lowell joined 3 debts [2 mobile, 1 credit card]made me BK, now want my house!!

[wendyboats]

Evening all,

I intend to secure a Barrister who knows his business tomorrow, and await court in London to write me soon with next move, will keep you all updated,

Regards WB aka Watson still on the case xxxxxxxxxxxx

[Desperate Daniella]

Hi wendyboats,

 

Any update on the barrister?

 

DDxx

[wendyboats]

Hi wendyboats,

 

Any update on the barrister?

 

DDxx

 

 

Hi DD

 

 

Still looking into one have found some local barristers, also I am awaiting to hear from appeal court re: paying for transcript and refund of fee.

 

 

I had to fill in the forms again as I had sent wrong ones but all done now ,

I have a choice of 8 or so barristers who have been appointed at least 10 years and are specialist in bankruptcy.

 

 

I intend to keep looking a bit longer, may over weekend, and then I will contact some to find out their prices.

 

 

Still been viewing all posts here and I also have made a complaint regarding the solicitor that acted for my first appeal.

 

 

Will keep you all updated as soon as I hear anymore,

 

 

Warm regards to you DD and our dear friend Mouldy, and all here at CAG xxxxxx WB aka Watson still on the case ! xx

[wendyboats]

Hi every one received this from courts today. I need help as to what it means I need to do next I only have seven days to do all this so appreciate quick response guys xxw aka Watson still on the case xx

[unclebulgaria67]

Reasons for the delay in appealing after the courts decision of 17/7/13 ? I presume that any appeal must be made within a certain period of time. Given the delay in appealing what prejudice you may or will suffer given the delay in you appealing.

 

To be honest this sounds like the Judge finding technical grounds not to hear the appeal. This is where, you will need someone with the knowledge of all the relevant court/process rules.

[unclebulgaria67]

My amateur reading of this, is that you had 21 days to notify Southampton County Court that you wanted to appeal to the High Court. Outside of the 21 days you have go through the process of explaining to the court and the respondent (Trustees/Lowell) why you are making this appeal so late in the day. It is then up to the Judge to decide whether there should be a hearing to discuss this late application to appeal.

 

I have alerted the site team to see if they can get any legal bods to look in. Unfortunately The Mould has not logged into CAG for a few weeks. ( I hope he is OK)

[wendyboats]

My amateur reading of this, is that you had 21 days to notify Southampton County Court that you wanted to appeal to the High Court. Outside of the 21 days you have go through the process of explaining to the court and the respondent (Trustees/Lowell) why you are making this appeal so late in the day. It is then up to the Judge to decide whether there should be a hearing to discuss this late application to appeal.

 

I have alerted the site team to see if they can get any legal bods to look in. Unfortunately The Mould has not logged into CAG for a few weeks. ( I hope he is OK)

 

 

Thanks Uncle

 

 

I shall await advise from all here and I too hope Mouldy is well. wb aka Watson on the case x

[Guest]

wendy

what was the gist of your 3 applications mentioned in that order #879? did you apply to vary the appeal time limit, and also stay?

the insolvency rules (part IV, para 19) say appeal to high court re a cty court matter and refer to cpr 52.3 on re appeals, note also 52.4, .6 (variation), .7 (stay), and associated practice directions.

anyway, you need to comply with the order if continuing.

haven't read thread so excuse if wide.

[mjt2013]

I also have not reread the thread but in essence the judge has looked at the file and immediately wants to know 2 things before the case is considered further:

 

Why didn't you appeal within the timescale provided by the rules?

 

Why should a stay be granted to you particularly when generally stays are not granted pending an appeal?

 

I hope this helps.

[steampowered]

You have until next Monday (24 February) to provide:

 

 

(1) written reasons for your delay in seeking an appeal

and

(2) if you are seeking a stay (which means delay - are you seeking a delay of enforcement of a previous court order?), reasons why the stay should be granted, and what damage/problems/issues you would suffer if the stay is not granted.

 

 

You need to try and get this together and into court on Monday. I don't think you need anything too long, given the circumstances just a letter should be fine.

[wendyboats]

wendy

what was the gist of your 3 applications mentioned in that order #879? did you apply to vary the appeal time limit, and also stay?

the insolvency rules (part IV, para 19) say appeal to high court re a cty court matter and refer to cpr 52.3 on re appeals, note also 52.4, .6 (variation), .7 (stay), and associated practice directions.

anyway, you need to comply with the order if continuing.

haven't read thread so excuse if wide.

 

 

Hi Ford thank you for your input,

 

 

I applied for a application notice (N244) to look at my case, if I had grounds to a late out of time appeal, it was sent up to London and I had to file a appellant's notice N161 to appeal and my reasons why. I then received a letter saying I had not done a N244 and had to resubmit all again.

 

 

I also applied for help with paying for Transcript, I received back sealed copies to send to the respondents, and now I have received this letter.

 

 

I am wondering if this has been raised by the respondents to the Judge?

 

 

I am also after guidance on how to do this, in respect of a template being needed or do I just write it in my own words ?

 

 

Also do I send all copies to Judge to seal and return for me to serve this, or do I just send them all recorded delivery of my reply ?

 

 

Kind Regards Wendy aka Watson still on the case xx

[wendyboats]

I also have not reread the thread but in essence the judge has looked at the file and immediately wants to know 2 things before the case is considered further:

 

Why didn't you appeal within the timescale provided by the rules?

 

Why should a stay be granted to you particularly when generally stays are not granted pending an appeal?

 

I hope this helps.

 

 

Thank you for this advice and I understand his request wb x

[wendyboats]

You have until next Monday (24 February) to provide:

 

 

Do you mean Friday the 28th ? I only received yesterday dated 19th, you do not count weekends I believe.

 

(1) written reasons for your delay in seeking an appeal

and

(2) if you are seeking a stay (which means delay - are you seeking a delay of enforcement of a previous court order?), reasons why the stay should be granted, and what damage/problems/issues you would suffer if the stay is not granted.

 

 

I am asking for him to deal with my appeal against both of the decisions made by the district Judge and overturn Bankruptcy ruling .

 

You need to try and get this together and into court on Monday. I don't think you need anything too long, given the circumstances just a letter should be fine.

 

 

So I keep my reasons brief then? Do I send copies directly to Respondents via recorded delivery in my own words, and not to Judge first to seal ?

 

 

Thank you for advice thus far, Regards Wendy x

[wendyboats]

wendy

what was the gist of your 3 applications mentioned in that order #879? did you apply to vary the appeal time limit, and also stay?

the insolvency rules (part IV, para 19) say appeal to high court re a cty court matter and refer to cpr 52.3 on re appeals, note also 52.4, .6 (variation), .7 (stay), and associated practice directions.

anyway, you need to comply with the order if continuing.

haven't read thread so excuse if wide.

 

 

I applied for a N244 and then had to do a N161 and then another N244 and also applied for help via public funding for transcript of lower court hearing. Sent off sealed copies to Defendants and respondents and heard nothing until yesterday.

 

 

I am wondering if this has been put to Judge by them?

 

 

Regards Wendy x

[wendyboats]

Evening all

 

 

I have spent most of today investigating what I have to do and how to write the reasons for my appeal, firstly is their a template I can use as a guide ? As it states it has to be written in a certain way or could be rejected!

 

 

My human rights to defend my case are top of the list, but what else should I include ? or leave out ??

 

 

Can anyone help me on this part please ? I see forum is busy with new and old cases, but would appreciate anyone who knows my case giving advice on this.

 

 

Thanks in advance WB aka Watson still on the case xxxx

[unclebulgaria67]

Wendy

 

You will just have to state your case as best as you can. The point is that it was the same Judge who dealt with the appeal at Southampton that dealt with the original bankruptcy petition. You did not have the opportunity to defend the original bankruptcy, as the petition was sent to an address you were not resident at the time. When you did appeal unfortunately, you could only afford a Solicitor and trainee Barrister, who failed to make any case, as the Judge showed little interest in hearing the appeal. It was dismissed, without any proper assessment of the merits of the issues that were raised. Then go onto all of the issues, most particularly that there was a dispute that the debt was actually below the threshold amount for bankruptcy etc etc.

 

My reading is that you have to make the case that the Judge at appeal in Southampton did not allow a fair hearing. It would be hard to make a case about them not following correct procedures, as I am not sure you or I have the knowledge.

 

The bit about the delay in appealing to the High Court is more difficult. What did the Judge at appeal say about appealing it anyfurther ? You could mention the personal difficulties you are going through and with limited funds, how difficult it is to find legal counsel who are willing to take on such a case.

[wendyboats]

Wendy

 

You will just have to state your case as best as you can. The point is that it was the same Judge who dealt with the appeal at Southampton that dealt with the original bankruptcy petition. You did not have the opportunity to defend the original bankruptcy, as the petition was sent to an address you were not resident at the time. When you did appeal unfortunately, you could only afford a Solicitor and trainee Barrister, who failed to make any case, as the Judge showed little interest in hearing the appeal. It was dismissed, without any proper assessment of the merits of the issues that were raised. Then go onto all of the issues, most particularly that there was a dispute that the debt was actually below the threshold amount for bankruptcy etc etc.

 

My reading is that you have to make the case that the Judge at appeal in Southampton did not allow a fair hearing. It would be hard to make a case about them not following correct procedures, as I am not sure you or I have the knowledge.

 

The bit about the delay in appealing to the High Court is more difficult. What did the Judge at appeal say about appealing it anyfurther ? You could mention the personal difficulties you are going through and with limited funds, how difficult it is to find legal counsel who are willing to take on such a case.

 

 

Thank you Uncle for the above advise,

 

 

I am writing this up later this evening , and I shall include all the points you have kindly suggested here.

 

 

Kind Regards Wendy x

[mjt2013]

The recent directions are not an opportunity for you to go all out on the merits of your appeal. 2 specific questions need to be answered and your best bet is to just answer them. If you give the court chapter and verse it will have to pick through to find the answer and you risk it refusing to do so.

[steampowered]

I agree with mjt2013 on this. I would also steer clear of talking about human rights and I would steer clear of too much criticism of previous hearings. It is important to stick to the questions actually asked by the judge - i.e. the delay was due to difficulty in obtaining legal advice, I imagine.

[wendyboats]

I agree with mjt2013 on this. I would also steer clear of talking about human rights and I would steer clear of too much criticism of previous hearings. It is important to stick to the questions actually asked by the judge - i.e. the delay was due to difficulty in obtaining legal advice, I imagine.

 

 

Morning Steampowered,

 

 

Thank you for advice,

 

 

Have not started my reply yet, doing this after school run, and will if I have time upload my answers to the two questions asked.

 

 

I feel its best to follow the views as above and stick to the main reasons for delay.

 

 

Will be back on line in a while if anyone else can offer anymore advice . WB AKA Watson still on the case xx

 

 

PS. Hope Mouldy and DD are both well, miss their input xxxx

[steampowered]

Sorry, realised I didn't answer your question about time.

 

Do you mean Friday the 28th ? I only received yesterday dated 19th, you do not count weekends I believe.

 

I'm afraid this isn't correct. Under Part 2.8 (4) of the CPR available at http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part02#2.8, you only exclude weekends if the period is 5 days or less.

 

However it does say 7 days after receipt of the order. I guess when you actually received the order would have been a few days after the decision was made.

[unclebulgaria67]

If the Judge at Southampton County Court made no mention of any further appeal, what are the rules ? I have read that you are normally expected to appeal within 21 days. How can you do this, if you don't have the money and there is no legal aid/pro bono help to do this ?

 

From what Wendyboats said, the Judge at Southampton decided the original bankruptcy and did not really want to hear the appeal before them. Whether this is an accurate picture of what happened, the Judge at the High Court, will only know this, if they are provided with the full transcripts to go through. At the moment the Judge only appears to be interested in the time limits to make appeals and what the grounds are for an out of time appeal. Surely what the Judge is looking for is a more rounded argument that there are important issues that need to be looked into and not just that Wendyboats did not have the money and could not find any legal help ?

[steampowered]

UB - yes, the time for appealing is normally 21 days. The judge wants to know why wendyboats didn't meet that deadline which is why he is asking the question and the problem with finding legal help is presumably the answer to that. Wendyboats is out of time by several months so I think full details as to what exactly she has been doing since the order was issued is required.

 

Apologies if this has already been covered - it has been several months since I last read through all of this thread and even then I was a bit confused as to what exactly happened - but I do wonder if there is any merit in trying to reach an agreement with the creditor for repayment of the debt and subsequent discharge of the bankruptcy rather than continuing to fight through the court process. Just a thought.

[mjt2013]

If the Judge at Southampton County Court made no mention of any further appeal, what are the rules ? I have read that you are normally expected to appeal within 21 days. How can you do this, if you don't have the money and there is no legal aid/pro bono help to do this ?

 

From what Wendyboats said, the Judge at Southampton decided the original bankruptcy and did not really want to hear the appeal before them. Whether this is an accurate picture of what happened, the Judge at the High Court, will only know this, if they are provided with the full transcripts to go through. At the moment the Judge only appears to be interested in the time limits to make appeals and what the grounds are for an out of time appeal. Surely what the Judge is looking for is a more rounded argument that there are important issues that need to be looked into and not just that Wendyboats did not have the money and could not find any legal help ?

 

I cannot stress enough that the recent directions from the judge identified two preliminary issues that need to be determined before the actual appeal itself is considered. This is not the one and only chance for the OP to put her substantive case, unless the court decides that she shouldn't be given an extension of time to appeal.

 

The OP has not followed the rules and the judge just wants to know why at this stage.

[steampowered]

I agree with mjt2013. If the judge accepts wendyboat's reasons, most likely there will then be another order asking wendyboats setting down a hearing date and asking her to put forward the full reasons for her appeal within a certain time frame (if she has not done so already).