@SwintonGroup - deny deny deny - Insurance Mistake - ***Won***

[Foxy100474]

Hi,
I need so advise please,

i purchased a new vehicle in November and transferred my existing car insurance policy to the new vehicle,

just before Christmas i was rear ended by somebody on my way home,

the third party accepted all responsibility and her insurance agreed to complete all repairs to my vehicle (£7000).

Today i received a email from them stating they would no longer be willing to do this as my vehicle was uninsured!!!

I have rung my insurance company to enquire why this is as all my payments have been made and are up to date!

It turns out that when i altered the policy to the new vehicle online the last 2 letters were typed in the wrong way round,

 

as this was clearly not done maliciously i thought that they would honour the policy but they have informed me that they cannot do that hence meaning i was not insured at the time of the accident!!!

Is this correct?

is there anyone i can contact who would know??

[honeybee13]

Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

Please bear with us, people will be able to advise you on this.

 

Best, HB

[Foxy100474]

Thank you

 

[BankFodder]

First of all, don't worry. The insurer is not permitted to deny responsibility simply on an administrative errors like this.

What you are getting here is a standard attempt to deny liability by an insurance company. They make their money by not paying out not by paying out.

Which insurer are you dealing with?

 

The rules that control them and require that you were treated fairly and that in particular in your case that they do not deny liability on the basis of some administrative defect, are contained in ICOBS.

I can't remember which rule but here is a link to the ICOBS regulations  https://www.handbook.fca.org.uk/handbook/ICOBS/

 

I will probably have to give a fuller reply to this tomorrow or Monday

[BankFodder]

Quote

Exclusion of liability and conditions

ICOBS 2.5.1R01/01/2016RP

1. (1) 

   A firm must not seek to exclude or restrict, or rely on any exclusion or restriction of, any duty or liability it may have to a customer or other policyholder unless it is reasonable for it to do so and the duty or liability arises other than under the regulatory system.

 

https://www.handbook.fca.org.uk/handbook/ICOBS/2/5.html

 

There is more but that will do to begin with.

If the registration error has not affected the risk – and clearly it is unlikely to have done so in the case of an accident, then the insurer has no basis for denying liability.

If the registration error has affected the value, for instance, by changing the year and therefore the value of the vehicle then that might have an effect on the payout – but not on the decision to agree or to deny liability

[Foxy100474]

Thanks for your response Bankfodder, I'm not sure where i stand with this though as it was myself that inputted the details online incorrectly. Also its not even my insurance company (SWINTON) that would be paying out, the third party was willing to cover everything!

 

All i needed to do was prove i was insured, which as far as i was aware i was!

Swinton had been taking my payments and even started to process my claim before the third party agreed to accept responsibility!

 

I've also been told about the consumer insurance act 2013, this states that if the misinformation to the insurance company was neither intentional or reckless and it was just careless, that the insurance company should honour the insurance and issue a letter of indemnity for the time of the incident!

 

Again i dont know if this is correct or not

[BankFodder]

Don't worry, if the details were inputted in error and have no bearing on the risk – in other words the accident – then the insurer will not be able to deny liability. They will not be able to deny that you are insured.

It would be scarcely believable that the fact that you had incorrectly entered your registration details could be the cause of the accident – but maybe want to say different?

[unclebulgaria67]

Agree that the Insurers cannot void/cancel Insurance, if it was only the registration number that was wrong.

 

If however, the Insurers found the Car make/model information using the  registration number you entered incorrectly and they only agreed the Insurance on the particular  make/model, then it may be a bit more complicated.

 

If the make/model of the correct registration number is not one they would have Insured you for and they can prove this is the case, then the Insurers may have a case.

 

For example, registration  XX69 1AC may be for a Ford Focus 1.1 LX basic model.

 registration XX69 1CA may be for a Ford Focus 2.5 RS ( top of the range sports model)

For your age and driver experience they may not have been able to Insure you for the 2.5 RS model.

 

In your policy documents, there should be a page or pages which contain the vehicle details.  It the make/model shown the same as your car  ?  If not, I would suggest that you see if the Insurers will provide a  quote for your car make/model.   If they will provide cover for the make/model, then this means that the Insurers should not void/cancel the Insurance, but should ask that you pay any extra premium involved.  On payment of any extra premium, the Insurers could then update the policy and motor insurance database with the correct registration number.

[Foxy100474]

unclebulgaria67

The make and model, engine size and year are all exactly the same, when i spoke to Swinton all the did was change the letters around and send me a updated insurance certificate, no change to the cost or change of any other vehicle details!

What do i do now? 

what do i need to say to Swinton?

[BankFodder]

In thay case, stop worrying and either I or @unclebulgaria67 will advise you what to do

[Foxy100474]

Brilliant, thank you so so much

 

[unclebulgaria67]

Speak to Swinton.  They need to make sure the Motor Insurance Database (MID) has the registration corrected from the date you took out the policy, so the car shows as continually Insured.

 

At the  moment,  the MID may be showing you as not Insured for a period when the accident happened, which is what the third party insurers are indicating.  If the MID cannot be corrected going back in  time, get Swinton to confirm Insurance to the third party Insurers.

[Foxy100474]

I spoke to Swinton and they told me that i would not be insured for that period because they cannot back date the policy with the correct registration details to cover the time of the accident!

[unclebulgaria67]

Who actually underwrites the policy ?  This will be shown on the Insurance certificate.

 

Swinton are brokers and probably not the underwriters.

[Foxy100474]

pukka i believe but ill check

 

[Manxman in exile]

Apologies if I'm missing the point here(?) but what relevance is it whether the OP was insured or not in respect of this incident?

 

The OP says:   "...the third party accepted all responsibility and her insurance agreed to complete all repairs to my vehicle (£7000). Today i received a email from them stating they would no longer be willing to do this as my vehicle was uninsured!!!"

 

If the third party insurer has accepted liability, is the OP's insurance status relevant at all?  The OP isn't claiming against his insurance.

 

Is it really the case that an at fault third party can evade liability just because the no fault party is not insured?

 

(I'm assuming here for the sake of argument that the OP may not be insured - though I suspect he probably is)

 

[Foxy100474]

Its a question i've asked myself! 

 

unclebulgaria67

Yes PUKKA insurance are the underwriters 

[unclebulgaria67]

Third party is saying an uninsured car should not be on the road i.e. illegal, so we are not paying.

 

Suggest contacting MIB, as they are responsible for the MID database, so can confirm that the database can be corrected by the Underwriters.

 

Motor Insurers' Bureau

Linford Wood House

6-12 Capital Drive

Linford Wood

Milton Keynes

MK14 6XT

Telephone Number: 01908 830 001

 

 

[Foxy100474]

Yes i will try them on Monday, all i need is for Swinton to provide me with something that says i was insured on that date! Its just getting them to do it.

 

[unclebulgaria67]

Pukka Insurance are a Gibraltar registered company.  Bad combination, Swinton and a Gibraltar registered Insurers.  Both to be avoided, as they have awful reputations for customer service and claims handling.

 

Pukka Insurance have a freephone as well 0800 2404 989, but this should really be easy for Swinton to resolve.

 

Swinton complaints number 0161 2361222

 

Carol Banks is head of complaints for Swinton

 

[email protected]

 

[Foxy100474]

Thank you, i will email her now, do i just repeat the points that have been made on here?

[unclebulgaria67]

Yes you can.  It should be an easy data correction and confirmation of Insurance from when you bought the policy for the car.

[Manxman in exile]

33 minutes ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

Third party is saying an uninsured car should not be on the road i.e. illegal, so we are not paying...

 

 

 

I understand what the third party insurer is saying.  I'm surprised it makes a difference.  I simply would not have thought the legality or otherwise of the OP's car on the road would have any relevance where a third party insurer has already admitted liability.

 

If a driver wiped out a moped rider or cyclist on a motorway, could the driver's insurers evade liability because they shouldn't have been there?

 

(Sorry - not trying to derail the thread as it's probably a moot point.  But if I were the OP I think it's a question I'd quite like to know the answer to).

[BankFodder]

You are not derailing the thread and I think your questions are very relevant. Even if they're not relevant to this thread, they raise useful issues

[Foxy100474]

 

This is what i plan on sending to Swinton, does this seem ok or do i need to add anything else?

 

Quote

 

         I am writing to you to complain about a decision made by your company that i believe is incorrect!

 

I purchased a new vehicle in November and transferred my existing car insurance policy to the new vehicle, just before Christmas i was rear ended by somebody on my way home, the third party accepted all responsibility and her insurance agreed to cover all cost arising from the accident.

I have since received a email from them stating they would no longer be willing to do this as my vehicle was uninsured!!!
 

It turns out that when i altered the policy to the new vehicle online the last 2 letters were typed in the wrong way round, as this was clearly not done maliciously i thought that you would honour the policy but i have informed now been that you cannot do that hence meaning i was not insured at the time of the accident!

 

All payments have been taken by Swinton and the vehicle make, model, age and engine size is exactly the same.  Furthermore, my inadvertent technical error has in no way affected the risk.

I have since sought advice on this matter and have been informed that is not the case at all.

 

If the registration error has not affected the risk – and clearly it is unlikely to have done so in the case of an accident, then you have no basis for denying liability.

It would be scarcely believable that the fact that i had incorrectly entered my registration details could be the cause of the accident.

 

Also the the consumer insurance act 2013 states that if the misinformation to the insurance company was neither intentional or reckless and it was just careless, that the insurance company should honour the insurance and issue a letter of indemnity for the time of the incident! 

 

I will be also be contacting MID, so as to confirm that the database can be corrected by the Underwriters.

 

I would remind you that under the FCA regulations Swinton are required to treat me fairly and in my case you do not deny liability on the basis of some administrative defect.