Kerri -v- HSBC

[Kerri Vaughan]

We have submitted the necessary letters to HSBC, to our surprise just before filling out the court forms they have sent an offer which they require to be accepted as "full and final settlement". In their letter a reply needs to be sent within 7 days. In the interim they have taken more excessive charges from our account. Therefore do we

continue with the court action for the full sum including the new charges, without referring with the bank or do we take court action which includes the new charges.

What would you advise the best route.

[Spiceskull]

Hiya,

 

You have two options:

• Write to them, expressing your utter disgust that they are still applying unlawful penalty charges to your account, and that therefre you will need to amend the value of your claim/settlement to allow for this
  
• Continue with your claim/settlement in its current form, and begin a fresh course of action.

For this second, you should have a read through my "charges pending" threads, and see if you want to go down that route. A word of caution - they will let you get away with claiming once: if you start to claim regularly, they will CERTAINLY close your account, so you need to ensure you have another for safety.

[Kerri Vaughan]

Are there any steps available on this site to show me how to fill out the N1 Claim form

[dollies01]

Hiya!

Michael Browne put this fantastic thread together, that should have all the answers you are looking for:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/site-questions-suggestions/53182-cant-find-what-youre.html

[Kerri Vaughan]

Thank you very much for the advice, I found the site very helpful and got what I needed.

[Kerri Vaughan]

HSBC have issued a Defense and the Court has sent an AQ to be filed by 18 April. I have read some of the Threads am I correct in understanding that I should ring DG and fax over my breakdown of charges and follow up with a phone. How do I fish for an offer from them I am determined only to except a full settlement (£2500). Can you please advise.

[lateralus]

can i ask you= did you file an N1 or an MCOL - doesn't matter - just curious.

 

 

well yes, from the mcol- get it right thread, this:

You Have Issued Your Claim

Once you have filed your claim, you need to send 2 copies of your schedule of charges, clearly marked with your claim no. + a brief covering letter asking for them to be filed with your claim to:

 

 

Quote:

The Court Manager,

Money Claim Online

Northampton County Court

21-27 St. Katharine's Street

Northampton

NN1 2LH

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

(Your Name) –v- (Bank)

Claim No: ********

Date Issued: xx/xx/xx

 

Please find enclosed a schedule of penalty charges taken from me by the defendant, along with interest claimed at the annual rate of 8% pursuant to section 69 of the County Court Act. The interest in addition to the amount in charges equates to the total amount of my claim, namely £(AMOUNT).

 

I respectfully request that the enclosed schedule should be attached to the particulars of my claim.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

Wait until you receive the Notice of Acknowledgement (not the Notice of Issue) from the court and then send a copy to the bank’s solicitors, since they are the ones who will now be dealing with your claim. Their name and address will be on page 2.

 

 

Quote:

Dear Sir,

 

(Your Name) -v- (Bank)

Claim No: ********

Date Issued: xx/xx/xx

 

Please find enclosed a copy of my schedule of charges relating to the above claim.

 

(If, and only if, you are claiming overdraft interest on your penalties, also include this paragraph)

 

 

I understand you have a policy of initially rejecting claims for overdraft interest. However, should this be the case after you have reviewed my claim, you should be aware that my claim for overdraft interest has been meticulously calculated and double checked. It only ever relates to the cumulative charges within the overdrawn balance of the account at the point that the overdraft interest was debited

 

If it is that in your view the interest is not claimable, I am prepared to discuss this with yourseves and the judge in court.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

so, yes, send them (the court where you've been transferred to - and dg)

your breakdown. then follow up with a phone call to dg in a couple of days to see if that one was received.

 

and this:

aq info:

Allocation Questionnaires - A guide to completion

this is your step by step completion guide -and here is:New strategy for Allocation Questionaires

and here is how to use it:

for section g of the n149 (section h on the n150), use the wording in blue on post #3 of new strategy link, and then attach draft order for directions - use wording on post #2 of new strategy link(the bit in blue) making sure to add your name and court claim number to all pages. simple as that. just follow the steps with these two minor additions. the draft order is just asking the judge to order both parties to lay out their wares within 14 days of him ordering it - so it shortens the length of the time to a court date - and as dg/hsbc/all banks don't want to do it - they will pay up by offer or just not file their aq in which case you also win.

 

on, the other front - of this two pronged thing - have you sent dg a breakdown of your charges - it is advisable to do that, as they always ask for one before they offer anything - so it saves a couple of days.

and unless your claim is for under 1500 and wouldn't incur the filing fee of 100, i suggest leaving it until the aq is nearly due before filing it - as dg have been coming in with offers just before the due date in several cases

[Kerri Vaughan]

Hello Lateralus.an N1 was filed.

[mlloyd]

HSBC have issued a Defense and the Court has sent an AQ to be filed by 18 April. I have read some of the Threads am I correct in understanding that I should ring DG and fax over my breakdown of charges and follow up with a phone. How do I fish for an offer from them I am determined only to except a full settlement (£2500). Can you please advise.

 

I am in the same position, basically it's just the latest tactic. Seems they like to string and stretch out the process for as long as they can. Hold out, I am too, we will win.

 

Stay positive.

[Kerri Vaughan]

Can you help me find the draft letter to the Solicitors acting for HSBC that states "I will only accept fully settlement and retain the right to refuse their privacy and any non disclosure". I saw this on the forum before but am now unable to find it.

Thanks.

[nettyg]

not exactly sure what your'e looking for - do you mean a rejection of an offer letter. i can send you the link to those.

 

Rejecting Offers

[Kerri Vaughan]

Hello NettyG I very much appreciate your help.Thank you.Kerri

[Kerri Vaughan]

Submitted AQ on time, have discovered Bank have failed to file their AQ yes (two weeks after due date), what would you anticipate a Judge would order now and what if anything can we do to advance this matter in our favour:?:

[Kerri Vaughan]

Submitted AQ on time, have discovered Bank have failed to file their AQ yes (two weeks after due date), what would you anticipate a Judge would order now and what if anything can we do to advance this matter in our favour:idea:

[Guest ChloeJane]

Hi there,

 

The court has what is called discretionary powers of what they can do if a certain procedure is not followed.

 

Under the Civil Procedure Rules (meaning guidelines..in our terms) you can apply to have their case struck out if they fail to follow the guidelines.

 

You would apply to the court on what is called an N244 form. This is an application form to the court that asks for their defence to be struck out for not complying with the Rules.

 

It would cost £35 to make the application. You would file it at the same court your case will be heard at.

 

The rule that you rely on is what is know as the Civil Procedure Rules 3.4.4.

 

To read more click the link

PRACTICE DIRECTION – STRIKING OUT A STATEMENT OF CASE - This Practice Direction supplements CPR Rule 3.4

 

So you would use this form here

 

http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/courtfinder/forms/n244_0400.pdf

 

There is enough proven evidence that the defences for the banks are flawed, so you could easily state that their is no really reality of defending the case and that they have failed to file the allocation questionaire in time.

 

To fill the form out completely, you may require some help which again, for all the knowledgeable people on this site, they will be sure to assist you.

 

If you need any help i am often in chat. This process would have the costs awarded to you and you would win the case.

 

Hope this helps and is worth doing I believe and a link to some good reading is here!

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/abbey-bank/70029-mariejader-abbey-defence-struck-7.html?highlight=defence+struck+out

 

I am sure the moderators would have a template for this application.

 

All the best

 

CJ

[lateralus]

don't know what the judge will do - probably give them extra time - i'd just carry on nudging to dg - that first letter in the after you've filed your aq is exactly that - i've filed mine, the court says you haven't, let's get this thing over with before more court stuff and that will be an extra hundred, please. just carry on nudging -

 

kerry, please stop starting new threads for every question - we have to look it up - find out where you are - backtrack all over - it is really so much more efficient to just keep to the same thread. we can help so much more quickly. i'm going to ask a moderator to merge your hsbc threads - then please just stick to one., thanks..lattie.

[Whatawoman]

My AQ deadline was 2nd April - as yet DG have not filled their AQ - they know the courts are over stretched with all these claims - the judge in my case did not make an order till 17th April and I am STILL waiting for the court admin staf to type it up - infact theya re so snowed under they have outsoursed to another court - however DG told me after 15 emails, 4 nudge letters, and 7 voice mail messages - all unresponded to! that they are going to be making me an offer this week!

 

So hang on in there but don't expect a speedy response.

 

Helen

[GaryH]

4 threads merged - please try to stick to one in future, as it makes it easier for people to keep track of and we'll be in a better position to advise if your claim timeline is all in one place.

 

Regards to the AQ...

 

If they haven't submitted an AQ you should write a short not to the court to inform them (I think Lattie has one somewhere?). The court should then issue an 'unless' order to HSBC giving them an extra 7 days to submit it, unless the defence will be struck out.

 

Chloe,

 

My personal opinion would be that a formal application for a strike is not really appropriate in the majority of cases.

 

By the time your application is listed for a hearing, at the cost of £65, many banks would have settled by then anyway - especially HSBC - and the application process could actually cause significant further delay. This would certainly be the case if the application went to hearing and was not successful. As I understand it there is also a costs risk too should the application be dismissed.

 

The main problem is that as none of the defences have been tested, or even seen the inside of a court, so I don't think a judge would be able to strike out on the grounds that the defence is flawed or has no realistic prospect of success.

 

The abuse of process angle is far more promising, backed up by Hackney BC -v- Mullen, but many judges - unfortunately! - would probably still take the view that the banks are entitled to access the justice system as anyone else is. I think most courts will remain reluctant to stick their neck out on this issue, as they have up to now.

 

Its a good idea in principle, but in reality I would'nt advise it personally in most cases - especially where the claim is a reletively small amount. IMHO its far better to include a request for that sort of order on the allocation questionnaire. Its easy come, easy go - does'nt cost anything in money or extend the length of your claim, and if the judge dismisses it then you haven't lost anything. This is what Marie used in the claim you linked to above -

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/78216-aqs-stays-strike-out.html#post686509

 

Just my opinion obviously, others may have different views.

 

Gary

[Kerri Vaughan]

Lateralus

Sorry for the extra threads.Thanks for the advice.Do you have a draft for an "unless order" please?

 

GaryH

Thank you.An application for an "unless order" seems reasonable in this circumstance, together with a chaser to DG as also suggested.

 

Chloejane

I appreciate your input also.DG's abuse of filing dates and of due process can only work against them in the long term.

 

Whatawoman

Helen ,Goodluck, hope the offer is full and complete.

[Castlebest]

I think its easy to loose sight of what we are trying to achieve with our claims, once you have filed your claim with the court you are dealing with DG Solicitors these are the people who will make you an offer and you will negotiate and agree your settlement with.

 

To some extent the County Court side is secondary, it’s just a means to force HSBC and DG Solicitors to look at your claim and be reasonable and responsible.

 

To do that you have to complete all of the Court paperwork on time and submit it then comply with any orders or directions the District Judge makes but at the end of the day, unless DG make a mistake and get judgement against them, the court will have nothing to do with your settlement. You will cancel your claim with the court because you have reached a settlement with DG Solicitors (when the money is in the bank).

 

So our primary focus should be on DG. To try to get an offer from them, yes send the court a letter asking for judgement or DG's defense to be struck out but copy it to DG too because at this point they know they are on very thin ice and if they dont get you to withdraw your claim with a full offer they will get judgement agaist them.

 

pete

[Kerri Vaughan]

We have a Court date for end of July our case has been allocated to the small claims track and we have until early June to clairy our claim and serve on HSBC further information or our claim will be struck out. HSBC has until early July to clarify their defense. Similar info and "the basis upon which the charges were calculated".

There is a final paragraph :

"That the Court is of the view that the matter ought to be setted by sensible negotiation or mediation and will take into account the failure of either party to follow such a course when dealing with the question of costs".

Can you now advise, please.

[lateralus]

it sounds like you didn't yet send the court and dg a copy of your schedule of charges or if you did - they were not sufficiently described - could you perchance be an mse follower in the early stages?

 

it is either that - the sending of the schedule of charges lacking or else you particulars of claim weren't up to scratch.

i'll pm you mine and you can compare with what you sent and see if it is that. get back with whether you have sent them a breakdown - if not - take care of it tomorrow - a copy to the court and a copy to dg - referencing your claim number.

 

once you've cleared that up - you should start sending dg nudge letters to encourage them to make an offer before any court dates - ideas for the letters are in the new--after 28 days thread in my signature.

[Kerri Vaughan]

I have sent sch of charges on spreadsheet with dates etc to Court with particulars of claim. When I sentAQ to Court a copy was sent to DG with sch of charges. My letter to DG clearly identified court and claim number. Court were told my AQ went to DG by recorded mail.

What is an mse follower?

 

Other than date, amount of charge and account number, how detailed does a schedule need to be? Surely when each charge is considered in the context of your account being overdrawn this is all that is required?

I will sent nudge letter.

 

thank you.

[pinkduchess]

What is an mse follower?

 

its one of the the 'other' sites - money saving experts.

[lateralus]

on your schedule did you put like total charges, card misuse, recall d/d-s/o. or did you just put a date, and an amount?