Horizon PCN ***CANCELLED BY SAINSBURY'S***

[johnjordan]

Hi,

I have recently been given a blue badge and registered it at my local Sainsbury store who say that I do not have to bother with getting a ticket or pay for parking in their car park.

 

Today I received a parking charge notice from Horizon stating that the registered keeper either failed to pay or didn't validate for the duration of his/her stay.

 

The date of alleged offence is 29th February and I received the first letter today, it is dated 17th March 2020.

I understand I have to be informed within 14 days so to save your time and mine in filling out your template, should I just ignore it for now?

 

I am anxious to cost them as much money as possible before telling them about the Blue Badge scheme as they obviously didn't check with the store.

 

Finally, the alleged offence was captured by ANPR, no windscreen ticket was involved.

 

Thank you.

[dx100uk]

cant see the point in a registration scheme if sainsbury don't ensure horizon don't put your reg number into the ANPR ignore list?

check its actually been done?

 

dx

 

[johnjordan]

I have tried phoning them but had to give up after 30 minutes. I have sent a message via facebook but no reply as yet. I appreciate they're busy. Anyway, surely as it's outside of the 14 days I can ignore it?

[lookinforinfo]

No you can't ignore it.

 

All it means is that the keeper is now not liable to pay the ticket if the driver does not pay.

 

Horizon now have to find the name and address of the driver before they can sue the driver.

That does not mean that they will stop pursuing you as the keeper even sending  unregisterd debt collector letters and low quality solicitors and ramping up the costs.

 

If you have not appealed as yet and you have not revealed who was driving then it will be difficult for Horizon to get any money from you. It may be that your facebook appeal may have given away whether you were the driver. 

 

You should not contact Horizon until or if you receive a letter of Claim from them threatening Court action.

This is usually many months down the road

 

 I note your desire to string them along but sometimes it is best just to contact Sainsbury Head office, explaining the situation as you did on post one with a view to getting them to cancel it for you. It is usually better to ask that within a few days of the ticket

but you are where you are.

 

[dx100uk]

or goto the store and do it again.

 

dx

 

[johnjordan]

Thank you both for your replies/

 

I have deleted that facebook post but have messaged them instead but so far no answer.

I plan to go to the store on Monday to see what they are going to do about it, if anything.

I'll keep you updated. I have no plan whatsoever to tell them who the driver was.

[johnjordan]

Hi all and thanks for the advice.

I went to the store yesterday and was told they had not put my details into their computer. 

The woman on the service desk corrected that while I waited and put my letter in a folder, along with quite a few others from Horizon, so it looks like they are not making much money there.

 

Can I just clear up a point please? The NTK was dated 17 days after the alleged offence and I had always thought that I had to receive it within 14 days otherwise it was null and void, but post #4 suggests different. Could you clarify that for me please?

 

Thanks again.

[FTMDave]

In England people can sue anyone for anything.  If I had your address, I could send you lots of threatening letters saying I don't like the shirt you're wearing today and you have to pay me £100, and I could go on MCOL or wander down to my local county court and sue you for the £100.  Of course as soon as a judge saw the claim it'd be thrown out of court.

 

So yes, the POFA 2012 states strict time scales for the PPCs to create keeper liability, but don't expect them to bother to respect the law.  They will threaten and indeed start court action knowing they have no right whatsoever to the money, hoping the motorist won't know the law & will wet themselves and cough up.  Unfortunately most people do.

 

A problem we often have here is that motorists appeal, thinking they are dealign with honest brokers, out themselves as the driver, and lose their protection under the POFA.

[johnjordan]

Thanks for that.

So I assume that Horizon could't have done anything anyway.

 

[FTMDave]

Their claim is certainly pants. 

 

Won't stop them sending you loads of "threatening" letters though, hoping you don't know the law.  Just have a laugh at them.

 

But come back here if they send a Letter Before Action, that's the time to act.

 

 

[johnjordan]

Thank you.

[ericsbrother]

Chase sainsburys HQ rather than the store.

I will send you a private message with the person who deals with such things at HQ email addy and make suggestions of what to say to them.

 

as it stands there is no keeper liability and Horizon havemore than likely breached the GDPR and the DVLA KDOE contracst in obtaining your details. This should be rammed down Sainsburys throats along with the assertion they are employing crooks

[johnjordan]

Thanks to the efforts of people in this group the ticket has now been cancelled and Sainsburys have, as Ericsbrother says, had their parking company rammed down their throats, lol.

 

Thank you again.

[FTMDave]

Well done on your victory!

 

How did Sainsbury's let you know?  If by e-mail, keep it.  If by phone, e-mail them to confirm the phone call.  The reason for this is that later on the fleecers could well "forget" they've been told to cancel, they have previous for this.

[honeybee13]

Excellent news, well done everybody.

 

HB

[ericsbrother]

email with me cc'd.

It would be nice to thnk that they start to look at the behaviour of their servants rather than blithely saying it is between the customer and the parking co though becasue it is not that simple.

[brassnecked]

If the PPC acted unlawfully and the signs are illegal, then like a Council is liable for any misdeeds of a bailiff they send, Sainsbury are vicariously liable for the PPC jointly and severally.

[ericsbrother]

Indeed and they were told this but they like to pretend that things are different because that way they dont have to tell the shareholders they are a bunch of incompetents costing the business money by not knowing their job.

backside covering, face saving, whatever you like to call it pen pushers in large organisations like to make sure their CV is spotless so they can get promoted or move on and screw up someone else's business without actually taking any responsibilty for their actions.

It works at boardroom level and always has. look at the people at the head of the UK banks, they have all left another bank under a cloud but still get the top job- why? The people who give them the job are in the same small boat so cock ups at a lower level that only affect customers are forgivable