Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • Daft question - but you filed the defence on-line on MCOL as dx indicated, right?
    • We looked up the e-mail address so communications would be in writing.  If you do stuff on the phone the other party can just deny the contents of the conversation.  They can't deny what's written in an e-mail. So time to sort Pete out.  Check the following for accuracy and change anything I've got wrong.  Then e-mail Pete this evening.  I was thinking of threatening the pub with legal action but let's initially be nice.   Dear Pete, Re: PCN no.XXXXX, claim form no.XXXXX on 23 July 2022 I was a customer at your pub and I attach proof of purchase. I was picking up my cousin Ms XXXXX and her family as she was working as a cook with you at the time.  I entered the pub through the back door, went to the bar, and ordered a drink and a meal.  At no point did any bar staff alert me that I needed to add my registration number or did I see any signs advising me to do so.  I then took a seat outside in a small seated area so I could chat to my cousin while waiting for her to finish work.  We were joined by the management of the pub and bar staff during my time waiting  I was shocked a few days later when I received a demand for £100 from Civil Enforcement Ltd.  i contacted the pub and was told "don't worry, it's not enforceable". Well, that information turned out to be nonsense because I have now received a county court claim form from CEL. I contacted the pub again on XXXXX and was extremely disappointed to be told "there's nothing we can do". Of course there is something you can do.  You are the organ grinder.  You called CEL in.  You can call your dogs off.  Your pub has absolutely superb reviews on Google Maps regarding the way in which you treat guests.  Do you really think customers should be dragged to court?  I'm sure you don't. I am therefore requesting that you intervene and instruct CEL to cease court action. Yours, XXXXX
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Harlands/Xercise4Less


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 2960 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Hi all,

 

Another victim of Harlands here! Was following slick's outstanding advice and thought everything was going well but having read a few horror stories I thought I'd check what my next move should be.

 

Long story short:

Cancelled my direct debit after 11 months, not 12 (oops). This was the end of April.

 

Got the Harlands "you didn't pay your May instalment so now owe us two months' subscription plus a £25 default fee" letter on 18 May.

 

Panicked, rang around a bit, told the X4L branch on the phone I wanted to cancel, was referred to the X4L membership team (in another office - Leeds?) who agreed that I could cancel if I paid a £29.99 on-the-spot admin fee - I asked for a full breakdown of this admin fee and the best the manager could do was that it was "for contacting Harlands". I thought "hang on, this sounds a bit dodgy", I want to find out more about this...

 

...and Google sent me here!

 

18 June I got the Harlands "you owe us three months' subscription plus a £50 default fee" letter.

 

Checked my direct debit email they sent me and it contains these lines...

You are committing to a single £0.00 admin fee payment and £9.99 per month for a minimum of 11 months. [Only 11 months?! WINNER!]

Your first payment will be collected on or just after 16 June 2014 for an amount of £9.99 which consists of a joining fee of £0.00 and the first monthly payment of £9.99.

Subsequent monthly payments of £9.99 will commence on 16 July 2014 and continue on or just after the same day of each month thereafter.

 

I pinged off this in reply (I hope it is OK! Sent recorded delivery)...

I refer to your letter dated 18 June 2015 regarding my former membership of the Xercise 4 Less gym.

 

I cancelled my direct debit mandate at the end of April 2015 as is my right under the direct debit guarantee. This was adequate notice of my intention to cancel, and was after the 11 month commitment prescribed in the terms of my membership. Please see the attached email from SnapDDA, a trading style of Harlands Services Ltd, confirming the payment schedule of 11 monthly payments from 16 June 2014 to 16 April 2015.

 

As such no further payments are required from me. I expect no further demands from Harlands Services Ltd.

 

Please liaise with Xercise 4 Less to ensure that my cancellation is noted on all relevant systems. Obviously in your role as the administration company for Xercise 4 Less you are subject to the legal precedents stipulating that you process cancellations (see the 2011 High Court case OFT v Ashbourne Management Services Ltd) and have an obligation to act upon such notices.

 

Wasn't expecting to hear anything from them but got a letter saying...

 

We cannot cancel the agreement you have with X4L as they deal with them directly at the branch. You must either contact them in store or over the phone to cancel the agreement. We strongly advise that you get this confirmation in writing...[blah blah blah]

 

You will need to send this information to X4L directly as we do not deal with cancellations.

 

[branch contact details]

 

We will await to hear from you regarding a cancellation.

 

Now I'm confused. Next move, anyone?

 

(Just FYI when I get Harlands off my back I'm totally donating my £25 admin fee to this site - brilliant work, helped me loads already, thank you!)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Welcome to CAG...

Youll see that I also pretty much float around here quite a lot.

 

So essentially you have completed your minimum term?

 

Right... Well Slick can answer if you like but Id just send an email saying...

 

Dear Sirs

 

I refer to the correspondence we have recently had. I would like to advise you that i consider my membership terminated.

However, I am willing to pay 1 final payment to equate to the months notice required to cancel the account.

 

Please be advised this offer is open for 14 days. Beyond that date, I will not correspond with you relating to this account and I will deem any further correspondence harassment and will be reported to the relevant authorities.

 

Kind Regards

FKO

 

Remind them that their penalty fees are not enforceable.

 

We could do with some help from you.

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

**Fko-Filee**

Receptaculum Ignis

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi QB and welcome to CAG

 

I've not heard of an 11 month agreement before so we may need to play this differently.

 

Checked my direct debit email they sent me and it contains these lines...

 

Was this sent to you by Harlands or by X4Less ?

 

Assuming it was Harlands, I would now write to X4Less by letter saying :-

 

I cancelled my DD mandate at the end of April 2015 after paying the minimum 11 payments to which I agreed.

 

Harlands are now chasing me for membership fees and admin fees which I do not owe.

 

I require that you contact Harlands and instruct them to make no further demands.

 

Send by post and get a free Certificate of Posting from the PO counter.

 

Or take 2 copies of the letter to the gym and get a staff member to sign one copy which you'll keep as proof of delivery. Leave the other copy with the gym staff.

 

Ignore Harlands for now - all they can do is Huff and Puff, and then get CRS to pester you. Of course, CRS are Harlands using CRS paper at the next desk !!

 

It may be that you need to offer a final payment of just £9.99 but we'll see ............

 

:-)

We could do with some help from you

                                                                PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

                                            Have we helped you ...?  Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Please give something if you can. We all give our time free of charge but the site has bills to pay.

 

Thanks !:-)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi QB and welcome to CAG

 

I've not heard of an 11 month agreement before so we may need to play this differently.

 

 

 

Was this sent to you by Harlands or by X4Less ?

 

Assuming it was Harlands, I would now write to X4Less by letter saying :-

 

I cancelled my DD mandate at the end of April 2015 after paying the minimum 11 payments to which I agreed.

 

Harlands are now chasing me for membership fees and admin fees which I do not owe.

 

I require that you contact Harlands and instruct them to make no further demands.

 

Send by post and get a free Certificate of Posting from the PO counter.

 

Or take 2 copies of the letter to the gym and get a staff member to sign one copy which you'll keep as proof of delivery. Leave the other copy with the gym staff.

 

Ignore Harlands for now - all they can do is Huff and Puff, and then get CRS to pester you. Of course, CRS are Harlands using CRS paper at the next desk !!

 

It may be that you need to offer a final payment of just £9.99 but we'll see ............

 

:-)

Nice one from Slick there.

 

We could do with some help from you.

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

**Fko-Filee**

Receptaculum Ignis

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Update from X4L...

 

Although the minimum number of payments may have been made by your self we still require 30 days written notice of cancellation from yourself in club.

 

Having cancelled your contract will have triggered an automatic charge from Harlands as we cancel down your DD via our head office and Harlands upon written notice of cancellation from yourself.

 

Therefore Harlands will still require the 30 days notice (1 months gym payment) to cancel down completely and stop chasing, this is the cheaper option than the cancelled DD charges.

 

If you need any further explanation please contact me in club.

 

No idea what he's on about there! What's my next move?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi QB,

 

Because the agreement was for a minimum of 11 months, and was not described as an 11 month agreement, I think the gym is reasonable to require the 1 month's notice.

 

Next move is to offer to pay £9.99 to settle in full. Letter to Xercise4Less again :-

 

I refer to your letter/email of xxdate.

 

To finalise this matter, I am willing to pay £9.99 to Xercise4Less in full settlement of all that I owe.

 

I will pay you promptly when I have your written confirmation that :-

 

1. You will accept the £9.99 in settlement of all that I owe.

 

2. You will inform Harlands that the matter is closed and they must make no further payment demands.

 

Keep us informed.

 

:-)

We could do with some help from you

                                                                PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

                                            Have we helped you ...?  Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Please give something if you can. We all give our time free of charge but the site has bills to pay.

 

Thanks !:-)

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

So, no response from X4L and I thought this had gone away! And then...

 

Letter from the Harlands-at-another-desk people CRS...

 

Your balance of £104.97 is now due by 4 October 2015.

 

...Under your agreement with Harlands you have promised to pay this debt. If you continue to refuse to honour that commitment Harlands will have no option but to take legal steps to collect the outstanding balance...

 

So the good news that sounds like they consider my gym membership cancelled. The bad news is they are now fishing for as much money as possible. Was considering a letter along the lines of...

 

  1. You cannot take any further action on this as the amount is in dispute
  2. I am willing to make a payment of £9.99 in full and final settlement. This constitutes one month's notice.
  3. I consider any additional charges from yourselves to be punitive illegal penalties

Am I in the right ballpark or should I be doing something else?

 

Cheer in advance,

QB

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 5 months later...

OK, this never went away (I kept getting threatening letters and the amount went up and up) and I wanted to give as much information as possible as I have taken legal advice that I think people in a similar situation may find useful.

 

  1. The FCA cannot help or investigate Harlands in my case since a) My membership was not a Consumer Credit Agreement (CCA) but a Membership Agreement and therefore unregulated, and b) Harlands' credit license lapsed in late 2015 so they are no longer regulated by the FCA.
  2. Trading Standards agree that this is dubious practice and certainly sounds unfair, but is within the realms of the contract so they will not intervene. They deem that there is insufficient evidence of charges being large enough to be considered penalty charges.
  3. Trading Standards recommended going through ADRS resolution services who cannot help as they do not take on consumer issues.
  4. I have seen no evidence of anyone on here escaping charges. Repeatedly ignoring letters leads to escalation and further charges.
  5. In my case if I don't pay then the only option is to either take it to court myself (claiming Harlands have breached contract by refusing to cancel my agreement) or let Harlands pass it on to further collections agencies (risking costs and a CCJ in the event that it goes to court).
  6. This has been going on long enough and it is the opinion of the legal professionals that I have spoken to that it will be cheaper to negotiate a payment with CRS/Harlands than go to court.

 

They're total f-ing sc*mbags but they've won here. I rang them and got the £180 fee knocked down to £75. Could have saved myself time, money, and stress just paying half of that straight away, but £75 is far, far cheaper than solicitors/court fees/risk of a CCJ. Yes it's Harlands intimidation tactics, but what they're doing is legal so I have to suck it up.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi QB and thanks for the update.

 

We have seen only one single case go to court in the past 5 years or more. And that case was withdrawn when challenged by Defence last year. We continue to support Site Users in challenging Harlands/CRS charges and tactics.

 

If you are happy to have the matter ended by paying, then that's fine.

 

Did you get agreement in writing that the £75 would be accepted by Harlands in full settlement of the matter.

 

:-)

We could do with some help from you

                                                                PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

                                            Have we helped you ...?  Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Please give something if you can. We all give our time free of charge but the site has bills to pay.

 

Thanks !:-)

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...