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    • I have just read the smaller print on their signs. It says that you can pay at the end of your parking session. given that you have ten minutes grace period the 35 seconds could easily have been taken up with walking back to your car, switching on the engine and then driving out. Even in my younger days when I used to regularly exceed speed limits, I doubt I could have done that in 35 seconds even when I  had a TR5.
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    • Thank you for posting up the results from the sar. The PCN is not compliant with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4. Under Section 9 [2][a] they are supposed to specify the parking time. the photographs show your car in motion both entering and leaving the car park thus not parking. If you have to do a Witness Statement later should they finally take you to Court you will have to continue to state that even though you stayed there for several hours in a small car park and the difference between the ANPR times and the actual parking period may only be a matter of a few minutes  nevertheless the CEL have failed to comply with the Act by failing to specify the parking period. However it looks as if your appeal revealed you were the driver the deficient PCN will not help you as the driver. I suspect that it may have been an appeal from the pub that meant that CEL offered you partly a way out  by allowing you to claim you had made an error in registering your vehicle reg. number . This enabled them to reduce the charge to £20 despite them acknowledging that you hadn't registered at all. We have not seen the signs in the car park yet so we do not what is said on them and all the signs say the same thing. It would be unusual for a pub to have  a Permit Holders Only sign which may discourage casual motorists from stopping there. But if that is the sign then as it prohibits any one who doesn't have a permit, then it cannot form a contract with motorists though it may depend on how the signs are worded.
    • Defence and Counterclaim Claim number XXX Claimant Civil Enforcement Limited Defendant XXXXXXXXXXXXX   How much of the claim do you dispute? I dispute the full amount claimed as shown on the claim form.   Do you dispute this claim because you have already paid it? No, for other reasons.   Defence 1. The Defendant is the recorded keeper of XXXXXXX  2. It is denied that the Defendant entered into a contract with the Claimant. 3. As held by the Upper Tax Tribunal in Vehicle Control Services Limited v HMRC [2012] UKUT 129 (TCC), any contract requires offer and acceptance. The Claimant was simply contracted by the landowner to provide car-park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner. Accordingly, it is denied that the Claimant has authority to bring this claim. 4. In any case it is denied that the Defendant broke the terms of a contract with the Claimant. 5. The Claimant is attempting double recovery by adding an additional sum not included in the original offer. 6. In a further abuse of the legal process the Claimant is claiming £50 legal representative's costs, even though they have no legal representative. 7. The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety. It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all. Signed I am the Defendant - I believe that the facts stated in this form are true XXXXXXXXXXX 01/05/2024   Defendant's date of birth XXXXXXXXXX   Address to which notices about this claim can be sent to you  
    • pop up on the bulk court website detailed on the claimform. [if it is not working return after the w/end or the next day if week time] . When you select ‘Register’, you will be taken to a screen titled ‘Sign in using Government Gateway’.  Choose ‘Create sign in details’ to register for the first time.  You will be asked to provide your name, email address, set a password and a memorable recovery word. You will be emailed your Government Gateway 12-digit User ID.  You should make a note of your memorable word, or password as these are not included in the email.<<**IMPORTANT**  then log in to the bulk court Website .  select respond to a claim and select the start AOS box. .  then using the details required from the claimform . defend all leave jurisdiction unticked  you DO NOT file a defence at this time [BUT you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 ] click thru to the end confirm and exit the website .get a CPR 31:14 request running to the solicitors https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?486334-CPR-31.14-Request-to-use-on-receipt-of-a-PPC-(-Private-Land-Parking-Court-Claim type your name ONLY no need to sign anything .you DO NOT await the return of paperwork. you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 from the date on the claimform.
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OPS ANPR PCN - Llangrannog Car Park overstay


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Hello

 

For background on holiday in Wales and looking for somewhere to eat. Came to the car park, spotted a pub and went to check if serving food however didn't see the queue round the corner. Thought we would wait as queue moving and if staying try to buy a parking ticket but then said no room at the inn so back to the car and left. Times goes and we didn't notice it was 17 mins. Received PCN few days later.  Haven't corresponded with them nor appealed and know it's not a fine (have read other posts) so grateful for any advice. Didn't take photos so no evidence.

 

 

1 Date of the infringement

07/09/2021
 

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date]

15/09/2021
 

3 Date received

18/09/2021
 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?]

Yes
 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event?

Yes
 

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal]

No
 

 

7 Who is the parking company?

One Parking Solution

 

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town]

Llangrannog (Beach) car park, West Wales
 

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under.

POPLA

OPS Sept.pdf

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Well done on reading previous threads and putting and understanding everything properly!!

 

Sit on your hands see if they eventually issue a letter of claim

dx

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Llangrannog car park is notorious for the over issue of PCNs.

 

If you put in its name followed by "Charges" or "Fines" on line you will see many entries and the local newspapers have taken on OPS. Their machine was not working for a while so the company gave a phone number to call and pay. Sadly for motorists the phone signal wasn't good enough.

 

Then a lawyer found out that apparently when the machine was fixed, the time wasn't right so that people including her were charged for overstaying, when they hadn't . She went to court and won but of course many people just paid up, In your case, even their own photos show you weren't parked. Waiting for a parking spot is not parking. 

 

As dx100uk says just sit on your hands and see if they can take the heat. You will get lots of letters putting up the price with no legal justification and  endless unregulated debt collectors saying the same thing. It is completely safe to ignore them all. Perhaps several months down the line or maybe several years down the line they might pluck up the courage to threaten you with Court-a letter headed something like Letter Before Action. then come back to us and we will advise you from there.

 

Only a small proportion of motorists get taken to court and they tend to be mostly the ones who write when they are innocent. This tells OPS that they will probably pay up at least £100 if threatened. So just ignore them and they may well pass you by.

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Yes have seen the posts about this car park on here and FB, as well as about the lawyer who took them on. Another robdog company catching people. We stopped at a few other places many with honesty boxes for parking and more than happy to pay as it goes toward the local community etc. 

Anyways we will wait for the inevitable letters and definitely come back if I get a LBA.

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  • 4 weeks later...

:cheer2:- - yep safe to ignore

 

dx

 

  • Thanks 1

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 4 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

Second reminder letter from ZZPS and now followed up by one from QDR solicitors requiring over £180 in the next fourteen days otherwise may result in recommending litigation. Not a LoC/LBA so filed for the moment.

Tierisch

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On 17/10/2021 at 22:11, dx100uk said:

:cheer2:- - yep safe to ignore

 

dx

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 4 months later...

open

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Update on their antics

One more letter from QDR solicitors in January

A final demand from OPS (the amount has gone down from the other threatograms)

A new one from Trace debt recovery (and the amount has gone up)

Being filed and ignored

Tierisch

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:rockon:

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 3 months later...

open

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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The thing to note from the newspaper article is that all the signage is visible at the entrance. But unless you stop your car at the entrance and read the signs before entering you cannot be deemed to have accepted the terms just because you drove into the car park. I doubt that most drivers would stop at the entrance but go and park and then read the signs after  since it is impossible to read all the signs while driving through the entrance.

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Good point and even if someone did stop to read signs how impractical. I dislike these money grabbers who have a piece of land in a popular place and want to charge exorbitant prices. Welcome to Wales!

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  • 1 year later...

Any update here?

I ask as a Cagger was in court yesterday with these parasites - and the Cagger gave them a good hiding.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

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  • 6 months later...

Not heard anything from them since last post.

I've just moved guess might be wise to tell them new address to avoid backdoor action.

I missed the last post here interesting to read about the success of one poster.

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Yes update them of your new address.

DVLA Twice as well. One for V5 document (car) and other for your licence. One letter doesn't cover both unfortunately

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group - The National Consumer Service

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Lolerz is spot on.

It just needs a 2-line letter saying you've moved from A to B.  Invest in a 2nd class stamp and get a free Certificate of Posting from the post office.

This is essential.  Just about every week we get someone on CAG who has lost a court case by default as the papers went to the wrong address.

If you want to read about ghedgehog's thrashing of them in court, it's here  https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/454551-opsdcbl-2xpcns-paploc-now-claimform-machine-said-not-in-use-llangrannog-beach-car-park-west-wales-claim-dismissed/#comment-5114713

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

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dont forget any historic credit debts too that you last used or paid in the last say 7 yrs.

you dont want a backdoor CCJ.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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