I find this really perverse as the judges did not side with me on any of my points but sided 95% with the other side. Despite the clear evidence of bullying and harassment, despite the fact I had suffered serious trauma through losing a family member.

My employers were aware of my loss and the tragic circumstances and proceeded to carry on harassing me under the guise of my line manager. In the end I had no other option then to leave for my own sanity.

I am in the process of getting ready for a review of the decision. the judges found there was no bullying and no harassment what so ever. My question is why then would I bring a claim in the first place!

I need all the help I can get right now!!!

Oh dear I hope what you are saying isn't really true. Are they that bad. You would think that as they only get paid if they win they would do everything to win the case for you???? I know my case inside out but do not know the law, which in a constructive dismissal case like mine, I think you really do need to know. Without any legal help surely you would have stood even more chance of losing. Or am I wrong???? What is a non-practiciing barrister? Is it one who is retired or just voluntary or something?

My case is similar to yours constant bullying and harassment and I ended up having a mental breakdown. The stress of preparing for such a case is so traumatic. In my case they have asked for the case to be struck out at a pre hearing due to it being vexatious. It is very worrying! In hindsight I would have just resigned and got another job!

Tribunals are very stressful, this is what the employer is hoping for, that you will just give up. They are hard to prove, the employer will have an army of solicitors and funds. But, If you are right, you are right. Dont get stressed about the result, just go in there, tell the truth and you can hold your head up high.

If the respondent lies, which they will, just accept it, be the better person. Then win or loose, you still know you were right.

I had the same, work drove me to a nervous breakdown and i was in a psychiatric hospital for 10 weeks. I am working on my case at the moment goes to hearing in August. To be honest, I am looking forward to it.

Msg for Ibruk

you poor thing. Did you have a history of mental health problems. I had a breakdown about 9 years ago (before I joined this company). I also saw a psychiatrist and psychotherapist. When I joined there I told them I had been ill and they were fine to me. I only had a few days sick leave in 8 years as I was so well. They knew what they were pushing me to as they knew I had been ill before, but no one understands mental illness, unless they have been through it. I keep worrying about my case all the time, not because i have told lies, but because of the lies they are making up about me!! My husband keeps reassuring me that it will all be OK so I am trying to keep it together, and luckily sought counselling for the harassment in July last year, and finally resigned in September and then went back on antidepressants! I am sorry you had to go into a psychiatric hospital for 10 weeks that must have been like hell for you and your family. Rest assured you are not alone and I know this sounds perverse but if at least one of the Tribunal have had any experience of mental health issues then maybe they can empathise with your situation and that the harassment made you ill.

Tribunals are very stressful, this is what the employer is hoping for, that you will just give up. They are hard to prove, the employer will have an army of solicitors and funds. But, If you are right, you are right. Dont get stressed about the result, just go in there, tell the truth and you can hold your head up high.

 

If the respondent lies, which they will, just accept it, be the better person. Then win or loose, you still know you were right.

 

I had the same, work drove me to a nervous breakdown and i was in a psychiatric hospital for 10 weeks. I am working on my case at the moment goes to hearing in August. To be honest, I am looking forward to it.

I admire your persistence and I think that you have the right attitude. Tell the truth and if the law cannot help by finding in your favour it makes no fundamental difference because you held the Respondent accountable.

Winning is desirable but not essential, if you have stood up to bad practice and deceit then you have done all you can.

Good Luck.

cheers for your response browncow

Yes I tried my best and the repondent lied, however I feel really let down by my counsel and my solicitor, I feel they lost what was a stong case!

cheers for your response browncow

 

Yes I tried my best and the repondent lied, however I feel really let down by my counsel and my solicitor, I feel they lost what was a stong case!

I am heading for a lost case too after a lot of hard work and expense. I would never advise anyone to go to the ET. It is not a proper court and there are no penalites for lying and you cannot recoup costs. It is better to take the employer to the County Court if you have suffered a breakdown because of work. Solicitors are much happier with that type of work because their costs are covered.

I do not think it matters all that much that the ET are now charging fees. The whole thing had become a farce anyway.

I am heading for a lost case too after a lot of hard work and expense. I would never advise anyone to go to the ET. It is not a proper court and there are no penalites for lying and you cannot recoup costs. It is better to take the employer to the County Court if you have suffered a breakdown because of work. Solicitors are much happier with that type of work because their costs are covered.

 

 

I do not think it matters all that much that the ET are now charging fees. The whole thing had become a farce anyway.

Isn't it depressing to know that people can get away with all those lies!! Money talks definitely. Browncow when are you going to ET or are you in the middle of a hearing? Is there anything I can do to help you?

Hi all,

I want to ask the Employment Tribunal to review a decision.

I am aware that I need to apply in writing stating why you think the judgment should be reviewed.

I am aware of the 14 day deadline and time is nearly up

therefore please can someone who has been through this or is up to scratch, what exactly the process is?

Do I write in to the tribunal via email and submit all my evidence that way.

Or can I just put a bundle together and drop it off at the tribunals premises. Obviously get it signed for!

Time nearly up, so any advice extremely appreciated

Ps I have read the guide found at:

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/ResolvingWorkplaceDisputes/Employmenttribunals/DG_180552

Best wishes

x

Hi Prof,

a non practicing barrister is neither a barrister nor a solicitor, but somewhere in Legal limbo so to speak.

NPB's should not really be giving legal advice as they are not specialist like Barristers or Solicitors.

With that in mind, I did have a barrister represent me on the day (and after all the extensive legal training) you would think they had some kind of advocacy skills!

good luck mate and anything I can do to help just let me know!

Come on peeps!!!!

There were 7 viewing this thread a few moments ago. And no replies (((

Hiya,

You can send an e-mail with letter in the attachment (letter in pdf format, you will need a scaner if you want to sign it) or send a typical letter in Word by post.

You do not attach any bundle - it is already in the posession of the tribunal office. You do have your own copy as well.

In your case, I presume interests of justice require such review.

Put all your arguments in writing referring to particular pages in the bundle or witness statements - the evidence.

The above may work if the panel saw the documents (you will again refer them to) already.

If something wasn't said or pointed to during the hearing, it may not be allowed to start showing them more (already put in the bundle) evidence now.

But go ahead and try. In the worst case scenario you only risk response refusing to review the judgement.

Billy, you wrote here:

I raised a grievance and it was clearly never going to get heard so I resigned saying that I had enjoyed my time working there etc.

Is this what you literally put in your resignation letter? If so, seems like we know now why you lost your tribunal.

However, if you wrote and explained in your witness statement before ET why you had put this information in your resignation letter (because you feared any consequences as to the references), then the tribunal is very likely to understand you.

I am heading for a lost case too after a lot of hard work and expense. I would never advise anyone to go to the ET. It is not a proper court and there are no penalites for lying and you cannot recoup costs. It is better to take the employer to the County Court if you have suffered a breakdown because of work. Solicitors are much happier with that type of work because their costs are covered.

 

 

I do not think it matters all that much that the ET are now charging fees. The whole thing had become a farce anyway.

I will say it is worth going to tribunal on your own if you're ready to dig into law and spend some time making yourself familiar with procedures. After all, who will understand you better than you yourself?

Why do you think your case is a lost one already, browncow?

You wrote here:

 

I raised a grievance and it was clearly never going to get heard so I resigned saying that I had enjoyed my time working there etc.

 

Is this what you literally put in your resignation letter? If so, seems like we know now why you lost your tribunal.

However, if you wrote and explained in your witness statement before ET why you had put this information in your resignation letter (because you feared any consequences as to the references), then the tribunal is very likely to understand you.

Ms Smith, if only it were this simply, I did exactly as above and look at the result.

when I said I was resigning the line manager who had been bullying me invited me to go for a coffee to "talk about it"

what line manager wanted to do was to glean info. in case of an et claim and this has actually been submitted as evidence in the respondents bundle.

Unbelievable what companies can get away with.....

Did you go for this coffee!?

Constructive dismissal means you resign and there are no coffees, teas of cookies after. It is end of story, end of chapter, "see you later in court" only.

I will say it is worth going to tribunal on your own if you're ready to dig into law and spend some time making yourself familiar with procedures. After all, who will understand you better than you yourself?

 

Why do you think your case is a lost one already, browncow?

Why should I personally have to pay thousands to illustrate that workers are harassed, policies are flouted or ignored , poor practice is justified and internal grievance processes are a tool of victimization when it is already well known and nobody cares?

As for the so called unions - they bear little resemblance to the original organizations that fought for social justice and equal rights -

Get an accident and injury policy and some legal insurance folks and take them to the county court if your health or wellbeing is damaged by your working environment.

Hi Browncow,

thanks for your post. There's always the employment appeals tribunal.

My legal advisor has said that costs are not awarded at the EAT. Please can this be confirmed by someone here seriously urgently. I thought that this was not the case and the looser (ie potentially me) could be liable for other sides costs, if the case goes to appeal and looses. could I be potentially lumbered with a bill for 10's of thousands of pounds in my search for justice (the elusive holy grail it seems! )

Can anyone confirm this is the case

With the county court is there a time limit on this? whats the procedure if the incident was more than a year ago???

Thanks v much

I am sure that the Tribunal will bend over backwards to exonerate the employer as they did in Billybob's case.

 

I am trying to understand where part of billy's reasoning come from.

I am not saying he shouldn't feel aggrieved or upset because every normal, decent person woud be in his situation and what he went through.

The problem is we only get chunks of info here yet if billy is happy to provide us with more details surrounding his resignation, we will have a chance too see bigger picture.

 

My legal advisor has said that costs are not awarded at the EAT. Please can this be confirmed by someone here seriously urgently. I thought that this was not the case and the looser (ie potentially me) could be liable for other sides costs, if the case goes to appeal and looses. could I be potentially lumbered with a bill for 10's of thousands of pounds in my search for justice (the elusive holy grail it seems! )

 

Can anyone confirm this is the case

 

With the county court is there a time limit on this? whats the procedure if the incident was more than a year ago???

ased on thi

Thanks v much

EAT can still award costs, I am afraid - whether on application for costs from the other side for bringing highly unreasonable or vexatious (in their belief) claim or if a party behaves very much disruptively during proceedings.

EAT especially puts special attention to what was put before et panel at the hearing. Based on material put before the panel then, you need to refer to why they erred on a point of law (in front of EAT).

How many days do you have left to submit application for a review? (14 days run out of when?)

As for county court you have 6 years to bring a claim.

In your case, you should to much extent refer to Protection from Harassment Act 1997.

Youll find that all courts and tribunals have the ability to bring costs against either party, win or lose, depending on the circumstances.

As I think I mentioned earlier Im familiar with Leasehold/Land Tribunals and the ability to bring costs is limited to £500 (however I believe there is no such limit at EAT ?), BUT to warrant this there must be significant unreasonable or vexatious behaviour and this is rarely given, however the other side may apply for it and claim things such as weak claim, eveidence/directions not complied with on time, etc.

I was just reading a LANDS tribunal ruling on this, the original LVT allowed costs of £500 as landlord was late in supplying documents but on appeal this was disallowed, so no both sides had to cover their own costs.

Are EAT decisions made public, printed online ?

Andy

Youll find that all courts and tribunals have the ability to bring costs against either party, win or lose, depending on the circumstances.

 

As I think I mentioned earlier Im familiar with Leasehold/Land Tribunals and the ability to bring costs is limited to £500 (however I believe there is no such limit at EAT ?), BUT to warrant this there must be significant unreasonable or vexatious behaviour and this is rarely given, however the other side may apply for it and claim things such as weak claim, eveidence/directions not complied with on time, etc.

 

I was just reading a LANDS tribunal ruling on this, the original LVT allowed costs of £500 as landlord was late in supplying documents but on appeal this was disallowed, so no both sides had to cover their own costs.

 

Are EAT decisions made public, printed online ?

 

Andy

Andy, you keep banging on residential matters.

Employment tribunals have got their own practice directions, in small proportion common with general code of conduct of parties elsewhere.

You can find some of the EAT judgments here:

http://www.employmentappeals.gov.uk/Public/RecentJudgments.aspx

Yes, costs can be awarded in the EAT, in circumstances where a review could have done the job of an appeal, where the proceedings were unnecessary/misconceived/vexatious, where you miss deadlines, or amend a pleading, or cause proceedings to be delayed in any significant way. The scope is slightly different to the ET. I also don't believe that EAT costs are subject to the £20,000 cap that they are in the Employment Tribunal either, as its open to the Judge to award costs on either a standad or indemnity basis (or the parties can agree to fix costs between themselves).

You should note that you can't seek to bring a claim in another forum (i.e. the county court) which has already been decided by a previous court or tribunal. So there's a good chance you couldn't bring a claim based on primarily the same facts.

Just to copy and paste from the ET Rules of Procedure, reviews are permitted on the following grounds:

(a)the decision was wrongly made as a result of an administrative error;

(b)a party did not receive notice of the proceedings leading to the decision;

©the decision was made in the absence of a party;

(d)new evidence has become available since the conclusion of the hearing to which the decision relates, provided that its existence could not have been reasonably known of or foreseen at that time; or

(e)the interests of justice require such a review.