Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • Few tweaks as the run order was completely messed up and the main point of your defence (reconstituted agreement) pushed to the bottom of the statement.   I, XXXXXX, being the Defendant in this case will state as follows; I make this Witness Statement in support of my defence in this claim and further to my set aside application dated 1 November 2022. 1.The claimants witness statement confirms that it mostly relies on hearsay evidence as confirmed by the drafts in person in the opening paragraph. It is my understanding they must serve notice to any hearsay evidence pursuant to CPR 33.2(1)(B) (notice of intention to rely on hearsay evidence) and Section 2 (1) (A) of the Civil Evidence Act. 2.  I understand that the claimant is an Assignee, a buyer of defunct or bad debts, which are bought on mass portfolios at a much reduced cost to the amount claimed and which the original creditors have already wrote off as a capital loss and claimed against taxable income as confirmed in the claimants witness statement exhibit by way of the Deed of Assignment. 3. As an assignee or creditor as defined in section 189 of the CCA this applies to this new requirement on assignment of rights.  This means that when an assignee purchases debts (or otherwise acquires rights under a credit agreement) it also acquires certain obligations to the borrower including the duty to comply with CCA requirements (such as the rules on statements and notices and other post-contractual information).  The assignee becomes the creditor under the agreement. This ensures that essential consumer protections under the CCA cannot be circumvented by assigning the debt to a third party. 4.  I became aware of original Judgement following a routine credit check on or around 14th September 2020. 5. The alleged letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 was served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018, no effort was made to ascertain my correct address.  I have attached a copy of my tenancy agreement which is marked ‘Appendix 1’ and shows I was residing at a difference address as of 11 December 2018 and was therefore not at the service address at the time the proceedings were served.  I have also attached an email from my solicitors to the Claimants solicitors dated 14 July 2022 which was sent to them requesting that they disclose the trace of evidence they utilised prior to issuing the proceedings against me.  This is marked ‘Appendix 2’. The claimants solicitors did not provide me with these documents. 6. Under The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims 2017 a Debt Buyer must undertake all reasonable enquiries to ensure the correct address of a debtor, this can be as simple as a credit file search. The Claimant failed to carry out such basic checks. Subsequently all letters prior to and including ,The Pre action Protocol letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 and the claim form dated 14th February 2020 were all served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018. 7. Upon the discovery of the Judgement debt, I made immediate contact with the Court and the Claimant Solicitors, putting them on notice that I was making investigations in relation to the Judgement debt as it was not familiar to me.  I asked them to provide me with a copy of the original loan agreement but this was not provided to me.   The correspondence to the Claimant Solicitor's is attached and marked ‘Appendix 3’ 8. On (insert date) I successfully made application to set a side the judgment. The claim proceeded to allocation, 9. The claimant failed to comply with the additional directions ordered by District Judge Davis on the 2 February 2024 'The Claim shall be automatically struck out at 4pm on 3 April 2024 unless the Claimant delivers to the Court and to the Defendant the following documents.' None of these documents were received by the court nor the defendant by that date. (insert date you did receive the documents) I then sent a Data Subject Access Request to Barclays but no agreement was provided. Details the timeline of communication between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 4’and the copies of correspondence between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 5’. Remove irrelevant 10.The claimant relies upon and has exhibited a reconstituted version of the alleged agreement. It is again denied that I have ever entered into an agreement with Barclaycard on or around 2000.  It is admitted that I did hold other credit agreements with other creditors and as such should this be a debt that was assigned to Barclaycard from another brand therefore the reconstituted agreement disclosed is invalid being pre April 2007 and not legally enforceable pursuant to HHJ Judge Waksman in Carey v HSBC 2009 EWHC3417.  Details of this are attached and marked ‘Appendix 6’. The original credit agreement must be provided along with any reconstituted version on a modified credit agreement and must contain the names and address of debtor and creditor, agreement number and cancelation clause. 11. Therefore the claimant is put to strict proof to disclose a true executed legible agreement on which its claim relies upon and not mislead the court. 12. It is denied I have ever received a default Notice pursuant to sec 87(1) CCA1974.The claimant is put to strict proof to evidence from the original creditors internal document software the trigger of said notice.  13.   As per CPR 1.4(2)(a) the court encourages parties to cooperate with each other in the conduct of proceedings in order to try and save time and costs for the parties and to also save the time and resources of the court however, despite vast attempts at mediation the claimants have been most unreasonable and have remained unwilling to mediate. 14. Until such time the claimant can comply and disclose a true executed copy of the original assigned agreement they refer to within the particulars of this claim they are not entitled while the default continues, to enforce the agreement pursuant to section 78.6 (a) of the Credit Consumer Act 1974. I believe that the facts stated in this Witness Statement are true.  I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. Signed                 ………………………………………………….. Name                  XXXX Date                     30 April 2024   Run 3 copies Court /Claimants Sol/File
    • As one of you mentioned above I've been in a mess for nearly 20 years now and I'm ready to sort my credit report out now - the main reason I got into second round of debt is my kids being unwell and the state considering them not unwell enough for extra help so despite my son being in hospital for 3 months in one year we got extra zero help and I eventually lost my job and got into debt to just so I can be تا my sons hospital bed at his time of need - my life basically fell apart and all these debts got me again 
    • Gosh mate I've woke up this morning with half the worry I had last night when going to sleep!.  I can't believe how much this forum has helped me over the years and I don't  have the words to explain the gratitude I feel towards you guys -  Now that I've slept on it I feel ready to reject this company and my plan is to make them an offer to accept payments to date as full and final settlement - I will I think write them a letter once my review is completed or maybe just send it now whilst they are reviewing explaining my kids are unwell for which reason I'm struggling to survive and if I can politely request for them to accept payment to date as a full and final - I'll mention I don't have any cash or anyone to borrow from to offer a full or even part amount of the remaining balance of the iva and therfore am unable to make a offer of payment.   If they agree to at least even put my offer to the creditors then I feel it's better I hang in there and that way I won't have to deal with any possibilities of more defaults and ccjs    Right now the only adverse effects on my credit report are the iva that is now 3 years old and 2 Ccj one coming of this July and one thus October.    But I am worried new action will begin and new defaults and Ccj may start to appear because I've paying into an agreement im under the impression the 6 year rules starts again so yes I have lost of mixed feelings about this but I'm not going to lie you guys have put some life back into my breath this week as for the last 3 years I've felt caged like an animal and this morning I feel freer I can't explain how much but certainly my soul feel lighter today thanks to yin because I'm now viewing this review totally different to I do yesterday thanks to you guys 
    • Court name UNKNOWN Case number ********** Amount N/A Confirmed by Insolvency Service Date issued May 2021 Type Voluntary Arrangement Notes If you have questions about voluntary arrangements you should speak to the Insolvency Service.     I started this in 2021. So it's been about 3 years I've been paying. 
    • Thanks @lookinforinfo@Nicky Boyi sent across the agreement earlier in this thread. No mention of financial reward to the MA. But, I wouldn't be surprised if it was done on the sly. As I said earlier, the owner of OPS is a convicted criminal, with a very shady reputation around these parts.
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Andy B v's hsbc About Ready to go.....(ish)


andrewjb2
style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 6266 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

it's about 10 days ago i first read those words - i know of at least two off the top of my headand i'm sure i've seen others with this wording and one of those has taken the offer but for personal reasons - needed a quick finish. the other, just sent a rejection letter, that was last week, but as for yours- i didn't want to just tell you what i thought - so i have pm'd a question about that - whether to just reject or to try to explain the reasoning behind claiming for the o/d interest - (which isn't difficult: the portion of overdraft interest which was incurred due to the applying of unlawful charges is also reclaimable - it's not rocket science) but what to do about the offer just reject or send some wording about the o/d interest? - as i started to say - i've pm'd 5 of the brightest sparks around and will get back to you with what i get as soon as.....

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Replies 79
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

ok, 2 out of 5 back to me so far and it is as i thought - IF, you used vampiress' spreadsheet to figure the overdraft interest - you will only have been claiming for the portion of o/d interest which was applicable to the unlawful charges and as such - the advice would be it is reclaimable just as the 8% is reclaimable, so, send the rejection letter and sit tight.

now, i'll try to clear up whether to tell them or just send the template letter tweaked to your case. i'll get back to you.

conversely, if you didn't use vampiress' s/s and/or claimed all the overdraft interest that had been debited - think you'd better take the offer. ok so far?

Link to post
Share on other sites

that's 3 out of 5 now - saying the same thing - that those charges done properly are reclaimable. still toying with what to write back - a total rejection or accept it as partial and state you are confident in what you've asked for and the clock is ticking.....

if you read all the threads - you'll see another one tonight where i've had to explain that you can't just total up the o/d charges and reclaim them.

i'm confident you've done it correctly and i think were it my claim - i'd put a little something in there like, "you will be aware of the fact that overdraft interest which was caused solely by the application of the bank's unlawful charges is reclaimable and it is that portion of the overdraft interest which I am claiming in this action." or something like that. you seem a clever chappy - you get the drift. (always polite, but firm in your resolve - take that approach),

hang on another day if you want my final verdict - but i think we see where this is going.

Link to post
Share on other sites

that's 3 out of 5 now - saying the same thing - that those charges done properly are reclaimable. still toying with what to write back - a total rejection or accept it as partial and state you are confident in what you've asked for and the clock is ticking.....

if you read all the threads - you'll see another one tonight where i've had to explain that you can't just total up the o/d charges and reclaim them.

i'm confident you've done it correctly and i think were it my claim - i'd put a little something in there like, "you will be aware of the fact that overdraft interest which was caused solely by the application of the bank's unlawful charges is reclaimable and it is that portion of the overdraft interest which I am claiming in this action." or something like that. you seem a clever chappy - you get the drift. (always polite, but firm in your resolve - take that approach),

hang on another day if you want my final verdict - but i think we see where this is going.

 

Yep, thats spot on. As long as you have worked it out properly, write back along the same lines as Lat's has suggested, also making it clear that you are perfectly willing to pay interest on money's you borrow by way of overdraft - but absolutely not that which was levied on top of and solely as a result of unlawful charges. You consider that for HSBC to keep these gains would amount to unjust enrichment, and you are confident a court would also see it that way.

Please remember to DONATE! Help CAG keep up the fight!

 

 

Any advice or opinion is offered informally & without liability. Use your own judgment and if in doubt seek advice of a qualified and insured professional.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I am going to double check my spreadsheets today at work and amend to remove the charges struck off by DG (prior to court action date - 6 years.)

 

Once I have composed the letter I post it on here and get it sent.

 

Thanks again everyone.

Andy.

 

 

:D :D :D :D :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

well, that's it then - the definitive answer - thanks, you guys.

 

one more thing, andy, in my haste.

ring the court, tell them bank has made an offer, you are negotiating and are hoping for a quick resolution so could you please have an extension on the aq deadline - they may want it in writing, but they will do it - that's important, to keep that side going until you have the money - the extension in the way to go.

nearly there!

 

i'm having a rethink and wondering if you should press dg on your aq deadline. yes, i think put a line or two about how your aq is due imminently and if you haven't heard from them by Friday, you will be filing and it will then require another £100 to settle your claim.

 

hold off ringing the court until frid - and if they say yes, to the delay, ok , if they say no, then you will have to file and worm another 100 out of dg.

also, your letter won't get there before friday - could you do it and fax it and ring dg. i think it's a very close call, is your aq ready? i totally believe you'll be settled very soon but you can't hold off on the aq (they seem to get a break of one week or more by the courts but i wouldn't chance it,) pm a mod quickly if you want a firmer opinion. but i'm pretty sure - dg tend to act pretty quickly on the second offer - i think a weeks ext. would cover it. so ring the court friday before 4pm.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Right them... faxed emailed and posted letter as below:

 

Rachel Tomlinson

DG Solicitors

12 Calthorpe Road

Edgbaston

Birmingham

B15 1QZ

 

BY FAX, EMAIL & RMRD

14th February 2007

 

HSBC Account: ****** ********

Claim Reference: ********

Dear Sir/Madam,

Thank you for your letter dated 09/02/07.

 

I respectfully decline your offer of Full and Final settlement and request, once again, that you return to me all charges imposed on this account. I have removed charges prior **/01/2006 in hope of a speedy resolution.

The revised total value of my claim is detailed below:

PENALTIES & INTEREST ON PENALTIES CLAIMED

£3,***.**

TOTAL INTEREST CLAIMED AT 8%

£7**.**

COURT FEE

£120.00

TOTAL CLAIM

£4,4**.**

 

A detailed breakdown is enclosed.

 

You will be aware of the fact that overdraft interest which was caused solely by the application of the bank's unlawful charges is reclaimable and it is that portion of the overdraft interest which I am claiming in this action. I am perfectly willing to pay interest on money's borrowed by way of overdraft - but absolutely not that which was levied on top of and solely as a result of unlawful charges.

I hope the above paragraph clarified my position in response to your question: ‘We are at a loss to understand why you have sought to recover, what appears to be, overdraft interest from our client and, in addition, 8% interest per annum upon the interest.’

My allocation questionnaire is due imminently, If I haven’t received a response from yourselves by Friday I will be filing and require another £100 to settle my claim. I can be contacted on mobile: ***********, email: *@*.com, or postal address as detailed above.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

***** ************

Andy.

 

 

:D :D :D :D :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

and just so you know andy, that's all 5 of the bright sparks i asked back now with same response.

good letter! are you going to ring the court friday and ask for ext. or go ahead and file and then worm the extra 100 out of them?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just amended and faxed to Rachel. I wont be trying to write letters at work again!!! 100% attention needed I think. Cant wait for tomorrow night, going to complete the aq, hopefully I wont need to send it but best get it ready.

 

One other thing.... as I have revised my claim and took off the 1 charge prior to jan 2001, do i need to send new copies of my claim to the court and let them know that the amounts have been adjusted?

Andy.

 

 

:D :D :D :D :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

No, I would'nt worry. This is merely the process of negotiating a settlement - no need to inform the court.

Please remember to DONATE! Help CAG keep up the fight!

 

 

Any advice or opinion is offered informally & without liability. Use your own judgment and if in doubt seek advice of a qualified and insured professional.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just had a letter from DG. An interesting read looks like they are not shifting. Wondering what your views are.......

 

'Thank you for your letter.

We note your comments in relation to the debit interest applied to your account whilst it was in state of overdraft.

 

We have reviewed the historic statements with out client and do not concur with your comment that the overdraft charges incurred were the sole cause of the overdraft interest being applied to your account. From our review of the statements, it can be seen that the account was conducted in a manner that, even without the charges applied, debit interest would be incurred by you. Debit interest was applied to your account by our client when the account was heavily overdrawn, not by sole virtue of the alleged unlawful charges being applied to your account.

You have also failed to address the point on our previous letter and have not confirmed to us the legal basis, with supporting case law, of your claim in respect of debit interest. For the avoidance of doubt, your claim in respect of debit interest is denied by our client.

 

The letter goes on to say that the previous off is still on the table. I am beginning to think that I have filled the spread sheets in wrong, or is this a new approach?

Andy.

 

 

:D :D :D :D :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

i'd pm phoenix, crusher, bong and a couple of others to get around and take a look if i were you. gary h, lively lad and hagenuk are also good for getting an opinion. any of the mods and site helpers - you need some feedback - send a pm with a link to your thread and ask for their advice.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Andy, as long as you are sure that the interest you are reclaiming was caused by the charges then you will be ok and they are just trying it on. You can tell them that had the charges not been applied then the overdraft would not have been so high and the overdraft interest would have been proportionately lower (it doesn't require any case law in support). I haven't checked back through your thread - did you use a spreadsheet to apportion the interest charges in relation to the penalty charges in this way?

Link to post
Share on other sites

im as sure as i can be. I used vampress's spreadsheets and put the balance in and amount of interest.

 

2 thoughts...

 

firstly.

 

I can kinda see there point, there arguing that i would still have gone over drawn without the charges so the interest is fair and reasonable.

 

secondly

 

Where are they going with this line. From what I can gather they will never let this go to court, so why take the line they have. If they always settle why do they protest so hard.

Andy.

 

 

:D :D :D :D :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

i think to scare you off. personal opinion here - make no mistake - they know by the letters who is getting their info on this site - it may not make a big difference to the coffers if they can get you to take a bit less - but they KNOW that it has a knock on effect (oooooh, did you see that - that's scary i don't think i'll bother after all, ooooh , i better take the first offer they come back with no matter what - i couldn't be doing with all that), i'm not trying to put any pressure on - but i think at least in part - it's to scare off every person reading your thread - look at your thread today - 637 views to date. how many of those are going to back off if they see dg being stubborn - conversely - how many will see it through if they see you go on to stick it to them. you've got some power behind you here - think if you were going it alone - unless you thought you were some frustrated lawyer - you'd have caved by now, right? you had that first letter and i asked 5 people to take a look and give a thought - how many did - 5! (i got pm's back from all 5). i'm just trying to tell you, i think you can do this - and aceades too - hope you are watching!

use who you need to to get what you need to stick to it. me, i'm in charge of the prayer circle!

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...