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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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Backdoor Carter CCJ re MBNA debt - Mymaterob - challenged carter - they said stop paying!!


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Delivered on 17/01/08

 

MMR has now informed me that he has a CCJ from Northampton CC concerning this account and he has been paying Carters £50 a week. I have told him to stop paying this for now as I believe they have done something "not right" and it needs to be checked.

They rang him last week and said as he has a CCJ against him he cannot stop paying them and they will send the bailiffs round. We have sent the letter removing licence from them to do so.

We are now waiting for their reply about the CCA request.

 

MMR has just rang me to say a letter from Carters has arrived saying they will take no further action on his account!!!

I will post letter when he brings it round later.

 

BRYAN CARTER

 

SOLICITORS

 

BRYAN CARTER & CO

 

SOLICITORS

 

De Havilland Drive Weybridge Surrey KT13 ONT

je|. 08701125136

Fax:

DX: 87903 Weybridge 3 II III! II II11IIII Mill

Business Hours

Sam - 8pm Monday to Thursday

Sam - 5pm Friday

Sam - 1pm Saturday

 

Our Reference: MBN/xxxxxxxxxx Re: MBNA

 

Account number: xxxxxxxxxx

 

 

Dear Sirs,

We refer to recent correspondence in this matter.

Please note that we have been instructed to take no further action against you and have therefore closed our file.

Yours sincerely,

 

BRYAN CARTER & Co,

03365637 [retac 10:49]

 

Please note that Bryan Carter & Co is the trading name of Crellins Carter Solicitors of 111 Queens Road, Weybridge, Surrey KT13 9UW A list of partners may be inspected at our above offices. Regulated by the Solicitors Regulation Authorit)-.

 

I find this very strange indeed and believe they have been taking MMR's money unlawfully.

Any advice as to what to do next please.

 

Sent this.

 

23/01/08

Persimmon House

De Havilland Drive

WEYBRIDGE

SURREY

KT13 0NT

 

 

 

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

 

Dear Sir,

 

Thank you for your letter of 21/01/2008 in response to my legal request.

May I remind you that you still have to comply with my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and failure to do so will result in legal action being taken against you.

 

 

Yours faithfully

 

icon1.gif Guidelines - Requests For An Original Agreement Under The Consumer Credit Act 1974

A debt becomes unenforceable under the CCA if a creditor does not supply a true copy of the signed credit agreement within 12 working days of it being requested, after a further month the creditor has committed an offence. This offence can be reported to the Trading Standards Authority (in the creditors area, not your local one), or the FSA.

 

The debt remains unenforceable for as long as the creditor fails to produce the signed credit agreement – this means if they produce the agreement some months down the line, they are quite within their rights to enforce it. They do not need to take any further action to enforce the debt. A debtor cannot take any action against the creditor for failing to produce the signed credit agreement within the prescribed time, because that is up to the agencies that the offence has been reported to. Any sanctions that may be imposed are at the discretion of these agencies, and it is not a matter that the debtor can take to the civil court.

 

If a CCJ has already been entered against a debt, then there is no point in requesting the agreement under the CCA, if your intention is to argue that the debt is unenforceable, since the debt has already been enforced. You can however request a true copy of the original signed credit agreement if you wish to check original terms and conditions etc. If they do not supply it then your only recourse is to report them to the aforementioned agencies. It would be very difficult to prove that they didn’t have the agreement at the time judgment was entered.

 

It is imperative that you continue to pay any debt under the terms of a CCJ.

 

Issuing a court claim for non-compliance of a CCA request in all probability achieves nothing to benefit to the debtor, as a court claim is likely to spur a detailed search which could well end up with them producing a perfectly acceptable original signed agreement in court – which would result in the debtor losing the case, and being made liable for the creditor’s costs.

 

If after requesting a true copy of a signed credit agreement the creditor fails to produce it, it does not mean that the debt does not exist, because at the end of the day the debtor spent the money and therefore they owe it and need to pay it back The debtor may now however be in a good position to make a full and final offer to clear the debt.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

After reading Gizmo's excellent post above, I am a little confused as to why Carters should suddenly say they no longer wish to pursue MMR's debt even though he has a CCJ against him.

Anyone got any ideas?

 

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Guest Screw The Bailiff

I would suggest writing this up as a brief and factual summary, collate together any documents you have, decide what you want done, e.g. CCJ removed at their expense, solicitor to refund you money & how much etc.

 

Then send it all off to the Law Society and file a complaint against the solicitor.

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Please note that we have been instructed to take no further action against you and have therefore closed our file.

 

Write to them and ask them who instructed them to take no further action? They would have to disclose to you who they took instruction from.

 

This sounds very fishy indeed. :confused:

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Also noted that they are regulated by the Solicitors Regulation Authority (although they couldn't even spell authority correctly :D). Checked their website and they refer complaints to the Legal Complaints Service.

 

I would also make a complaint to them and also send off for a full SAR with £10. If they don't answer that, you can also include the ICO in the list of authorities to complain to.

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I would suggest writing this up as a brief and factual summary, collate together any documents you have, decide what you want done, e.g. CCJ removed at their expense, solicitor to refund you money & how much etc.

 

Then send it all off to the Law Society and file a complaint against the solicitor.

 

Dear Mr xxxxxxxxxx,

Thank you for your enquiry.

We hope that it will be helpful if we briefly outline our powers. The Legal Complaints Service considers the service which solicitors provide to their clients if the complaint is raised by the client in question.

If you raise an issue about someone else's solicitor we may pass your concerns to the Solicitors Regulation Authority. We are unable to give legal advice.

If a finding of professional misconduct is made, we can consider applying disciplinary sanctions against the solicitor in question, and in the most serious cases can refer the matter to the Solicitors Disciplinary Tribunal. A finding of professional misconduct does not in itself give rise to an award of compensation.

Whilst we can consider complaints about the overall service provided, we are not able to consider complaints about the advice given by a solicitor. Nor are we able to question the way that a solicitor chose to represent a client, or whether a certain course of action was in the client's best interests. Offering an opinion on such matters would in effect amount to legal advice as to how the case should have been conducted, which is not the our function.

I understand that the firm acts for another party in this matter. I can confirm that solicitors are obliged to act in the best interests of their own clients and to follow their instructions. If the firm does not do so, it is open to the client to complain. A solicitor is entitled to rely on the instructions that they are given by their client and, as long as they do not know that they are false or untrue, they have no obligation to apply a pre-trial screen to establish the truthfulness of any instructions.

It therefore follows that we are unable to consider the way in which the firm chooses to represent their client. If the matter does go to Court and the Court makes any criticisms of the solicitor's conduct in conducting the matter before it, please contact this office again and the matter can be reconsidered in the light of any criticism that has been made.

If you have any further queries, you may wish to contact the Legal Complaints Helpline on 0845 6086565 and speak with one of our helpline agents. Our lines are open between 8 am and 6 pm Monday to Friday.

Please note calls may be monitored/recorded for training purposes.

Yours sincerely

Customer Contact Centre

Email Enquiries Team

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Tel: 01372371743

Fax: 01372 371704

Email: [email protected]

Minicom: 01372371707

General Enquiries: 01372 371700

www.surreycc.gov.uk/tradingstandards

 

 

 

 

SURREY

COUNTY COUNCIL

TRADING STANDARDS

Mid Surrey Area Office Bay Tree Avenue Kingston Road Leatherhead Surrey KT22 7SY

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

06/03/2008

 

 

 

Dear Mr XXXXXX

Thank you for writing to Trading Standards. Your case officer, David Bullen will contact you within 5 working days. If you need to contact David Bullen in the meantime, he/she can be reached by any of the following means:

 

 

 

Telephone:

Email:

Or by writing to:

 

01372371743

[email protected] Mid Surrey Area Office Bay Tree Avenue Kingston Road Leatherhead KT22 7SY

Our Service has a commitment to providing you with the advice and assistance that you need to resolve any consumer problems that you have. Although we do not have enough staff to intervene in every complaint/enquiry we receive, the case officer will discuss with you how they can best help you.

Unfortunately, in come cases, there are no further steps that can be taken. For example, if the trader has disappeared, or the business you are dealing with has not breached any laws. If these circumstances apply, we still feel there is value in providing advice to you in case there are any other issues that arise from the situation that we may be able to address.

If your complaint/enquiry requires follow up work, the case officer will keep you up to date with progress and will contact you at least every 20 working days.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you once again for using our Service. Yours sincerely

Trading Standards Officer

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SURREY

COUNTY COUNCIL

TRADING STANDARDS

Mid Surrey Area Office Bay Tree Avenue Kingston Road Leatherhead Surrey KT22 7SY

 

 

 

12 March 2008

 

Dear Mr XXXXXXX

Re: Bryan Carter and Co

Thank you for your recent letter concerning your dispute with Bryan Carter, the comments of which have been on our system. As I understand it Bryan Carter and Co were pursuing you for a debt and you made a request for a copy of the credit agreement that they were relying on to be sent to you. Bryan Carter then wrote back saying the file had been closed and they had been instructed to take no further action. I understand that they never supplied you with a copy of the credit agreement and you are still seeking for this to be supplied.

From the information that you have supplied I am unclear as to whether you are disputing that you owe any money or whether the request is simply to enable you to gain a copy of the agreement they are basing their claims on. Usually if a company, on receipt of a request such as yours, are unable to find the original agreement or discover that there are inaccuracies on it that render it largely unenforceable they will act as Bryan Carter and Co have done and choose not to pursue the debt.

It must be recognised that Bryan Carter and Co are acting as debt collectors, as opposed to being the company you took out the credit agreement with. Usually in these circumstances on receipt of a request like yours the collection company will contact the company who you had the agreement with and ask them to supply copies of the original agreement. If the paperwork is not produced or there are inaccuracies with it the collection company will normally close there file and return the debt/claimed debt back to the original company.

In reality I think it is going to be unlikely that you will be able to force Bryan Carter and Co to supply the paperwork you have requested, if you want to pursue this request further it may be worth making the same request to the company that the credit agreement was originally taken out with. However, it should be noted that the debt/claimed debt will not be enforceable without a Court Order whilst the paperwork cannot be supplied.

 

 

 

 

 

Yours sincerely

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The problem we are having trying to help MMR is he cannot find anything to do with this credit card account, the ccj etc. I suppose it was lost in transit from the army back into civvy street. He has always been awful with money and buries his head in the sand instead of asking for help.

 

I honestly believe he his owed a lot in charges but if we can't find out from Carters what we want to know, what can we do?.

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Can he remember

 

1. Who the claimant was?

2. Roughly when it was?

3. Which court it was? It could have been transferred to a court near to where he was living at the time.

 

If so, he can ask the court to search for details and perhaps obtain copies of the claim form and judgment.

 

Has he checked his credit files with Experian, etc? Details of the judgment would have been recorded on there.

 

Els

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Can he remember

 

1. Who the claimant was?

2. Roughly when it was?

3. Which court it was? It could have been transferred to a court near to where he was living at the time.

 

If so, he can ask the court to search for details and perhaps obtain copies of the claim form and judgment.

 

Has he checked his credit files with Experian, etc? Details of the judgment would have been recorded on there.

 

Els

Hi els,

1, BRYAN CARTER for mbna.

2, The only letters he can find are from CARTERS from last year.

3,He thinks Northampton MCOL.

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Well, he could try asking MCOL if they can trace the claim. It should be either MBNA Europe Bank Ltd v mymaterob or Bryan Carter v mymaterob. Give them as much information as possible e.g. approximate date, amount of claim ,mmr's address at the time. Contact details for MCOL are

 

Money Claim Online

Northampton County Court

21-27 St. Katharine's Street

Northampton

NN1 2LH

Tel : 0845-601 5935

Fax: 0845-601 5889

[email protected]

 

Els

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