SLC Cannot Supply The Original Agreement

[InKogneeToh]

Thanks for the clarification of the difference. My original question still stands, what if an agreement only specifies the APR and not the original interest? Can APR be used to satisfy the need to have interest on an agreement? If an agreement only makes reference to APR and not interest, is the prescribed item of interest fulfilled or not?

 

Hi

 

No the interest rate must be shown as a % per annum.

 

The APR must also be shown as it shows the Total Charge for Credit which might include other charges.

 

So no interest rate = totally unenforceable

No APR = unenforceable without a court order.

 

Regards, Pam

[Peterbard]

Hey i just said APR wasn't a PT which it isnt and like everything else i write on here just lately somebody, rather than check if i am right first jumps on their keyboard and starts to infer i am making it up or something .

 

This has hapened about 6 times now and each time i have had to waste time proviing information that is quite available for any one to find.

 

I am not trying to boost my ego here i am just trying to make sure that the people reading this site are given correct information.

 

 

Peter

[m55dlc]

Peter

 

I wasn't arguing with you (that time) as Pam was. Anyway, we got there in the end and now everyone is happy!

[un1boy]

Ok Peter, so if my agreement only says "I agree to be bound by the terms and condition attahced" but the sig box mentions nothing about the amount of interest, the amount of credit card balance etc then it is unenforcable even with a court order, is that right?

 

That is not what i said i said that APR is not a prescribed term and a agrement can be enforced without it allbeing with the aproval of the court. Interest charged is a prescribed term different things.

Peter

 

Hi Peter,

 

Sorry for any misunderstandings- it has sunken in now and I get it!!

 

Thanks, as ever!!

[un1boy]

But a large TUT TUT to both of you for argueing such a rediculously small point sooooooo strongly and confusing all who were reading it. Both of you could have just said you were arguing over the difference between APR and Interest

 

You're both Naughty and should sit on the naughty step for 5 minutes ( )

 

 

Ahhh...so it wasn't just me then? I thought I was going mad!

[InKogneeToh]

But a large TUT TUT to both of you for argueing such a rediculously small point sooooooo strongly and confusing all who were reading it. Both of you could have just said you were arguing over the difference between APR and Interest

 

You're both Naughty and should sit on the naughty step for 5 minutes ( )

 

Hi

 

We were actually arguing over whether APR was a prescribed term which I think is quite important because I had noticed some members stating that the APR was not present so the agreement was totally unenforceable.

 

I initially thought that this was correct so may have advised people accordingly if 'He Who is Now Looking Very Smug' had not corrected me.

 

Sorry if any confusion was caused but we do now have a definitive answer to that issue at least!

 

P.S Shan't sit on the naughty step!

 

Regards, Pam

[un1boy]

Hey i just said APR wasn't a PT which it isnt and like everything else i write on here just lately somebody, rather than check if i am right first jumps on their keyboard and starts to infer i am making it up or something .

 

This has hapened about 6 times now and each time i have had to waste time proviing information that is quite available for any one to find.

 

I am not trying to boost my ego here i am just trying to make sure that the people reading this site are given correct information.

 

 

Peter

 

 

And, it is much appreciated Peter - it just takes me a while sometimes to get my head around it - the bank in question keep stalling and dragging their feet, and this seems too simple a thing to make the whole agreement unenforcable so I like to make sure I understand it completely before taking action....

[InKogneeToh]

Hey i just said APR wasn't a PT which it isnt and like everything else i write on here just lately somebody, rather than check if i am right first jumps on their keyboard and starts to infer i am making it up or something .

 

This has hapened about 6 times now and each time i have had to waste time proviing information that is quite available for any one to find.

 

I am not trying to boost my ego here i am just trying to make sure that the people reading this site are given correct information.

 

 

Peter

 

U talkin' 'bout me?

[Peterbard]

HI

As a small appology for my outburst i have an illustation of APR you might find enlightening.

Suppose you borrow £120, repayable in instalments of £40 at monthly intervals. The lender charges an up-front fee of £5 for his services. Note that the repayments add up to £120 so the annual interest rate is zero. Yes, an interest-free loan! There is a non-zero APR, though, due to the fee which makes the total repayment £125. That small up-front fee, when applied to a three-month loan, gives an APR of a whopping 29.2 per cent.

[mcuth]

Hi

 

No the interest rate must be shown as a % per annum.

 

The APR must also be shown as it shows the Total Charge for Credit which might include other charges.

 

So no interest rate = totally unenforceable

No APR = unenforceable without a court order.

 

Regards, Pam

 

So, to muddy the waters, what if the agreement only quotes APR, and not a simple %age rate?

 

Cheers

 

Michael

[m55dlc]

So, to muddy the waters, what if the agreement only quotes APR, and not a simple %age rate?

 

Cheers

 

Michael

 

 

Michael, I've already asked that one. No interest rate, no prescribed term present, not enforceable

[Peterbard]

I initially thought that this was correct so may have advised people accordingly if 'He Who is Now Looking Very Smug' :grin: had not corrected me

 

Thats woman speak for i was wrong and i don't now how to look smug;)

 

Peter

[un1boy]

I initially thought that this was correct so may have advised people accordingly if 'He Who is Now Looking Very Smug' :grin: had not corrected me

 

Thats woman speak for i was wrong and i don't now how to look smug;)

 

Peter

 

lol

[mcuth]

Michael, I've already asked that one. No interest rate, no prescribed term present, not enforceable

 

D'oh - sorry, I just saw that was the question that Pam replied to in the message I quoted! :oops:

Time I went home I think

 

Cheers

 

Michael

[InKogneeToh]

 

Thats woman speak for i was wrong and i don't now how to look smug;)

 

Peter

 

Okay, Okay!

 

I WAS WRONG!

 

Is that better?

[Peterbard]

HI Pam

 

I am not one to gloat i have however printed your last post and am off to the shops to buy a nice frame, it will go next to my swimming certificate(5Meter's impressed eh.)

Peter

[un1boy]

HOT OFF THE PRESS!!!

 

Just got off the phone to Information Commissioners Office.

 

Apparently a lender does not require any agreement for processing your data, so if people are requesting agreements for a loan or cc and the lender is unable to produce this, they are quite within their right to report the account activity to the CRA's.

 

Hmm....I think we need to get to the bottom of this - as soon as you get it in writing, let us know.

 

How can they have a legitimate interest in an agreement that is not enforcable and has been "executed" illegally?

 

I don't have access to a dictionary here, but legitimate means lawful surely? Therefore, for agreements that are not enforcable, surely this does stand?

[tifo]

excellent thread and very useful

[m55dlc]

Be aware that even if an agreement is unenforceable, there is still a contract. This is the issue here. Only the agreement is stalled, maybe the ICO are using that bit in their rational ( not sure?)

[un1boy]

Be aware that even if an agreement is unenforceable, there is still a contract. This is the issue here. Only the agreement is stalled, maybe the Information Commissioners Office are using that bit in their rational ( not sure?)

 

But, what if the agreement has been set up unenforcably ie. no prescribed terms - the agreement doesn;t even exist then, surely?

[m55dlc]

The agreement may not exist, but you took the cash, or you bought stuff on the card, therefore a contract remains. Just as an unenforceable debt still exists, the contract between them and us is still present.

 

(as far as I can remember)

[Peterbard]

Apparently a lender does not require any agreement for processing your data, so if people are requesting agreements for a loan or cc and the lender is unable to produce this, they are quite within their right to report the account activity to the CRA's.

 

Absolute nonsense.

 

Peter

[humbleman]

I don't have access to a dictionary here, but legitimate means lawful surely? Therefore, for agreements that are not enforcable, surely this does stand?

 

Legitimate-LAwful, logical reasoning, accepted standards etc

[m55dlc]

Absolute nonsense.

 

Peter

 

Yes Peter, our sentiments exactly, but we're waiting on written confirmation of the ICO's stance (as one of their bods has been saying this) so we're waiting on an email

[Peterbard]

Pam did you look up the credit card cancellation issue??

 

Trying to be a gentleman here.

 

Peter