Council Tax Paid what now?

[BigLandyman]

Bailiff arrived today to collect the outstanding arrears on my council tax. He didn't realise I had made a payment to the Council directly via their website this morning.

His figure is £870.50 but would not give me a breakdown of the bill. He said I would only get a list of charges on the back of the reciept when I pay HIM.

The council who I rang this morning refuse to discuss the matter "As its in the hands of the bailiffs" but their online payment system has given me a reicept for £700 which I figure is about the right amount.

Question? How do I get this chap off my back? He coming back in 24 hours for £870.50 because he insists I pay HIM. I've read the advice about refusing entry etc and I wont be in all weekend anyway.

Will the Council automatically remove the warrant? Do I still have to pay the Bailiffs fees? Lots of questions i know but your help and input would be great

 

Many thanks in advance

-Tim

 

PS Great site, lots of real good advice!

[Boro]

Send the bailiff a subject access request, this will cost you £10 to do but by law they must comply, assuming they have not been into your property and have not levied goods the maximum the bailiff is allowed to charge is £24.50 for the initial visit and £18 for the second visit, he can visit as many times as he likes but cannot charge anymore that for those two visits, did the bailiff visit prior to you paying your council tax?

[BigLandyman]

I did at the beginning of the year pay my Poll Tax each month but when I changed bank accounts the Direct Debit didn’t get set up and I went into arrears. When I received threatening letters from the council I naively believed I had all year to pay, since this is for 2007-2008.

Next thing, bang-whiz, threats of court action and before I know it Bailiff letter, followed by a visit this week but I wasn’t at home. Just a threatening leaflet left explaining he would be back within the next 48hours with a van and Police if necessary.

As I said in the previous post I rang the Council and they wasn’t interested so after reading the FAQ etc on this forum I paid a lump sum via the Councils website for what I think is the balance.

I’ve left my vehicle at work to avoid seizure but I do have a concern about my wife’s cars parked on the drive. Can he remove them? They are registered in my name for insurance purposes but she does have receipts and proof of purchase, which I did explain to the Bailiff, who seemed very interested in them at the time.

However we are away all weekend and are curious if the Bailiff may try and collect them while we’re gone. I could move one but the other is a restoration project and isn’t taxed or tested so I cant leave it on the highway.

Again many thanks for your patience and help in advance

-Tim

 

PS The Bailiff company is Birchalls if that helps anyone

[Goldlady]

Is your wife's name on the council tax bill as well? I can't imagine them coming back over the weekend to take the car(s) as will cost them to get them uplifted. Have you got a fax number or email address for Birchalls? If so I would be very tempted to get the proof of payment to them - or even leave a copy of it on the dashboard of each car. If her name is not on the bill you could also put something on view in the cars confirming that they are her property. I am not an expert on bailiffs and hopefully someone else will give you better advice - but that is what I would do.

[BigLandyman]

The bill for the arrears is in my name only and I like the idea of the notices placed in the vehicles, good call.

I may even have a word with my neighbours, which will be horrendously embarrassing.

According to what I have read if they do take the vehicles any removal costs are passed on to me but hopefully if they read the notices they may not remove them.

 

Thanks for your input

-Tim

[Goldlady]

It only occurred to me after we had bailiffs at our factory and they had marched in without anyone seeing them. I sent them a fax stating that the building houses a number of companies (which is true) and that none of the assets in that building belonged to the debtor (which was also true). That was about six months ago and they have not been back.

 

Awkward about the neighbours but probably not a bad idea. If the 'restoration project' looks like a dead loss they will probably think it isn't worth it. I have a fax at home if you want to send anything tonight.

[rambo]

I had bailiffs after me for council tax, I paid it in full but did not tell the bailiffs, I liked the idea of the bailiffs wasting thier time chasing me, it took the council 4 months to tell the bailiffs

[chris600uk]

I'm sure I've read somewhere else in this forum, that once the councils outstanding liability order is paid off, the Bailiffs have no legal right to pursue anything but their charges - the £24.50 + £18.00.

 

So what happens once you've sent them that?

 

Surely anything they do is unlawful - isn't it?

 

Chris.

 

 

ps- I bl**dy hope someone can confirm it cos that's what I intend to do

[Goldlady]

Well I suspect if no-one has told the Bailiffs it has been paid they will carry on with their dubious tactics until they are told. Years ago we were nearly evicted from our own home by Court Bailiffs a few weeks after we had bought it because no-one had told them the previous owners had paid off the secured loan which they had defaulted on:eek:

[demon_x_slash]

I'd send a cheque for the two visit fees to the bailiff company ("Please find enclosed a cheque for £XX, payment for visits made on XX/XX and XX/XX"), copying in the Council, and the Council a letter saying something along the lines of, "Please confirm that the amount of £XXX for tax bill 06/07 has been successfully paid to the Council and that no further action needs to be taken to settle this matter." I really can't see them refunding you the £700 if they disagree with your method of payment!

[antivirus]

There is nothing to be embarrassed by if you have got bailiffs calling. It is the bailiffs who should be ashamed of their selves. If he turns up then start shouting bailiff at the door bailiff at the door. This will be enough to scare him off.

[BigLandyman]

Just arrived home and everything is still in its place so good news on that front.

One thing that struck us on the way home was a Bailiff may enter through an open window and claim "Peaceful Entry" status and gain access to the house and contents. All our windows were obviously closed BUT sometimes we leave open a window in the conservatory. We lock the connecting door which is the original rear access.

If a Bailiff was to enter the conservatory through that window is that classed as "Peaceful Entry"?? As far as I am aware a conservatory is not classed as a "Habitable Room" as it requires no planning permission to build (in most cases). Since a conservatory is not a habitable room it doesn't form part of the house therefore the Bailiff hasn't gained "Peaceful Entry" QED or is that too simple?

[Goldlady]

Interesting point - I suspect he could enter the conservatory but go no further - but not certain. Glad all was well when you got back - I bet you were worried all weekend. Hopefully you can get something sorted tomorrow.

[postggj]

Just An Interesting Point.

With Reference Baliffs Taking Cars.

Ime Sure I Read Someware The Are Not Allowed To Sieze Assetts Worth More Than The Original Debt

Can Anyone Comment On This

[antivirus]

You need to ask tomtubby this.

[BigLandyman]

With Reference Baliffs Taking Cars.

Ime Sure I Read Someware The Are Not Allowed To Sieze Assetts Worth More Than The Original Debt

Can Anyone Comment On This

 

I read that the average auction price for seized goods may be as little as 10% of the original value.

Does that give the Bailiff grounds to seize goods to cover that potential overhead?

Interesting point postggj

 

-Tim

[Guest ChloeJane]

Hi there,

 

Firstly, yes you are responsible for the Bailiffs fees once the matter is passed from Council to Bailiff. So unfortunately if the Bailiff has made a visit, the fee has to be paid.

 

Secondly, the Bailiff MUST be Certificated. If you have the Bailiffs name anywhere or on paperwork telephone - 0207 210 0516 and the persons name is Denise Falkner. She will be able to make sure he was entitled to be there.

 

Thirdly, the Bailiff BY LAW can only charge according to legislation. The charges are listed here.

 

You need to make sure first that the Bailiff is certificated. If he is not then you begin to have leverage.

 

From what you have said he is only entitled to the one visit. I would write to the Company the Bailiff works for and state that only 1 visit is made and include a receipt for the amount you have paid. The concern I have is you are not sure it is the entire amount paid to the council. You really need to clarify this. The matter will not end till the council have their full amount. So even if you have underpaid the council £5 the debt is not ended and the Bailiff will continue to enforce.

 

You can't end this matter till you know you have paid the council in FULL!

 

Once you know that you have, in your letter state that you will pay the £24.50 but no other amount and include a cheque or payment with the letter. State that any further harassment by visits will be seen as wrongfully escalating costs and you will take the matter up with the Court that the Bailiff was Certificated at and lodge a Form 4 Complaint in relation to the matter of the Bailiffs conduct if he proceeds to increase the charges and costs without merit and false visits.

 

IF...the Bailiff is not certificated - after phone the above number, then you do not have to pay any fees.

 

It is important to ensure the Bailiff is certificated.

 

It is important to ensure you have paid precisely what the council has demanded.

 

ONLY then, can you send a letter with the above and end the matter.Post back if unsure.

[antivirus]

Pm tomtubby for the correct charges. As the information given by chloejane is in correct. The 2nd visit fee should be £18.00

[BigLandyman]

Thanks for that

 

Hi there,

 

Firstly, yes you are responsible for the Bailiffs fees once the matter is passed from Council to Bailiff. So unfortunately if the Bailiff has made a visit, the fee has to be paid.

 

 

Can the Bailiff seize goods to pay their fees or do I take the matter with them "offline" as it were via a cheque to their head office?

I managed to get hold of the council tody and I have it from them I am now in credit to the tune of £35.33.

On returning home I have found a hand delivered letter from Birchills with a revised bill for £205.83 must be for their charges.

The letter is also underlining the statment about removal of cars so I assume he is going to try and take the wifes classic car despite the fact I have told him we have reciepts.

Also does it matter about over paying the council? I never thought to ask at the time and now they've all gone home and its an answerphone?

 

Many thanks -Tim

[Guest ChloeJane]

From what you have written, the Bailiff has only visited twice yes?

[BigLandyman]

Bailiffs vists 3

1st I wasn't in

2nd By prior arrangement to discuss payment and fees (see earlier post)

3rd Today, again I wasn't at home.

All occasions no access to property and no levy made

 

Hope this helps

 

-Tim

[Guest ChloeJane]

Did you check whether the Bailiff was Certificated?????

 

For making a visit to premises with a view to

Levying distress (where no levy is made) -

(i) where the visit is the first or only

such visit): £24.50

(ii) where the visit is the second such

visit: £18.50

 

 

By law these are the charges. As you have already paid the council in full and are in credit and you told the Bailiff that you had paid, I would argue that only two visits were justified. To charge a visit fee for his visit fees ...I won't go there with my opinion!

 

So, I would write to the company as suggested. Enclose a receipt for what you have paid. State the Bailiff visited once, then the second time to arrange payment and the third visit was unecessary and therefore you are more than happy to take the complaint up with the Court, as the Bailiff fees charged and original demand made was not in line with legislation. Enclose a cheque for £43.

 

Make clear that the matter you now deem to have ended and further harassment will result in a Form 4 complaint with the Court about the Bailiff knowingly charging false fees unlawfully.

 

I would do it tomorrow, fax a copy of the letter and state the cheque is in the post and make sure it is signed for at their end. Worth a £1 to ensure it arrives.

[BigLandyman]

Did you check whether the Bailiff was Certificated?????

 

Sort of , I asked but I wouldn't know what I was looking for to be honest. He showed me a badge, an ID card and a laminated A5 sized document with a photo on which I assume is a Court Certificate. An earlier poster referred to a telephone number to verify this, (thanks btw), which I will do in the morning.

My concern now is can he levy goods for his fees £205.33, which is the the situation currently or can I ring him and say "On yer bike mate" and send a cheque to his office for £43?

 

Its like a game of chess now lol!

Many thanks

-Tim

[Guest ChloeJane]

Yes that is what I would do.

 

Send the cheque £43.00 and letter and wait for them to play their next move.!

[antivirus]

Yes that is what I would do.

 

Send the cheque £43.00 and letter and wait for them to play their next move.!

 

 

Pm tomtubby and ask for her advice. Ignore cj.