all.

 

It is entirely up to you if want to go back, I am concerned about the effect it would have on your health though. You are perfectly entitled to go onto incapacity benefit as you have your P45 now anyway, start looking at those college courses you thought of, get yourself better and make them go through the entire FORMAL complaints procedure anyway. You could speak to the CAB on Tuesday, explain how you were bullied into signing this off as resolved, that they still haven't investigated your complaint, haven't paid you yet and it all still seems to be getting kept within the branch that have caused all of this! (Very suspicious). see if they can help you draft a letter to head office saying you were very unhappy about the way the meeting was held and the outcome as you were just not strong enough to argue - but you still want your complaints investigated formally - for the ET. See if you can state that you will be on sick leave as long as the doc says - not what they want.

 

I am sorry it went that way - it seems to be that the branch know how badly they have messed up and are trying to make it all go away quietly. Try and phone the Employment Tribunal helpline to ask what the procedure is if the person you would have the 'informal meeting' with is someone you have a complaint about. I am SURE they have to make other arrangements in that case - which it looks like your company haven't. Will get the link for you.

[animal_lover]

My meeting was with the Personnel Manager and a non food manager - it wasn't anyone who i've had problems with.

 

Even before me and my rep went into the meeting he was trying to get me to go back even if it meant going back to a different branch as there solicitors would make sure that i wouldn't get a penny if it went to the ET.

I knew it would be a bad idea him coming in with me as he's basically been on there side from the beginning.

If i go to the CAB and then the ET will i have to go back in a meeting with "work" again?.

 

I've got to go back in on Monday to sort out my wages which i'm not looking forward too thinking about it now as I'll be on my own and you could tell that the Personnel Manager was being very careful about what she said whilst my rep was in there so she might not be so "kind" to me on Monday.

 

I really don't want to go back, I just want to get better and then enrol at college in Jan. I feel worse than i did this morning

 

AL

[389shell]

The way you have been treated is absolutely disgusting. I would refuse to go in on Monday, ring them and tell them you are not well enough, get all the hours written down that they owe you and take it into CAB with you on Tuesday, they can then help put everything in writing so that you can deal with head office, your branch is run by a pack of chancers and they are about to be found out.

 

When you feel up to it, I would then draft a letter to the union and report this useless rep, banana flavoured petrol would be more use than this waste of space.

 

Deal only with Head Office from now on, I hope heads begin to roll. I am with Dipply on this, it is all very suspicious and sounds like HO have no idea what is going on.

 

Good luck AL

[Dipply75]

Totally agree 389shell. Animal lover, it is up to you what you do with your life. If you cannot face going in, then don't - it is them who have made you feel that way. Am I right in saying you are actually still covered by a sick line? If you are then stay on it. I would send a letter to head office only and deal with them only from now on, stating the grievance in NOT resolved, you are entirely unhappy with that meeting (all as I said above) and you are now starting the formal process and send that disability questionnaire too - no more peeing about.

 

As for your wages - I see no reason why you have to go into that branch again in person for this. They tried that the last time! Get head office to deal with that too - after months they should have all they need to sort it - if not you can tell them in writing - nothing more verbally with the lying beggars. will try and help you get a letter outlining it all. You have jumped through hoops for them for moths - you suit yourself now, completely. There is no reason you need to be in that branch in person for them to finally pay you correctly. If they STILL have questions they can write to you and you can write back - no more 'misunderstandings' then, eh!

 

Seriously - you are signed off by a doctor, you are medically unfit for work. They are still trying to make you work while signed off ill - you DO NOT have to go in, I would let your support period run out and be done with them, do not set foot in the place again! Take control, you decide what YOU want to you do it.

Edited October 4, 2008 by Dipply75
bit more of a rant!

[389shell]

Maybe a veiled thread to Head Office about informing the press, you did say this was a well know outfit. It may put a rocket up their a***s and get your wages sorted.

[Dipply75]

Hey Animal lover, how are you holding up? Did you go in on Monday?

 

Let us know how you are

[animal_lover]

Hi, Sorry for not posting lately.

 

Things have been worse since i came back from the meeting. I can't sleep, I can't eat. I feel terrible.

 

I didn't go in yesturday I never rang or anything but i need to contact them to get my Wageslips sent out as they haven't sent them so i can get my claim in for Housing Benefit but i'm to scared to ring incase it's one of my former managers.

 

I'm still covered by my sicknote till Friday, So i've got an appointment for another one on Monday.

 

I couldn't go in to CAB this morning a i'm not feeling to good but i've made another appointment for the 21st October but they said i can go in to the drop in if it's important.

 

I need to get another DDA Questionaire sent out as i binned it when i got home as i thought it was over.

 

I don't think there gonna give in if it goes to the ET and i've read the book about what you have to do in an ET and i don't think i could do it. Questioning them and having them questioning me in the frame of mind i'm in now i don't think i could do it.

 

I don't know what to do anymore. It's like all the fights gone out of me now

 

AL

[389shell]

If you can, get a huge load of sleep, firstly you need to catch up on it as not doing will make you feel much worse. Hopefully someone will be along shortly with some good advise for you, but first try and get some sleep, please.

[animal_lover]

Thanks, I'll try eveytime i close my eyes it starts playing on my mind. I just give up in the end.

 

AL