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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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Returning online order issue. items from Just BB Guns - both not what i want or faulty - within 14 days.


Goodday

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Hello, 

I bought a Airsoft gun (bb gun.) from Just BB guns. And a mask for airsofting. 
The mask was in a sealed bag and after trying it on isn’t too comfortable, and gets in the way when using it with your gear.(so for me isn’t really fit for purpose.)
And the gun had a loose barrel, which they then  informed me it is suppose to be. and I find that very hard to believe as it’s not going to be very consistent. 
they also said the other ones they have in stock are the same.

And I have had it out the box once (received it on Monday.) and I took it out the box which wasn’t sealed or taped up. 
To check the mechanism I have not fired a BB through it. 

Which I have now noticed have cause the finish in some of the parts to wear off. 
so that’s another disappointed.

They said;

Please be informed that there is no manufacturing fault. You can return the item for repair or replacement if there is a manufacturing issue.

Any item that is faulty at the point of sale may be returned for replacement or refund:

  • WITHIN 28 DAYS from the original date of delivery for REPAIR or REPLACEMENT
  • AFTER 28 DAYS but WITHIN 6 MONTHS from the original date of delivery for REPAIR under warranty
  • AFTER 6 MONTHS all REPAIRS are chargeable to the customer

PLEASE NOTE: A manufacturing fault is an issue that the product has had out of the box and was created as part of the production process. In the case of airsoft guns and pistols, a manufacturing fault is NOT an issue that has developed from hard use or a user error such as dropping the gun or magazine, using incorrect batteries or low-quality BB pellets that get stuck in your gun. Many of our customers use our guns at skirmish events and are treated with a high amount of abuse, which is not covered by the manufacturer’s warranty.

Under the Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013, consumer rights entitle anyone to cancel their order and obtain a full refund if they request one within 7 days after delivery of the goods. With the exception of reconditioned or painted products, to which statutory cancellation rights do not apply. All items must be returned UNOPENED and UNUSED.

................

Now that is their policy, but does that mean I can’t do anything? 
I bought this online last Friday for it on Monday had them out the box and bag once to check them. 

Also I’m in Scotland and the Company is in England. 

I also had a Similar problem, years ago about returning an item and the company stopped replying. I have only remembered due to the situation so not sure with any thing can get down about that?

And had an item break on me after less than 2 months of ownership, and the company says it’s out of warranty with them. 

consumer Scotland was helping me with that but haven’t replied in a week. 

they told em to send an email with read recipients (I can’t do it as I’m only on mobile as my computer is broken.) 

Sorry for the many issues, just seems my luck lately has gotten bad. 
Any help is very much appreciated!

 

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It's not clear who you bought the item from?

Please can you give actual dates.

I understand that you bought some items that there were faulty and the supplier has refused to do anything about it. Is this correct?

Was this an online purchase? How did you pay? How much did you pay?

 

Also, their published policy is not correct. It is an online purchase and you have 14 days to return it for any reason.

If it is defective then you certainly have at least 30 days to reject it and then up to 6 months you can insist on a repair and if they won't repair or if they can't repair or if the repair fails then you could reject it as well.

Let's have some answers to the questions I've put

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  • dx100uk changed the title to Returning online orders issue. items from Just BB Guns and Airsoft - both not what i want - within 14 days.
Quote

1 item from Just BB Guns and 1 item from Airsofting

you dont need any reason to return items within 14 days if purchased online under the old DSR rule (now part of the consumer rights act 2015)

in addition, you have a upto 30days to return faulty items.

both of those have no quibble conditions.

how did you pay?

dx

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • dx100uk changed the title to Returning online orders issue. items from Just BB Guns and Airsofting - both not what i want or faulty - within 14 days.
Quote

Returns and Refunds - Just BB Guns, UKs No1 Airsoft Gun Shop

Under the Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013, consumer rights entitle anyone to cancel their order and obtain a full refund if they request one within 7 days after delivery of the goods. 

 

they are WRONG it's 14 days.

from The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013 (legislation.gov.uk)

Normal cancellation period

30.—(1) The cancellation period ends as follows, unless regulation 31 applies.

(2) If the contract is—

(a)a service contract, or

(b)a contract for the supply of digital content which is not supplied on a tangible medium,

the cancellation period ends at the end of 14 days after the day on which the contract is entered into.

(3) If the contract is a sales contract and none of paragraphs (4) to (6) applies, the cancellation period ends at the end of 14 days after the day on which the goods come into the physical possession of—

(a)the consumer, or

(b)a person, other than the carrier, identified by the consumer to take possession of them.

(4) If the contract is a sales contract under which multiple goods are ordered by the consumer in one order but some are delivered on different days, the cancellation period ends at the end of 14 days after the day on which the last of the goods come into the physical possession of—

(a)the consumer, or

(b)a person, other than the carrier, identified by the consumer to take possession of them.

(5) If the contract is a sales contract under which goods consisting of multiple lots or pieces of something are delivered on different days, the cancellation period ends at the end of 14 days after the day on which the last of the lots or pieces come into the physical possession of—

(a)the consumer, or

(b)a person, other than the carrier, identified by the consumer to take possession of them.

(6) If the contract is a sales contract for regular delivery of goods during a defined period of more than one day, the cancellation period ends at the end of 14 days after the day on which the first of the goods come into the physical possession of—

(a)the consumer, or

(b)a person, other than the carrier, identified by the consumer to take possession of them.

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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You say that you bought it from Airsofting but there doesn't seem to be any such company. This seems to be something called Airsoft which is not a company but is something which is sold by a company called Bunker 51. Is that who you are talking about?

We need you to give us the details that we are asking for and to think about those details carefully before you put them up here because otherwise it makes things very difficult.

In terms of your 14 day right to return, the 14 days does not begin until not only have you been supplied with the item that you have ordered but also that the rules regarding cancellation and return have been explained to you.
As they have given the wrong information, the 14 days has not even begun yet and won't begin for a period of up to 12 months unless the correct information is provided to you.

So it seems in this case, not only you covered with the 30 day right to reject rule under the consumer rights act, but you still have the benefit of the distance selling rules under the The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013 and you are entitled to return the item for any reason.

Please give us the information you're looking for and engage with this thread

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Looks like this is the place... (terms and conditions page) Hmmmm!

https://www.justbbguns.co.uk/terms/

And...

FAULTY PRODUCTS

Any item that is faulty at the point of sale may be returned for replacement or refund:

'Nuff said!

 

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group The National Consumer Service

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16 hours ago, Goodday said:

I bought a Airsoft gun (bb gun.) from Just BB guns. And a mask for airsofting. 

 

9 hours ago, BankFodder said:

You say that you bought it from Airsofting but there doesn't seem to be any such company.

they bought 2 items from justbbguns.

one a gun which is faulty, the other a face mask which is very uncomfortable.

they want to return both within 14 days. and can do so!!

if you paid by debit card simple return the items and go do a chargeback to your bank. stuff justBBguns.

legally you are entitled too.

  • I agree 2

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • dx100uk changed the title to Returning online order issue. items from Just BB Guns - both not what i want or faulty - within 14 days.

Thank you so much and apologies for any typos!

I don’t know what else to say to them as they are being pretty firm, I also haven’t heard of a chargeback
is it easy to do and will it take a while to get my money back?

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chargeback is almost instant.

but sadly depends upon your bank.

dx

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

they were from “justbbguns” 

I received the items on Monday the 22nd of January 2024.

they are saying they aren’t faulty but I think they might be, even if they aren’t I’m not satisfied with them.

it was online yes.

He said it can only be returned for a replacement not a refund.

But there is nothing wrong with the item.

and I’ve also got a similar problem with another item that broke less than 2 months of me owning it and only using it once.

they said it’s out of warranty with them too. 

And another issue from at least 3 years ago and due to Covid and few other issues I forgot about it.

but the company stopped replying to after they said for me to return it for a refund or a replacement. 
I haven’t even used the item.

Thanks very much for your time!

the advice support from consumer Scotland we’re helping me but just stopped replying. 

bought with With RBS debitcard, is it easy to check?

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They are saying  they aren’t faulty, but I’m not sure. 

And if they are suppose to be like they one isn’t comfortable, and the other I’m just not satisfied with; if I knew that from the start I wouldn’t have bought them.

I hope I have given all the information in other posts?

please tell and I’ll get back to you as soon as! 
 

I appreciate your time! 

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please stop hitting quote everytime you post....

just type in the box 

RBS should be ok.

go do a chargeback.

.......

the other 2 older items you are now adding in here to this thread.

1 is outside of 120 days since you got them IN YOUR HANDS, so you cant use chargeback

the other one is. do a chargeback too.

...........................

to clarify a legal point here that justbbguns dont seem to understand looking at their overtly complex T&C's (which are WRONG!!) ...probably written purposefully that way to confuse people and not give legally liable refunds to customers..IS

you dont need any reason to return any item purchased online within 14 days of the customer actually physically receiving it. so claiming it not faulty is immaterial to refusing a customer a FULL REFUND. and they cant dictate a gift card or account credit either...they MUST refund back to the funding source once they have the items if the customer returned them within 14 days of having them.

terrible T&C whomever they got to write them for them. clearly do not understand consumer law.

justbbguns if you are now reading this thread,....get you act together and stop diddling customers out of money!!

dx

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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RBS are saying they aren’t always successful and such, I’m worried if I try this and it doesn’t work this could stop my consumer rights as I’ve tried to take some form of action? 

could I do this with the other two places I’m having issues with?

Sorry about the quotes, I thought that was the way to reply to people directly. 

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cant hurt your CRA rights no.

17 minutes ago, Goodday said:

could I do this with the other two places I’m having issues with?

?? 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hello, 

I filed a chargeback with my bank, and received an automatic reply. 

it said that I may require an individual experts opinion for proof.

And proof that I have sent the items back, which I haven’t done yet,

I don’t want to sent the items back and not get my money back. 

 I’m a bit worried if I have done this all wrong.
Thanks very much!

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nope you havent.

dont worry about returning the items till you have your money.

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hello and many thanks again,

I contacted them with the information you lovely people have supplied me with.

and this was their reply.

”Please be informed that you can return the item it us in the same unused brand-new condition as we sold it to within 7 days of delivery.
Once we receive it back we will check and assist you accordingly.

Under the Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013, consumer rights entitle anyone to cancel their order and obtain a full refund if they request one within 7 days after delivery of the goods. With the exception of reconditioned or painted products, to which statutory cancellation rights do not apply. All items must be returned UNOPENED and UNUSED.
 

  1. Within 7 days of delivery, you can send products back to us UNOPENED and UNUSED
  2. Please download our Product Returns Form from the top of this page
  3. You can request a refund for a single item or the full order
  4. Please provide us with as much information why you do not require the product 
  5. Then please send the product back to us using a RECORDED delivery service 
  6. When we have received your products you will then receive an email from us accepting your refund”

And some links to their terms, but it’s not letting me paste them here.

Im not sure what I should do now, will this have to go to a small claims court of the backcharge doesn’t work?

Thanks so much again!

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and they are wrong it's 14 days.

as long as you've informed them within that time the clock stop so to speak as you've exercised your 'right' 

get the chargeback done and be done with them

when you have the money in your bank.

then send the goods back.

cant keep saying the same thing........

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Actually as they haven't given you the correct information about the cooling off period the 14 days hasn't even started yet.

It can be delayed for up to 12 months and only begins when the formalities have been complied with which includes giving you the correct information about the cooling off period.

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Hello all, 

still no updates from the bank about the charge back I filed. 
 

and for issues I have with other products should I make posts for each of them? 
 

thanks again!

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yes

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Still no word from my bank, so no idea what’s going on. Tried to mess her them a few days ago and nothing back.

they said it may take up to 2 weeks so they have until Thursday. 

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ring and ask?
dx

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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If they try putting you off again, saying they will contact you in XX days, don't accept it!

Tell them that you will expect an answer tomorrow and that you will be calling them.

They are not obviously not taking you seriously... You must now take control of the situation.

  • I agree 1

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